Bugsy

[sykes]

For some reason I can't reply on the board on this thread (affair - is he/isn't he) and would rather converse via e-mail anyway. I'd be really happy to "talk" in this way as it's not unfamiliar territory. Please feel free to get my e-mail address from tech.

OK, I need a bit of advice & morale boosting please.
Quick update: H came back from 2 weeks "working" abroad on Sunday. Had chat, said he wanted to separate. Reasons given: he enjoyed his own company, found the kids really difficult, could tell that his presence was making me unhappy.
On Monday night he left his 'phone on for the first time in eternity and I checked his texts. 18 messages from HER, thanking him for great time last week, saying she missed him, loved him etc. Affair clearly ongoing - stupid, stupid, stupid me.
He doesn't want to come on holiday - we're supposed to be going on Saturday. I have desperately being trying to find a nanny/aupair/cleaner/tramp/anyone at all who could come and help me with no success.
BUT - FOR SOME INEXPLICABLE FEELING I FEEL GUILTY. He keeps saying to me that he can tell I don't love him anymore, that I don't want to make a go of things. He says he wants to separate and then says he is not sure. He keeps asking to hug me and then says that I am cold and distant if I won't let him. He doesn't want me to tell people, because "nothing is written in stone yet". He says whatever happens, he wants me to like him.
Please, give me backbone. I actually feel like I am going mad. I don't know what I think, what I want. I cannot believe I am still dithering around 4 months after first finding out he was with someone else.
Help.

Bugsy, i have never posted on this before but now have tears in my eyes. I think you need to go on hols without him (can you get a mate/family member to go?) and think.
I also think you need to seperate...to ask him to leave and make him realise that you are seriously sick of his lying and affair. Maybe on holiday you can write it all down and post the letter to him.
I think he is totally unfair telling you that you are distant and don't love him....he's a fool if he thinks that.....

good luck

FWIW, I think he's messing with your head. What the hell does he mean wanting you to like him? You like him or dislike him, just as you feel. I've loved a couple of men like that, and interestingly enough I only realised quite how much one of them was messing me around when he did it to the woman after me (and in fact behaved much worse to her). I really feel for you, caught up in this ghastly mindf*ck.

He IS with someone else (and probably has been all along). He doesn't want to feel bad about it or to take responsibility for his actions so he is loading it all on to you. He is forcing you to chuck him out so that he can think 'well, she never loved me, she made the decision, I am absolved of guilt...'
I think you somehow need to take control and try to move on. V hard I know if you still love him and obviously don't want the family to break up, but clearly he isn't going to behave like an adult so I'm afraid you will have to. Good luck and I'm very sorry you are having to go through this.

Bugsy, my heart is crying out for you although, at this moment in time, the last thing you need is someone's sympathy but I know exactly how you feel as I have been there, although circumstances slightly different - it was me that had the affair but ex-h couldn't forgive me after having 3rd child and then left (although stayed in the house for 9 months, although we were not together).

Reading your posting about the text message just makes me feel so hurt for you, it is such a horrible thing to read as I found out when ex-H started seeing his girlfriend and kept sending me text messages by mistake!!!

He keeps asking you to hug him and then wonders why you give him the cold shoulder - because of the bl**dy way he has treated you. How can he expect you to "comfort him" when it is him that is making you back off in the first place.

It sounds to me like he is very confused (as was my ex-H - that is why he took so long to actually move out of the house) and doesn't know what he wants, or perhaps he is "weak" and is scared of making that final break.

You are strong, and you will get through this.

I know exactly what you are going through having been through exactly this same thing this exact time last year. I had so many friends saying I should "kick him out" but at the end of the day I was scared of taking that route. Although we were not together, at least he was still present in the family home although he kept going out at weekends, not coming home, staying with his girlfriend but at that time I didn't have the courage/strength to kick him out.

It was only when I went on holiday, having left the baby at home with him, and then finding out he had spent both weekends with MY baby and his girlfriend that gave me the courage to "kick him out". It did take me a while to get over it, but I can now say I certainly am.

I know I found it hard that my husband kept kicking me when I was down (phrase - not literally) but, at the end of the day, I let him.

You will find the strength to get through this, as I did. One day, and no one can tell you when that day will be, you will wake up and realise you are worth more than this piece of sh*t and you are a worthy, loving, kind, intelligent woman and mother.

My thoughts are with you.

Total and utter wanker! He is messing with your head by saying that it's clear YOU don't want to make a go of things!!! Looks like he's making a great effort eh??!??

Bugsy so sorry foryour situation. GO ON HOLIDAY GIRL!

F*ck em. He's quite clearly not worth it. He's even putting this woman before his children! I'd like to give her a good punch in the face for you.

Bugsy, please do not feel guilty. This is not down to you. You deserve so much more than this and I have to agree that he wants to have his cake and eat it which is why he is playing these horrid mind games. Of course he wants you to like him it takes away guilt and makes it easier for him to get on with his life. I feel really angry on your behalf. You have done so very much to make this work and although I have said in the past that if you want to make it work you have to keep trying perhaps it is time to draw a line and for you to take complete control. How dare he have children and then decide that he finds the children difficult. You and your children do not need him. I hope you manage to get away and have some kind of break. Best wishes Winniexx

Bugsy, you have backbone. You know exactly what he is doing, major emotional manipulation by him here. It's not up to him whether you like him or not.

A holiday on your own with just your kids will be great - honestly, I've done it, so can you.

Sorry this is brief, am in work but wanted to post.

Agree with everyone else here that it is despicably manipulative to continue to try and "blame" you for the breakdown in your marriage when he is clearly involved in a relationship elsewhere.
You already have heaps of backbone, Bugsy, you would not have come so far without it. I really hope you get someone to come on hols with you, but as Tinker says - if you can't, go yourself, it can be done. Please don't miss your time away, a change of scene might help you in unexpected ways.

Hello Bugsy, just to add to what everyone else said, you are clearly a very good person doing your best in an impossible situation. I know you said once before that you were very private but it does seem like now is a good time for you to go public with your friends and family about what has been happening - you've handled so much of this on your own. Like others I read this last message with horror and I feel for you. Get away on Saturday and have a good time.

Oh Bugsy so sorry it is all ending like this.From your message today I have to say that the only thing that can be said is that he's a COWARD.
He's too cowardly to come out and admit that the affair is continuing,and he's too scared to admit that he wants your relationship to finish , so instead he's trying to turn it all onto you and make out that although he's not sure its what he wants he'll do you the favour.....

You are so much stronger and you will get it all together in the end, as bumblelion a says there will come a day when you'll look back on all this and feel what a lot you have achieved.

If you are coming on holiday to anywhere near my part of the world and I can do anything to help let me know.

Much love GRMUM

Bugsy, I think he's actually hedging his bets - enjoying his fun but trying to keep you on the backburner for when it ends (which probably means he's not very serious about her).If you both decide that you can rebuild your relationship in the future that's one thing.

However, that shouldn't influence what you do now. You should hold on to your anger and try and enjoy your holiday and leave him to get on with it. Are your kids old enough to be supportive to you on holiday?

TBH I think he wants to you to kick him out. He's too cowardly to make the move. It seems so suspicious to me that his phone was conveniently left on with those 18 messages left undeleted.

Go on the holiday anyway. If anything else it'll give you a breather away from home to enable you to get your thoughts straight.

hugs

Thank you, thank you, thank you all. These were the words I needed to hear. I was starting to doubt my own sanity, starting to feel as though I have no right to be cross or less loving towards him. He also seemed to think that I should feel sorry for him because he is finding this "all so difficult".
When we discuss stuff, I find it so difficult to remain focused as we dance off around the houses on petty stuff about who said what when.
I am going to print out all your messages and read them on my way home, so that I know I'm not being unreasonable.

Bugsy, havent read this thread before today but just want to say I'm thinking of you and how crap and difficult all this must be for you, love E x

And for what its worth I think PhillipaT's explanation is the most likely - wanting to hedge his bets. Its up to you - go on holiday to think it out. x

Bugsy - he is mad! Not only does he want to have his affair - he actually wants you to give him your blessing and tell him he's a poor dear sweetheart. Well he isn't he's a bastard cowardly motherf*er who doesn't deserve you or the kids. Let him go, but don't give him your blessing. And why on earth would you want to let him hug you? I'd be quite happy to castrate him! I think he needs to grow up a bit (a lot) He'll soon realise his mistake.

Oh and that "not telling people" bit- that's just more power games from him. Tell whoever you want.

Agree with Jimjams re the not telling people. Do what you think.

Also if you can't find anyone to come on holiday could your kids go to some sort of club to give you a break for a couple of hours a day. Not sure what sort of holiday you've got planned.

Have to agree with JimJams on the 'not telling anyone' bit. He simply doesn't want to look like the bad guy in all this even though it's all his doing. I hate to be so blunt but he's just being a selfish, unkind, untrustworthy and manipulative bastard!
He knows that as soon as the whole story, or even part of it for that matter, becomes news to all your family and friend he's going to look like the baddie in all this and bloody rightly so.
Enjoy your holiday and tell him when you get back what a good time you and your children had without him, then pack his bags and tell him to F* off! Sorry, being abit blunt again there!

Holiday is stressing me out quite alot. I've got a just over 1 yr old and a 3.5 yr old and we are going to a villa in France. It is lovely and I'm very lucky to be going there but it is not particularly child friendly, lots of steps, tiled floors, unfenced pool and the beach is a short drive away.
However, I know I'll be able to manage it just wont be very relaxing. Anyway, I feel bad moaning about it because I know there are lots of people out there who would be delighted to have two weeks in the South of France, partner or not.

Bugsy is there anyone at all you can take with you? Friend, relative etc? I know its short notice....can understand you are daunted and it will be hard work, but still think you should go - you will survive (or even enjoy) it and it will give you confidence, as well as a bit of time and space away from home and him.
But really, the fact that he doesn't want to come with you says it all doesn't it? That is not the action of a man who wishes to save his marriage.

Have you told anyone you've invited along, why you're inviting them at such short notice? I'm sure if it were me, I would do my very best to come with you. And it sounds like a lovely holiday potentially. Very very best of luck.