Wife wants a third child and our life is unbearable

[Abc1237890]

We have two children aged 5 and 2. Our marriage is up and down - I have said for years that there are issues we need to address but my wife refuses to face up to these or to seek counselling. For the past 6 months she has said she wants another baby. I feel like I am done with that period of life now and are delighted with our two brilliant children. I am the main breadwinner and work full time and my wife has started doing flexible work in the past few months to help cover bills. We are by no means financially well off on one salary and live in a 3-bed house so practicality wise it doesn’t make sense to me to have another child.

My wife says that she has always wanted 3 children (this is not something we have properly discussed or agreed on) and now our lives are tainted by this disagreement - she is constantly miserable and lots of arguments, it feels like normal life is on hold and I can’t go on like this any longer.

What on earth should we do?

Er.........clearly sort out the "life is unbearable at the moment" issue first. THen and only then, if circumstances allow, should you consider bringing another human being into the mix.

I got the impression from the OP's first post that the idea of a third child has been within the last 6 months. It looks like it was the wife who moved the goalposts not the OP.

Yep, nos 2, 3 or 4 are always "surprise" babies 🤥

Where was that ever implied?

You didn’t talk about how many kids you wanted before getting married?

For the past 6 months she has said she wants another baby

It's in the OP's first post.

Where was it ever implied that the wife always wanted three children?

Where did OP say that?

He said she always wanted 3 children but that he wasn't aware.

Write a novel if you have such an imagination

No one is owed or entitled to x number of children, but every child is entitled to be wanted. I was one of those 'band aid' babies wanted by one parent, resented by the other pestered into it and my upbringing was very unhappy indeed. Not something I'd wish on anyone.

The OP must stand firm if he doesn't want any more and then divorce his DW if she continues to make life hell for everyone. If she is refusing counselling it suggests she isn't in the frame of mind for coming to terms with it.

Same here! We're not the norm, though.

Well, that's because having a baby is a sweet, nice thing, and because society needs babies (since we are an ageing society), whereas unwanted sex compromises another person terribly. A woman can raise a child completely on her own, and often does, but sex involves another person viscerally. They might both be hormone-driven, but they're really not the same thing at all.

I can't quite agree with your logic there.

I've never understood men or women whose actions are dictated by these primitive urges regardless of who gets hurt or the damage caused in the process.

Bringing an innocent baby into a bad marriage or where one parent begrudgingly agrees as a concession or bargaining chip is hardly a sweet and nice thing to do.

👏
I agree wholeheartedly.

I guess I really meant that the baby is a sweet and nice thing. Unless it's a grumpy baby?? 🤣

I agree re. the situation you mention, but apparently it's very hard to be rational when you're in the grip of baby fever. As I said, maybe that's why it's called a fever, because you take leave of your senses and start gibbering rubbish like "We have a one-bedroom house but we can totally make five kids work!!! All they need is love!!" 😆

I hear that the urge to reproduce can be so strong that it overrides everything and people can think of nothing else. I think this is what OP means when he says their lives are unbearable - because his wife is making a third the be-all and end-all, and is grumpy because she has this urge that isn't being satisfied. I had a rabbit like that. 😂 She became very out of sorts and hugely irritable and grumpy. Vet said she was experiencing the urge to breed. So we gave her a bunny boyfriend, and after she'd had a litter of babies, she was back to her normal self!

I also hear that baby fever goes away, so hopefully OP can white-knuckle through these hormones. He should probably get a vasectomy though - but not in secret!

A baby is not a sweet, nice thing if it’s born into an unhappy or abusive relationship, or abject poverty, or a war zone. Who said anything about unwanted sex? Men can sleep with many women on a fully consensual basis.

The baby itself is still a sweet, nice thing. And people have babies in all those circs that you mention, because reproduction is the most human of urges and tends to override all else. If it didn't, we'd have died out long ago. That's why the urge is so strong - it has to be, in order to override all else. War, poverty, famine, bad partners, earthquakes...the urge to reproduce is stronger than all of it! Which is quite 😱 when you think about it.

To be clear, I'm not saying that giving into the urge is a good idea!

As to your other point, yes, in theory a man can sleep with many women consensually, as you say above. But in practice, we all know that most men can't get the amount of sex they would like and that it falls to their partners to handle their drive. We all know that at least some of the time, men's approaches are unwelcome. And that's why we have the set-up that you mentioned - the female hormonal drive to have babies is a good thing and the male drive is frowned upon. The latter is often an imposition on another person, whereas babies benefit society.

Probably another reason that men's hormonal urges aren't treated the same as a woman's (for babies) is that the woman and child need the man to stick around and provide support. (I'm talking in evolutionary terms, not in terms of what actually happens today.) Also because stable marriage benefits society by providing a framework in which to bring up children. Imagine where we'd be if men could just got around freely shagging anyone who'd willingly have them!

Which brings me back to what I said above: Having babies and wanting to shag as many people as possible really aren't the same thing. There are good reasons why one is approved of and the other isn't.

Good God, that's quite a story!! Very interesting indeed.

Agree re. your last point. I would never do it, and I'm amazed that the woman I know who did it had the nerve. Luckily it's worked out really well for her, but talk about risky! I don't think there's any way of predicting how a man will react to a trick pregnancy. I wouldn't do it; not only is it wrong, but I'd fully expect that the man wouldn't want anything to do with me after taking away his agency about a decision that has an enormous effect on his life. She was fortunate.

Nope.

But what if in a (supposedly) loving marriage, your wife is on contraception (you think she is) and she betrays your trust by not using that contraception and not telling you?

The DH thinks he’s having protected sex! It’s hardly his fault if she doesn’t use it as agreed in their marriage.

Have you had an honest discussion?

I do not want anymore children, I love the 2 we have and very much feel that financially we can not afford a third… already you are having to pick up shifts to manage the bills, cost of living is getting worse, it’s u fair for 2 children to have a share a room, we’d need a bigger car, holidays would be financially impossible.. I can’t afford to give 3 children a secure future, if both of these want to go to uni it will be hard enough to manage!… etc…
what stands out to me is her refusal to attend counselling… likely because she knows they will side with you.. having a child is huge and both need to agree!!…

I would tell her you feel so strongly about it you’re considering having a vasectomy..

my question is - if the marriage has been ‘up and down’ for years.. why is there even a 2 year old ?… it sounds like you added a baby to an already fractured relationship…

Also are the current 2 both the same sex? Is her desire to have the opposite sex?

That said, I had a friend, she married and fell pregnant very quickly… quickly followed by a second…

she felt her family ‘wasn’t complete’ and eventually went on to have a third… which meant having a huge extension on the side of the house as the eldest and youngest were the same sex and wouldn’t have been fair to expect them to share a room!

then she still didn’t feel her maternal duties were done - so cue 3 dogs and constant puppies!!

Some women’s maternal instinct is very high, maybe her maternal need for a baby is so strong - she’s clearly unhappy and wants to be needed by a newborn…

You say she refuses counselling… I think you need to push this issue and tell her you’re going to go to counselling with or without her! And follow through!
maybe it will still help you even she refuses to go.. maybe once she sees you going and making the effort to save your marriage she will join you!!

Regardless of being married and having trust etc. the mechanics of reproduction remain the same. Any man who is sure he doesn't want any (more) children, ever, should take responsibility and get the snip or use condoms.

To your point about trust: The reality is that you're putting your destiny into the hands of another fallible human being. Who may or may not remember to take the pill, or know that a bout of stomach trouble can make it less effective, or forgets to book an appt in time to have their arm-rod thing changed. Or in whom their coil might have slipped out of place.

We are all responsible for ourselves. Anyone who doesn't take responsibility for their own body's reproductive functions cannot be too surprised when babies result.

If you don't want a baby, control your fertility.

There is no excuse for lazy men who want to have penetrative sex. He's not a victim. He's lazy.

Sex doesn't have to = baby. If it does, TWO people made it.

'I thought she was on the pill.' is as pathetic as believing 'He told me he'd had a vasectomy.'

Don't want a baby, have a vasectomy. Otherwise he might as well agree to number 3.