Concerned about son's year 2 teacher and grouping

[TheBFactor]

Hello everyone
I am new here.
I have a wonderful, witty, energetic, extremely bright boy who is a summer baby, hence one of the youngest in a class of 30. We have been told since Reception that he is "immature" and behind the rest since the day he started Reception. The class teacher was very positive at the beginning of this year and seemed to really "get" my son finally, but more recently they seem to have turned negative again. He does not have Special Needs, but has been persistently grouped (I think for both Literacy and Maths) with a SEN boy and 2 overseas children whose English ability is weak. I am told my son is doing very well in Literacy (although they say he does not appear to focus on his writing - according to the teacher it is becacuse he can't be bothered !).

The class teacher says his attitude makes him extremely "disadvantged" and predicted taht he will be "disadvantage" next year also. She then proceeded to name various children in the class and make direct comparisons with other children, telling me very personal and private issues about other children and their abilities.

I am an educator (higher education level) myself - it is against the confidentiality rules for a teacher to talk about other students in such detail and make direct comparisons. My son ought to be compared to an ideal "age group" not to others in the class. I have been keeping an eye on him this year as I do not wish to destroy his confidence. He is naturally an extrovert, confident little boy, but he has said on numerous occassions that he feels he is bottom of the class and that the other children think so too - a few have called him babyish and I wonder how much of that come's from the teacher's attitude towards him.

Luckily, because of his graet personality, he has close friendships with several other boys and seems to be happy at school, but I am really concerned as the school are very good at having one way dialogues with me, i.e. they talk, but never listen to anything I have to say about him. They seem to think they know more about him than I do and that their reasons for placing him in whatever group is absolutely right. The negative labelling of boys is quiet common at schools I'm afraid. The quiet, shy girls seem to get away with things and the boys don't. I'm trying to get my son out of the labelling scenario.

A boy and a girl have so far been pulled out of the same class. When I spoke to their parents they had similar concerns, the other boy was also one of the youngest. The girl's mother (the girl had a learning disability) said to me in private that her daughter's emotional well-being wasn't being addressed in this class. This rings alarm bells for me.

It's meant to be an Ofsted Grade 1 school, yet I hear things from others that are similar to my views, that they are more concerned about ticking Ofsted boxes than they are about the needs of individual children.

So what now? Do I pull him out and take him to another school which is less Ofsted glorified, or do I write to the Head (usually it's chats that are not written down so I want it written down) and ask for a written reply? Should I ask them to switch my son around as I see no justification why such a bright little boy (even they have admitted he is intelligent) is in the weakest group where he is not being stretched ?

The taecher says my son is NOT naughty - he has also never been accused of being aggressive, hitting or swearing (thank goodness as it woudl be untrue any way). For some strange reason (perhaps because the teachers have decided they doesn't like me for asking questions?) I think my son is very much on the teacher's radar so gets noticed more often for whatever he does (he has been sent outside the classroom on quite a few occassions on the most absurd reasons like switching off the light by mistake or carrying on with something when the teacher had asked him to stop and she had not waited for him to explain that he had not heard her!)
I noticed on a recent class trip that my son was told off more often than other boys, even though others were behaving quite badly by most parents/teachers standards my son was extremely well behaved. I see a lot of unfair treatment going on. He is on the teacher's radar while others seem to be below it and get away with things he can't. Please help.

What NC levels is he working at?
What are his predicted levels for the SATs this summer?

We are given extremely vague info on what they do each term - what they have said is that he is average/above average for reading, but she says he is below average for writing and maths, which I don't think is the case judging from other boys who are 6 months older than him in the same class.
She has a disorganised/random way to test spelling, so I can only suspect their assessment of his writing and maths are off as well, but I have no way of knowing and they don't show me documents to prove their point. I had teh same problem in Reception and Y 1.
I guess I have a right to ask for all his assessments so far?

'....carrying on with something when the teacher had asked him to stop and she had not waited for him to explain that he had not heard her!'

There is no excuse for that - he needs learn to to pick up the cue that everyone else has stopped, and he must too. And if this is the case, he also needs a hearing test.

Imagine having to wait for 30 children to explain that they hadn't heard you say 'stop'!

Stoat - is that the only point you picked up from what I said?

Not really, but I do think you appear to think your ds can do no wrong. I think most teachers would shudder at having a class of 'quiet, shy' girls - I know I would!

It looks as if he is on his own agenda - does as much as he feels like doing; stops only when he wants to stop,etc.

I think you can go two ways from here. Home educate, if you want him to continue this way, or make sure he starts to notice social cues and learns to conform.

Home educate him if you think itr would be better for him...how do you switch the light off by mistake?

I would be very surprised if a Year 2 teacher was carrying out random disorganised asssessments. At this stage of the year the teacher will have a very good idea of their NC level. The children also have predicted levels assigned to them in Year 1 as well as Year 2.

I tend to agree with stoat.

'The taecher says my son is NOT naughty - he has also never been accused of being aggressive, hitting or swearing (thank goodness as it woudl be untrue any way). '

You do seem to think your DS can do no wrong.

For instance their is a girl in my DS1 y2 class. He mum thinks she is perfect too. This week I had to speak to the teacher as she has been picking on my DS1. Nothing major but still she is apparently a 'little angel' if you talk to her mother.

What exactly do you want to happen?

I am not clear what you want as an outcome.

Do you want your child moved into a top group?

Has your DS actually complained he is being told off unfairly?

IMO him not conforming and packing away/stopping when asked as an example would present a problem if it is an ongoing thing.

I think I would be writing a letter to the head, asking for a written copy of their assessments with a follow up meeting after you have had time to review them.

Then you can ask for their justification of the placing he has within the class (seems odd to me if he is average/ above average reading), unless the class is particularly bright as a whole.

It may be useful to try andd place a positive slant at the meeting as you are looking for ways to help him progress and are not happy at present and ask them for the areas they feel could be worked on at home to help him. But I aslo feel that the head should be made aware that confientility has been breached by the teacher (not sure that can ever be given a positive slant )

I would like to know I had explored all the available options before moving / uprooting my child, but likewise I would not do nothing either.

Thanks, but to be honest for someone who hardly knows anything about me or my son, I think you are incredibly judgemental. I didn't come here to put my son and I on trial, I came for advice about how to
approach the school. My son is not on his own agenda. He does exactly as he is told and has made huge progress. He does not need a hearing test. He is a summer boy and it has taken him longer to get used to things than the those 6 - 9 months older than him.
He is simply not the taecher's favourite. Are you telling me that favouritism doesn't exist at primary schools? Because it does. I am an educator myself, I hear how nasty some teachers are in private about our Sixth Form students. They have favourites and the ones they can't stand are named in the staff room. I'm sure it comes out in the quality of their teaching.

Thankfully I am not one of them. I respect my students and always make sure that I treat them fairly. They respect me back and so my entire classroom managemnet style is based NOT on pushing people around and thereby putting them off education for LIFE, but on modelling respect. You get respect as a teacher ONLY if you treat your students fairly. Classroom management does not mean screaming at students. My son's teacher screams at them (by her own admission and by what my son says) both behind class doors and gets angry even in front of parents. This is bad teaching and it's unprofessional. I also happen to have a Grade 1 Outstanding for the quality of my own teaching, so I expect the same quality from the teachers at my son's school which has a Grade 1. In fact it is because I'm involved in education and the whole Ofsted thing that I'm so concerned.

The state system works against a lot of children out there right from the word go, especailly if you are not the shy sort under people's radar systems. There is no law that says all children have to be the same. The word CONFORM makes me shudder ! We forget that children have their own personalities (thank goodness !!) We all need to behave in society, but we do not need to conform when the system seems to be unfair and picks favourites.

I think you may be projecting your own agenda on to your son and his teacher.

I say that as an OFSTED graded outstanding teacher, if that helps.

Actually I work in primary schools and tbh I don't think favouritism is especially rampant.

Now you didn't say she was screaming at the class! That is not on.

If you want advice on approaching the school I would say initially ask for a meeting with the teacher and Head of Year. Ask for your DCs levels. TBH a child with a good reading ability can be in a lower group for writing or maths. It doesn't necessarily follow that they will be good at everything if they can read well.

If you are still not happy then I would ask for a formal meeting with the Head.

Oh and I am ofsted outstanding too

We should start a club

The OP is so busy that I can't quite work out what the problem is, exactly. Paragraphs would help.

'We all need to behave in society'

Exactly. We need to recognise social cues.

I'm not judging. You come across like you cannot accept that your son is ever wrong. Have you talked to him about not 'being bothered' to write?

He doesn't always do as he's told - he doesn't stop when he's told to, he's sent out of the room, etc.

I would question that he is 'doing very well' in literacy if 'he can't be bothered to write' and sits with the SEN/EAL group? It sounds like he is reading well and has an aversion to writing and is therefore not progressing 'well' in all areas literacy.

It might be worth discussing that with the teacher.

I didn't read your post as you thinking that your ds could do no wrong. I do think you are right though to wonder whether this school is the right place for him.

If these issues have been going on since Reception, what has the school actually been doing to try to solve the problems? It's nt enough for them to say what the issues are. They should be working with you and ds to look at strategies to deal with behavioural issues.

Alarm bells would be ringing at the news that the children needing most support are leaving or considering leaving. It sounds almost as though they are hoping that this will happen. I may of course be completely wrong about that.

In your position I think I would be looking elsewhere. Regardless of immaturity or behaviour, it's obvious that you have very little confidence in this school. Hopefully you will be able to find one that is better suited to you and your ds.

Good luck. :)

Sorry, I should have said that my last post was addressed to stoat.

Doris, thank you. There is another school in the local area with only a Grade 2 - 3, but I am told it has lovely teachers who really care about the children. I may investigate it any way in case things don't progress at the current school.

cece - my son has said on numerous occassions that the teacher simply shouts. If I did this at the place I teach I would be pulled up by my head of department (rightly so) for being unprofessional and having bad/non-existant classroom management. Teachers who shout do NOT know how to manage children/adults.

Again, I'm afraid it is easy to be judgemental about a child you have never met.

Coppertop - you have hit the nail on the head. The school is hugely oversubscribed, so the more who leave the better. Both childern's parents said to me in private that they had felt pushed out and the Head had simply backed up the teachers and was hugely unsympathetic.

Yes, I have not been able to trust the school or the systems in place since Reception. It probably is time to find a more child friendly school.

I would love to home educate, but circumstances don't allow it.

I apologise for the lack of proper paragraphing, I am new to the website.

I never said my son can't be bothered to write. That is the teacher's subjective analysis of the situatiuon.

We read, write and do maths at home. I taught him how to read, not the school. He left Reception and Year 1 with no reading ability and was unable to do simple maths. He is now working well through age relevant maths workbooks with me/husband at home.

He was/is simply not getting quality teaching or attention at school.

After 6 momths of working with him at home, he is reading books at the same level as his friends who are 6 months older.

I can't believe you're an educator and place so much store by ofsted.

Of course a school up the road which is rated satisfactory may be better than your outstanding school.

What is the % of kids in the school on the SEN register? If it is under 20% than alarm bells would be ringing for me. It is easy to get good SAT results if you drive out all SEN kids.

You clearly have concerns about the school, and investigating other nearby schools and finding out if they have places seems like a sensible move.

Sometimes a fresh start does work miracles.

I doubted you were an educator too...simply because you failed to use paragraphs!

Look I think the trouble is that your OP is a bit wishy washy...you're not complaining about anything other than your DS being pointed out as not particularly great at listening and the fact that he's sitting with SN kids.

Home educate or change schools, i don't see the point in you trying to get the teacher to change what group he is in if you are not happy with their teaching methods anyway.

energetic, extrovert can often mean pain in the arse to someone else sorry but have to agree it seems he can do no wrong in your eyes,
so probably best to change to somewhere where you feel you can support their teaching rather than the situation that seems to have evolved where you feel he is being picked on and you do not feel you can agree with this teachers assesment of your sons educational needs.

I second what indigo said... but OP seriously curious how do you switch the light off by mistake?

Not sure the OP would listen to the teachers assessment unless it was all positive points of course.
Nee dto look at his behaviour, setting some boundaries. He will continue like this whatever school he is at

They seem to think they know more about him than I do and that their reasons for placing him in whatever group is absolutely right.

but they do know more about him AT SCHOOL than you do. It always amazes me that parents seem completely unaware that children can be completely different in behaviour and attitude at home and at school. I once taught siblings where the parents were adamant in their view that their daughter was a little nightmare and would disrupt every class she was in whilst their son was a "real treasure". Actually it was the other way round at school, the girl was shy, reserved and, although a little demanding of attention, was a sweetheart, the boy was a minature thug!
Has it ever crossed your mind that their reasons for placing him in the said groups are absolutely right? Perhaps a parent or grandparent should come and change the systems and structures in your class because they feel they are incorrect!