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Pedants' corner

Just been sent this Giles Coren thing - thought I'd share with MN :) (Can't decide whether to applaud or stick pins in him)

227 replies

JustineMumsnet · 23/07/2008 23:40

As sent to Times subs...

Chaps,
I am mightily pissed off. I have addressed this to Owen, Amanda and Ben
because I don't know who i am supposed to be pissed off with (i'm assuming
owen, but i filed to amanda and ben so it's only fair), and also to Tony,
who wasn't here - if he had been I'm guessing it wouldn't have happened.
I don't really like people tinkering with my copy for the sake of
tinkering. I do not enjoy the suggestion that you have a better ear or eye
for how I want my words to read than I do. Owen, we discussed your turning
three of my long sentences into six short ones in a single piece, and how
that wasn't going to happen anymore, so I'm really hoping it wasn't you
that fucked up my review on saturday.
It was the final sentence. Final sentences are very, very important. A
piece builds to them, they are the little jingle that the reader takes with
him into the weekend.
I wrote: "I can't think of a nicer place to sit this spring over a glass of
rosé and watch the boys and girls in the street outside smiling gaily to
each other, and wondering where to go for a nosh."
it appeared as: "I can't think of a nicer place to sit this spring over a
glass of rosé and watch the boys and girls in the street outside smiling
gaily to each other, and wondering where to go for nosh."
There is no length issue. This is someone thinking "I'll just remove this
indefinite article because Coren is an illiterate cunt and i know best".
Well, you fucking don't.
This was shit, shit sub-editing for three reasons.

  1. 'Nosh', as I'm sure you fluent Yiddish speakers know, is a noun formed from a bastardisation of the German 'naschen'. It is a verb, and can be construed into two distinct nouns. One, 'nosh', means simply 'food'. You have decided that this is what i meant and removed the 'a'. I am insulted enough that you think you have a better ear for English than me. But a better ear for Yiddish? I doubt it. Because the other noun, 'nosh' means "a session of eating" - in this sense you might think of its dual valency as being similar to that of 'scoff'. you can go for a scoff. or you can buy some scoff. the sentence you left me with is shit, and is not what i meant. Why would you change a sentnece aso that it meant something i didn't mean? I don't know, but you risk doing it every time you change something. And the way you avoid this kind of fuck up is by not changing a word of my copy without asking me, okay? it's easy. Not. A. Word. Ever.
  2. I will now explain why your error is even more shit than it looks. You see, i was making a joke. I do that sometimes. I have set up the street as "sexually-charged". I have described the shenanigans across the road at G.A.Y.. I have used the word 'gaily' as a gentle nudge. And "looking for a nosh" has a secondary meaning of looking for a blowjob. Not specifically gay, for this is soho, and there are plenty of girls there who take money for noshing boys. "looking for nosh" does not have that ambiguity. the joke is gone. I only wrote that sodding paragraph to make that joke. And you've fucking stripped it out like a pissed Irish plasterer restoring a renaissance fresco and thinking jesus looks shit with a bear so plastering over it. You might as well have removed the whole paragraph. I mean, fucking christ, don't you read the copy?
  3. And worst of all. Dumbest, deafest, shittest of all, you have removed the unstressed 'a' so that the stress that should have fallen on "nosh" is lost, and my piece ends on an unstressed syllable. When you're winding up a piece of prose, metre is crucial. Can't you hear? Can't you hear that it is wrong? It's not fucking rocket science. It's fucking pre-GCSE scansion. I have written 350 restaurant reviews for The Times and i have never ended on an unstressed syllable. Fuck. fuck, fuck, fuck. I am sorry if this looks petty (last time i mailed a Times sub about the change of a single word i got in all sorts of trouble) but i care deeply about my work and i hate to have it fucked up by shit subbing. I have been away, you've been subbing joe and hugo and maybe they just file and fuck off and think "hey ho, it's tomorrow's fish and chips" - well, not me. I woke up at three in the morning on sunday and fucking lay there, furious, for two hours. weird, maybe. but that's how it is. It strips me of all confidence in writing for the magazine. No exaggeration. i've got a review to write this morning and i really don't feel like doing it, for fear that some nuance is going to be removed from the final line, the pay-off, and i'm going to have another weekend ruined for me. I've been writing for The Times for 15 years and i have never asked this before - i have never asked it of anyone i have written for - but I must insist, from now on, that i am sent a proof of every review i do, in pdf format, so i can check it for fuck-ups. and i must be sent it in good time in case changes are needed. It is the only way i can carry on in the job. And, just out of interest, I'd like whoever made that change to email me and tell me why. Tell me the exact reasoning which led you to remove that word from my copy. Right, Sorry to go on. Anger, real steaming fucking anger can make a man verbose. All the best Giles
OP posts:
Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 14:54

you'll need to wait a year for both Coren and Hammond - they're both born in 1969. Like me.

And if you dare suggest I am over 40 young lady I will come over there and kneecap you

unstressed syllable, let's see. A stressed syllable is what you get at the end of teh line as long as you read it out in an exact copy of Coren's accent.

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 14:54

I don't fancy Johnny Depp

I don't like skinny boys

Except Hugh Laurie obv

charliegal · 25/07/2008 14:55

Yeah, MP, now list the women .

I remember that you want to see Nigella Lawson in your kitchen NAKED.

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 14:55

mi you are so vulgar

it is just, you know, like so not about the money

you have been working for those corporate jargonistas for too long

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 14:55

oh really about Hammond? Is he SUCH a baby? Mind you I only fancy him because he reminds me of Davey Jones of the Monkees who was my first love

I'm supposed to be doing a Sage Reconciliation and I'm blathering here

someone fire me

BoysAreLikeDogs · 25/07/2008 14:56

I want Hammond for my key ring.

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 14:57

ermmm women on my no-no list

ermmm

Rachel Johnson

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 14:57

that bird who does the bunting website with the strawberries and the photography sessions

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 14:57

I want to see Nigella naked in my kitchen so I can satisfy myself that she is actually fatter than me

charliegal · 25/07/2008 14:58

I hear you.

Marina Johnson.

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 14:58

ah yes Davy Jones

he was so pink and fresh

charliegal · 25/07/2008 14:58

Tracey Emin.

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 14:59

Tracey Emin is all right

She wears fantastic underwear

motherinferior · 25/07/2008 15:01

All journalists I know write their copy, hand over their copy, trouser the money. Perhaps I hang out with the wrong sort.

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 15:01

OF COURSE! cake or death was Izzard

I have been saying it to the kids at coffee time for weeks and they just look at me

I had convinced myself it was Python

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 15:02

I always did MI

mind you the local farmers I served with my journalistic genius weren't really ones for the obscure homosexual puns

morningpaper · 25/07/2008 15:03

lol @ obscure homosexual puns

motherinferior · 25/07/2008 15:03

I concentrate on trying to sneak in Rolling Stones and/or Johnny Cash headers.

BoysAreLikeDogs · 25/07/2008 15:04

So funny

Have you seen this ??

I say Cake or Death all the time too

heh heh heh

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 15:11

oh this makes me weep

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 15:15

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xs-tl6GBOBo

BoysAreLikeDogs · 25/07/2008 15:16

Cappo, link again? the second one not working

Cappuccino · 25/07/2008 15:17

sorry bad day

BoysAreLikeDogs · 25/07/2008 15:28

I've not seen that before, howling with laughter.

LadyThompson · 25/07/2008 15:43

GreenElizabeth, GC is SOOOOO not gay.

A lovely man actually, though that email makes him sound psychotic.