Does 50/50 actually mess kids up?

[Writer034]

I've two DC (13 and 15) and split up with my ex DH 9 years ago, so they don't really remember the time of us living as one family. He always insisted on 50/50 so we used to do 2/2/3 and then a couple of years ago changed to week on week off (to include weekends). My kids are, on the whole, ok and happy, bar normal teenage stuff. The relationship with my ex DH was brilliant for years, although it's been more strained in the last 6 months after he moved in his new GF and her DD into his house (but it's still ok, and we pop into each other's houses to drop kids off or drop stuff off, etc, and are chilled and friendly face to face).

But my kids don't seem to think of either place as their home.

They only ever say 'mum's house' and 'dad's house'. I know that's partly so they can diferentiate them, but I do get a sense that they don't feel they fully belong in either, because it's an even split. It's almost like 'both' for them means 'neither'.

For example, they'll ring me up and say 'is it ok if I pop round' (and do the same with their dad).

It doesn't matter how many times I've said 'this is your home, why are you asking?' They have their own keys of course. My DD (15) wanted to come here the other evening, but was worried about gate crashing on my DP and me. We were both like, what are you doing asking, it's your home?

(My DP adores her and she adores him back, so this is not anything to do with him personally. One year I had a Xmas party and, although both my DP and my ex DH were here, my DD spent most of the night glued to my DP as she really does love him a great deal).

Any psychologists on MN? What is your take and will my children be damaged by this view of, not two homes, but actually none? What do other 50/50 parents think and have you experienced this?

I think the way you can all three talk together, and she knows she is free to choose one to be her main home if she wants, is why it is working well for her.

Yes, I think people over emphasise the importance of happy parents because they understandably want to believe that what makes them happy is good for DC, but actually parents who stay together and live a good life, if not a happy romantic one demonstrate how important the DC are to them, creating security.

Children don't care if you're happy, they care if they're happy. Just like everyone else.

Of course if the parents are nasty together, the home isn't going to be a nurturing environment, but are those people going to create a harmonious shared arrangement or one where DC feel torn and obliged to hide it?

I wonder.

My Dad who is a very committed father and a bit of a feminist, but also a dinosaur (now 87) has always said that when couples break up it's much better for Dad to leave and never come back than to hang around "interfering".

I've always thought that was ridiculous, but from my work with teens, it does "feel" like that can be less harmful than two parents fighting to have equal involvement.

Hmm. I hated 50/50 because I wanted to see the kids more, but their dad wanted them 50/50 (even though he was often working long hours, etc and did the shitty thing of cutting back on his work only when he got a new partner.)

We did the birds’ nest for a few years pre-divorce. I didn’t love moving back and forth, but was happy to try it if that was better for the kids. What didn’t work so well was still being entangled with my ex, e.g., he would phone me to shout that he couldn’t find the kids’ school uniform. (I came and looked. It was in the wardrobe.) The old patterns persisted. Nesting wasn’t viable long term as the kids were still living in the soup of our toxic dynamic.

My kids, now grown-up, say they preferred 50/50 to us all living together. Which isn’t to say they loved it. It wasn’t easy for anyone. One of them says she liked how different it was at each house. I suspect she got a nicer version of me without her dad, and vice versa.

It is interesting that all the parents here are saying their DC love it and all the professionals, who are tasked with getting under the skin of children struggling, know children tell parents what they want to hear.

You can ask a child if they'd rather live with Dad FT, you can tell them you'd be OK with that, but they're not stupid, they know what you want to hear.

But of course "we" only see the ones who are struggling.

Also the shared responsibility for maintenance, cleaning etc must be very hard to manage?

I agree that it is problematic - but really I think if both parents are loving, it’s the best arrangement that can be made in the circumstances of a marriage/relationship breakdown. The alternatives are sadly worse, I think. My parents split when I was 14, they hated each other and we were pulled to and fro, we just wanted stability and above all to love them and be with them equally.

I was 50-50 from the age of four, one week at each house, and I don't think it messed me up.

What did mess me up was my dad's poor choice for a partner (borderline psychotic) and him leaving most of the childcare gruntwork to her, even though he'd battled for 50-50 custody.

I think it actually messed my brother up more because he was my step mum's son, growing up with a psychotic mother, and my own mum treated him very kindly (but obviously he didn't come with me when I went to stay with my mum). I got respite for a week but he had to live with her full time, and the added mental burden that it was his actual mum being the way she was - at least I could detach and had my own mum!

Your kids sound fine - I think just keep saying "you don't need to ask permission" but at the same time it's very lovely and polite that they have been asking before coming round :)

We've done this. XP moves in when I have to go away for work two or three nights a week for most of the year. I think it's been much better for the kids although I do feel my privacy has been affected (as XP has keys to my house etc years after we've split).

He's not great at seeing DCs in the times of the year when I'm not away for work - a bit Disney dad at best - and I don't really get childfree time when not working, but in our case it was better than moving the DCs.

I should say that this worked because we didn't fall out about practicalities. We were never the kind of couple who bickered day to day about things, so we can just get on with dealing with the DCs and writing lists of what needs to be done. If we'd not been able to do this, it would have been a disaster.

OP have you actually asked your DD if she’d prefer to spend most of her time in one house?

I was just coming on to post this exact arrangement - it’s by far the best for children, if both parents are sensible and can make it work.

Tho that would mean 3 properties needed and many struggle to pay for 2 let alone 3

as surely the separate parents aren’t going to share a home. And then if meet someone what happens to the partners the week they don’t have the kids

I have told her that if she wanted to, at this age she could choose, and I told her that if she wanted to go to her dad's I would of course miss her but would 100% support her and be happy as long as she's happy.
However. I don't know a) if she believes me b) if it would assuage her sense of guilt as she's a very concience driven child, which worries me at only 15 c) it may be totally different with her father, who already knows how to make the kids feel guilty even if they say something small to me (say, something that doesn't work in his household) and I advocate for them.

Just an example, so you know what I'm talking about, he drives a Porche and his new GF has a 5 year old child, who still uses a car seat. There isn't a lot of room in the back with two teenagers and a car seat and my kids have mentioned to me that it's a squeeze. I asked him whether there was any way around this, as kids were dreading any trips in the car. While he did ultimately sort it (he bought a van), he also said to the kids 'did you have to grass me up to your mother'. I'm not keen on how he frames them coming to their mum with a problem as some sort of disloyalty, and there are reasons they don't go to him (he dismisses them). But the kids love and adore their dad, so they're often referring to not wanting to hurt him, not wanting to upset him etc. So, I don't think my daughter would come to live with me, even if she really wanted to.

Our NDN has this set up with her ex and three older DC ( the youngest child belongs to her new husband). 2/2/3. I just think it's only a good set up for the adults - not children. Makes the adults lives convenient. That's about it. They live out of a backpack.

I think this nails it.
If the 50/50 was genuinely for the kids the parents would be the ones moving back and forth.
I can't imagine how awful it would be to feel that you don't have a place that's home.

I've been doing 50/50 with my ex for over 3 years and I don't think it works. The only person it benefits is my exH.

Our DD doesn't enjoy it and doesn't feel settled. To be fair to her Dad, she has her own room at his with everything she needs. She isn't carrying things back and forth, and neither of us have a new partner in the picture. Despite all this, she only wants to be at mine and is beginning to resent spending time there. She'd prefer to see him every other weekend and maybe one weeknight every week.

I believe he wants her 50/50 to avoid paying child maintenance. He loves having her, but I do think his main reasons are to avoid paying and because he likes to exert control. I've told him I wouldn't claim maintenance from him as I don't need his money, but he won't take my word and says she's half his so he's entitled to 50/50. DD is seven, and my solicitor said that I'd struggle to get main custody as exH is an involved father who wants to do 50/50 and doesn't pose a safety risk. I've been advised to give it a couple more years, and if she still wants to live with me then her feelings will carry more weight with the family court. I do believe she'll eventually live with with me more than 50% of the time, and I'm just bracing myself for the fallout when that time comes.

Stupid statement to make. I out earn my ex for a start but he contributes well to the running of the house that his children live in for the majority of the time. We make decisions as equal parents, we speak highly of each other to the children, but they have one stable home so they're not torn in half.

Yes I wouldn't want this as an adult either. It looks crap as a set up.

As parents we will always wonder about the other choices that could have been made along the way.ie what if you stayed with your partner and they were exposed to an unhappy relationship, what if their dad wasn't interested or involved as much as he is. What if you never met their father in the first place and met someone else you could have had a long happy marriage with.

There will always be a what ifs. Just focus on them as they are now and continue what you are doing. They sound happy and well balanced overall.

I think you’re probably overthinking it OP. Very few people have a perfect home life as children and even people in a standard nuclear set up often have complaints.

I would keep doing what you’re doing: reassuring her that she’s always welcome, telling her it’s her choice, supporting her to be open with you. You’re doing the best you can.

The studies that I've seen, conducted in Scandinavian countries where 50/50 has been the norm for sometime, suggest that it's the best scenario for children of separated parents and that children in 50/50 arrangements have similar levels of attainment and mental health to children of together parents.

Haven't you set up the conflict there? Shouldn't the response have been have you talked to your Dad? He must know his car isn't suitable, he didn't need you to tell him.

Yes. I think it’s so much fairer to make the parents do it. It’s awful and really hard as a child. Sorry - probably not what you wanted to hear.