So, apparently there are 5,000 bankers who will get million-pound bonuses this Christmas...

[edam]

wonder whether anyone would back my single-issue 'let's take it ALL off them and raise £5bn to pay off the national debt' party?

I have a 'gold plated public sector pension' myself. Which I probably won't get until I'm at least 70, And it will be worth bobbins by then anyway The Daily Mail still begrudges me it though.

Enough about that though. How are the party plans coming? Chocolate fountains are always messy fun

I actually feel spitting mad about this. Hundreds of people per week around the UK are still losing their jobs. Those who are left have to work twice as hard as before to pick up the slack.

And would like to say to any banker attached to a state owned bank who happens to be reading this thread 'go on, hop it off to abroad where they pay proper bonuses, like you're all always threatening to do'. There are plenty of redundant bankers who can replace you. And frankly I can't imagine they were doing a worse job.

And before some niggled banker/wife comes on to tell me I don't properly understand the workings of banks/global capitalism/market regulation and so on - oh yes I bloody well do.

Why aren't any of you making an effort to be seen to be doing the right thing? Voluntarily give some or all of your bonus back - and then tell the papers you did it, FFS.

Without the massive Govt rescues these banks would not exist and these people would have no job.

I used to work in the City and have nothing against fairly earned bonuses but none of these are fairly earned - they all depend entirely on tax payer bailouts and if these banks lose money next year and collapse again these bonuses will still have been paid and will never be recouped but tax payers will lose their investment.

This represents a rupturing of the social contract and it will cause civil unrest if it carries on and especially if ordinary people keep losing their jobs and taking pay cuts.

There seems to be a feeling in the banks that if you are used to being rich, you must carry on being rich even if you have to nick money off tax payers to do it and the government is colluding to a certain extent.
And that doing something wrong that would have made any other company go bust doesn't matter because the banks are too important to fail.
Why were these people not sacked? They are going to do the same thing all over again.

If bankers went and mugged people in the street and took their purses...we'd have a chance of prosecuting them (although rich people never get sent to jail) but as the money was handed over in a big lump by the treasury our come back appears to be nil.

The argument that you have to pay high wages otherwise everyone will leave is crap. There are only so many banking jobs on the market, it's not like they are short of applicants, is it?
The BBC pays about half what the commercial TV sector does, but they always manage to fill the jobs even though ITN would pay about double (note the number of top BBC executives who are women...is this because women are less motivated by pay?)

it makes me ridiculously mad too.
The idea that the bankers are soooo clever and soooo talented that they simply MUST earn million pound bonuses is beyond ludicrous.

There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that there are far more intelligent and far cleverer people working in Medicine, Education, Science, Politics even and they do not get (or demand) vast bonuses every year.

I hope to god AD calls their bluff and sticks to his guns and stops the bonuses. let those who want to leave, including the board, leave.

I think (hope) that once one bank has stood firm on bonsus, the sharedholders of the other banks will have more confidence to do the same and instead of bankers wages spiralling upwards for ever more they will start spiralling downwards.
And our bright graduates will stop being sucked into the city but work in other professions instead.

RBS announced only last month that significant redundancies will occur over the next two years.

One of my closest friends was just made redundant from there last month. After 17 years of service on around £17,000/pa.

But they deserve their big bonuses?

Do they fuck!

As UnquietDad used to say, 'And first against the wall will be . . .'

I read an article that said Wall St bankers are buying guns to protect themselves.

People are angry and frightened. Cannot believe a Labour Govt in the UK is standing by and letting these bonuses be paid.

Some people feel that if the law won't punish thieves like this that they'll take matters into their own hands.

I'm not at all surprised bonuses are being paid on this level.

Also, in some US cities, unemployment has reached 10%.

Because welfare benefits are very limited there and there is no governmental help with the cost of keeping your current home should you run into difficulty after job loss, many more are losing their homes there.

This must make some people very, very angry when they see the very people who made the mess and are still being bailed out by the taxpayer, getting big payouts.

Well, quite rightly.

Because it's wrong.

£850bn already.

And they want their fucking bonus.

shouldhaveletthemsink

Waves at expat
some good news in the rivers household!

May I guess?! Will there be a new Rivers joining you next year?! Lotto win? Promotion?

First off, I don't agree with the bonuses that are being paid out by RBS and Lloyds, but:

• Not everyone who works in banking is responsible for the crisis. There are a few IDIOTS who did some really stupid things, but please, don't tar us all with the same brush. Also, not all the idiots are bankers. For example, a lot of subprime mortgage reviews were outsourced to a company based in Chester. These people could not care less when reviewing mortgage applications and pretty much approved everything (I've seen - person who derived his income entirely from his marijuana growing, a £500,000 mortgage for an unemployed 19 year old, and so on). These are not toff-y bankers, but "ordinary" Britons who approved such applications
• If it wasn't for the tax contributions by banks, the UK would not have a lot of the money that it does have. At one point, the City was contributing 25% of the total revenues to HMRC
• If you pay this money out as bonuses, rather than retaining it as profits, a larger proportion is ends up being paid (around 40% vs. around 20%)
• The government is going to make money on loans given out. That is one of the purposes of a loan - you make interest on it. Once these banks' stock value picks up again, the government can sell their stake and make a profit. For example, when the government took a stake in Lloyds in March this year, the stock was trading at around £30. That same stock is now worth around £55, and this is after it has taken a hit in the last few weeks. The government has effectively doubled its investment.

and it's these idiots who want a big bonus.

new Rivers due end of march
am so pleased

sorry edam re hijack

Oh, hurray!!! That's the best news I've read all day.

I knew it!

HUGE congratulations .

And welcome back.

Good to 'see' you.

There is a glaring spelling mistake in the title, which needs pointing out.

The "w" appears to have accidently been substituted with a "b". Might need correcting.

Can I just check you are referring to banks which were bailed out? Not all banks? Or is this just an I hate you because you earn more money than me thread? And no, my DH does not work for a bank, bailed out or otherwise. But it's a fair point, no? Thousands of people have perfectly legitimate jobs in banks, work ridiculously long hours, haven't put a foot wrong in terms of loaning/trading morality and completely deserve their bonus which makes up a sizeable portion of their income.

Yes, I do know people who work for banks. But I can assure you, they put in a damn sight more hours than I do. Most people who come out with this smashing the bankers crap have no idea what they are talking about. Most of them are jealous that some people who made canny job choices in life are now earning more money than they are.

Where should the profits go instead? To charity? Dream on. If you make a ton of money for your employer, you deserve a bit back for yourself. I AM TALKING ABOUT NON-BAILED OUT BANKS HERE. But even the bailed out ones need top-calibre staff to get them profitable again. If they don't get paid properly here, they'll go elsewhere.

End of rant. Oh no, hang on, there's more... if you're so irresponsible as to lie about your salary in order to get a ridiculous unfeasible mortgage which you can now no longer pay - tough shit.

But RBS made the biggest corporate loss in British history this year! My firm isn't doing well this year, but my team is. However, even though I am in the office until midnight I don't get a bonus due to the firm performance.

Of course, if I worked for a bank I'd request a bonus from taxpayer's money....

The worst thing is that these same banks are giving staff advice on tax avoidance to escape the 50% tax rate. They have no shame.

How do you know this? Did they send out a press release saying "we're advising our staff on how to avoid tax".

Also, not all banks accepted tax payers money. For the US banks, they didn't have a choice (as the government didn't want to have some banks being targeted for accepting money, like has happened in the UK). For others, they didn't accept a cent. Nothing. Nada. And yet, you get all these bank-bashing threads and articles. Ludicrous.

You mean if you worked for RBS, HBOS or Lloyds, banks that have received tax-payers' money. If you worked for any other bank you'd be perfectly entitled to your bonus if it was being offered. I just wish people would understand that this is not about all banks, just a small minority.

I agree that dodging higher-rate tax is unforgivable. That really gets my goat.

CracklinRosie said "Where should the profits go instead? To charity? Dream on."

How about using some of it to repay the Treasury?