Rise of fascism... what, if anything, can decent people do?

[MrsBennetsPoorNerves]

Trump's victory is obviously alarming for many of us, but we've seen the rise of the far right in lots of places across Europe to a greater or lesser extent as well. History teaches us that bad things happen when decent people stand by and do nothing . So what, if anything, should those of us who are concerned about the rise of fascism be doing now?

Please note: if you're a Trump fan and don't agree that he is a fascist, this is not the thread to debate that. There are plenty of other threads where we can discuss that point, but this one is aimed at those who already accept that premise. Obviously, I can't stop you posting here, as it's an open forum and I don't get to police it, but I won't be engaging with any posts from Trump apologists on this thread because I don't want irrelevant debate to derail the main discussion.

Could you please define what you mean by the far right so we know what we are discussing? Thanks.

No, I won't be offering definitions on this thread. Those who are concerned about the rise of the far right will already know what it means.

Stop calling them idiots.

I’ve seen so many posts on social media today which just dismiss Trump voters as stupid, thick, shouldn’t be allowed to vote, etc etc. I’m not a Trump voter, but I know several. Newsflash: they’re not stupid. They might be misguided in my opinion, but they’re intelligent people with genuine concerns. Until politicians, the media, and other people, learn to genuinely hear and address their concerns, of course they’re just going to continue voting for the people who say what they want to hear.

Then there is no point in this thread if you refuse to define your parameters.

Ah so this is one of the 'anyone who has a different opinion to me is a fucking idiot, who should welcome me telling them they are stupid for their opinion, and should welcome me magnanimously telling them how stupid and wrong they are then happily do what I tell them'?

Exactly. It’s this type of political arrogance that has contributed to this defeat.

Thanks for this thread @MrsBennetsPoorNerves .

I think it's important to discuss – and not to allow people to shut down the discussion even though they may try.

Honestly, I'm not sure.
The key thing is the economy, but I'm not sure what ordinary people can do about that. That's the trigger- Hope for a better future...
Empathy, engagement and listening. Talk to people and engage?

Already shutting down discussion. You can only discuss what I say you can. Hmmm

Sorry, but the thread is intended to be a discussion for like-minded people who share concerns about the rise of the far right. I'm really not interested in debating what the far right is... the people I want to hear from will already know what it means, and the only reason that others might want a definition is so that they can argue the toss about semantics.

If you don't know I'm talking about, then this thread is not for you. There are plenty of other threads about Trump if you want to have a different discussion, or you can start one of your own.

But am also not going to tell you what I mean.. but you agree with me of course...😆

It's not specific to facism, but here's something I posted on another thread about what we can expect, in terms of management via media messaging.

Seared into my memory from the day Roe v Wade was struck down is that, within minutes, social media was chockers with messaging that when the Right does something that hurts people, it's the Left's fault for not stopping them hard enough.

It chimed so very closely with the Rules of Misogyny: that when a man does something bad, it's a woman's fault.

So now it's a pattern I can't unsee.

I expect to see a lot more of that.

I've also realised that, for some actors, it's not that they don't care that the population are angry with their actions, and nor do they try to minimise the anger: they're actively pleased at generating the anger because they are confident they will be able to redirect it onto a scapegoat they want to target. It's a win-win for them.

It can be direct, like anger over loss of abortion rights in the US. Or it can be indirect, like degrading public services and living conditions, then relying on the pressure cooker exploding when you offer your chosen scapegoat.

I want to try to stay alert when I notice "I'm getting feelings of anger", and pay attention to a) where the feeling is coming from, and b) who is trying to direct it.

Thanks @PerkingFaintly. I think it's very evident that people will try to shut down the discussion but I intend to ignore those posts as it will just derail the thread otherwise.

Maybe after this almighty shock, the parties who used to pride themselves on representing the "workers" will finally get their act together.

I think we need to have a discussion around free speech. Some of the far right rhetoric has been hate speech and some of the political parties have come out with extremist ideas and been allowed to flourish.

There's a debate to be had about the parameters of free speech.

Deregulation of businesses and unmitigated greed at the expense of worker's rights and the environment is also something that needs to change.

The divide between rich and poor is stark and it leads to unrest. Immigrants become a convenient scapegoat. In the UK tax payers money is used to subsidise low wages and cheap immigrant labour keep wages low.

Yeah, I think the economy is a significant factor, certainly. I'm not really sure how effective a strategy of listening and engaging actually is. I used to think that was important but I am gradually coming to the view that it doesn't make much of a difference. People who are sucked into the far right ideology don't generally seem interested in engaging in genuine debate, and if you listen uncritically, there is a danger that you just end up unintentionally seeming to validate their extreme views.

Er. It would be great to engage but you are the one who is not engaging!

Sorry...do you mean in the uk? I am in uk and not sure I can do anything about usa. Who do you mean in the uk?

The only plus I can take from this is that hopefully the UK government will at this point distance themselves from the US and align themselves more towards Europe/Scandinavia. It’s our only hope.

Which extreme views specifically?

yes, stop name calling, pretend to be high moral grounds and all that. Only will push people further to the right.

I think op meant for the uk.