What is life really like in the UK?

[YellowEyePenguin]

I apologize in advance for the long post! But I would really like to get some opinions from people.

My British husband and I (also British) are currently living in Dunedin, New Zealand, with our two daughters, ages 6 and 8. We've been in NZ for 15 years now and are really considering moving home to the UK. We never intended to stay in NZ but, long story short, accidentally got swept along with life and are still here. On the whole life is pretty OK. We're very happily married and our kids are at a wonderful school. We're also really lucky that my sister and her family live in the same city. However, we just pine for home. We're both very close to our families but find, because of the time difference, it's incredibly hard to keep in touch as much as we'd like, and our parents are now in their mid seventies. I feel scared at the thought of missing out on their last decade or so. And wish my children could have a relationship with them.

On top of that we feel like it's so hard to make any connections here. We love our house and the wildlife and coastline. But we have very few friends and so most of our time is spent as a little unit of four. We're also increasingly frustrated by the enormous cost of living and the fact that we'll never be able to afford to improve our house (for example, double glazing would cost $70,000 and so we're forced to constantly battle the mould and the condensation). We can't afford to explore the rest of NZ and so are confined to our small, geographically isolated, city. Any money we do have goes into a separate account used for trips to visit home. And we're miserable at the thought of growing old here.

The issue is that we are trying to decide what to do for the best; particularly for our girls' sakes. Both of our parents are really concerned that we want to return to the UK and they believe that NZ offers a better life for them. Both sets of parents have mentioned that the UK doesn't feel as safe anymore, with increasing violence and aggression since Covid. And that there is a general feeling of despondency in the country.

We don't feel that NZ is the utopia that a lot of our family seem to think is. It has its own political, economical and social problems. But we're really trying to gauge whether our parents' concerns are true. We know the country will be different to when we last lived there and expect to have dissatisfaction with various things, but hope that being close to family again, and the countryside etc will outweigh it.

Id love to hear how you all feel the situation in the UK is at the moment. And I do know that it is entirely subjective and will depend on where you are, your income, your relationships and so on. I'm just going round and round with the looming decisions, especially as I would want to move relatively soon, while my daughters are still young.

We're hoping to relocate to Norfolk.

Editing to add that my major concern is the children. They are both very sensitive and find change challenging. In some ways i feel like life could be better for them in the UK, but I worry that they might be really impacted by the upheaval. Also, their school is just amazing, very nurturing and supportive and I would be so sad to leave it.

You should come and visit for a while and see it for yourself. I would listened to your parents initial concerns as well. This is definitely not the same as when you left. Every place I have been in the last few years seems to be much better than the U.K. when comparing quality of life.

Not wishing to be rude but if you haven't made good friends in NZ in the last 15 years why would it be different in the UK?

Move back for a year, keep your house in NZ. If you settle then sell and buy here. If not then you have a home to go back to

Spot on. This is a country of two halves!

The U.K. isn’t unique in this way. Most countries are the same.

My parents emigrated to NZ when I was a child so I grew up there and moved back to England as an adult. My schooling in NZ was brilliant and I’m so glad I grew up there. The British school system seems dreadful to me.

growing up there meant I never knew my extended family which has never bothered me and I didn’t look them up when I moved back. My family is now scattered all over the planet which is fine, we keep in touch. I would like to see NZ relatives more and I wish now I’d moved back there years ago as I miss it. Growing up between 2 countries means you never really belong anywhere. I’m currently leaving the UK with the intention of ending up back in NZ eventually. But for now europe will do. Anywhere but England - brexit has really pissed me off and I’m sick of the negativity and anger here.

my parents eventually moved back from NZ then just ended up in England moaning about the cost of everything!

True but I think it's got so much worse here. It's the housing situation primarily. It's absolutely divided the nation in two. Not every Western country has the culture of investing in housing the way Brits do. Brexit revealed how riven we are and how completely detached the ruling class are. I live in a wealthy rural place and it's hard to give a full picture of how differently the two halves live. The wealthy simply have no idea and appear to not give a fig 😔

It’s more likely grandparents will soon stop travelling such a distance at all. It’s an onerous journey if for the young and healthy. They may already be struggling to imagine doing it many more times..

Whilst there are differences in wealth - everyone can be treated free of charge ( this is not a given, we now take for granted) even advanced first world countries do not offer this - such as US etc. Every child is educated free of charge, offered various free services until they are eighteen. The standards of education are really rising here, it is striking to compare attainment to NZ and see how far NZ are dropping down. Prioritising time in the sand pit is all well and good until you need a university place or a job.
Brexit vote was from multiple social and economic classes and not just the ‘ruling’ class, I am not sure what that’s got to do with anything.

Even the poorest have many safety nets that simply do not exist in other countries. Whilst I accept those with more money will be comfortable - that is the case globally Inc NZ - we are not a utopia after all, many people appreciate a good standard of living regardless of whether they know it or not, because of our cultural, historical and social values. No one is left to die here because they can’t afford a doctor, and we do incredible work to offer support to everyone in society as charities and volunteers.

My family are from North Norfolk and I know the area well and it is beautiful. Also have relatives near Norwich and it's nice. If you are comfortable moneywise you will be ok in the UK, but like with anywhere, if you struggle, you will struggle here.

Re the NHS - if you eligible for free treatment there can be a wait for certain services. Some you are seen quickly, but if you need physio (like me), I had to wait 4 weeks to see my physio. My SIL had to wait 8 weeks for a CT scan. They do not do things immediately. Bear this in mind if you are used to a swift service in NZ.

But remember with minor illness or if you fall over etc where I live there is an NHS treatment centre and you can walk in off the street and be seen. I know there is one near Norwich, so you have options if you cant get in to see a doctor. It happened to me a while ago and I fell over, thought I'd broke my wrist, rang 111 and got taken to the walk-in and was seen within a couple of hours. They will refer you to A&E or a specific dept if needs be.

You should come and visit Norwich or anywhere in Norfolk to get a feel.
People always seem friendly on the streets, lots of shopping, eating, drinking, sports. I've not noticed lots of litter or graffiti. Might be a London thing.

Tough call. My parents considered moving to Canada many years ago, as my Mum's family mostly live there. They did what I suggest you do: take a leave of absence and come to the UK for 3 months or so.

PS. After 3 months, my parents decided Canada was not for them! But at least they gave it a shot.

What is life really like in the UK?

I haven't read any of the OP or the responses.
I'm answering this question and this question only and from my perspective.

"What is life really like in the UK?"
Shite.... unless you're well above average earners.

People can't see it, or choose not to, but there's millions in the UK with nowhere near enough to exist well. There's way too many with far more than they could ever ever need. Suggestions that those with two pies should give a half of one of theirs to people with no pies is met with demonising those with no pies as scroungers and lazy scum.

It sickens me how much some people have because I see how little others have.

Now if you move here and you're one of the haves more than enough, you'll be fine. Good education ,life expectancy, opportunities, nepotism and all the trappings of a middle class fuckwit lifestyle. If, however, you move here and your on an average or below income, forget it. You'll never work hard enough, you'll never be seen as worthy enough, you'll never get out of that pit and will be demonised by the middle classes as lazy scrounging scum, you'll be ignored by the upper classes who have little to do with those at the bottom and you'll be repeatedly punished by the political classes to appease the middle classes and secure votes from the upper classes.

It's a hell hole with a painted veneer of civility that hides crime, drugs, prostitution, trafficking, rapes by member of the police and lawlessness on the streets.

As an ex teacher and mother of two school aged children in so called good schools I can see for myself how terrible education has become. The schools shoot through teachers like water. Where I live you canNOT get an NHS dentist. It's had real life consequences on the health of youngsters. Children are not seeing the dentist and later having rotten teeth pulled out at the hospital. If you live where I do you'd know that health care isn't free for all at point of need. I lived in an EU country for many years. While many things were the same, certain things were not and good basic healthcare was one. I'm not sure which other European country doesn't have safety nets or leaves people to die for want of a doctor? Sure globally there are countries like this but I thought we were comparing like for like.

The UK has a lot to offer despite the NHS and education. It's great for business, culture and history. It is an open minded and tolerant society. Things basically run well. I love living here. But I can also say it is truly divided in a way I haven't seen in my lifetime (and I grew up on a council estate). The rich are so wealthy... The number of Teslas around our roads, second and third holiday homes that each could hold a family of six, outdoor heated swimming pools...I could go on. It's like living in feudal times when down the road there are families of five living in two beds, struggling to post for heating, often with two adults working in good WC jobs. I don't believe in exaggerating.

@PurpleMonkeys I love the UK (am not British) but I have a lot of sympathy for your view.

Low wages, poor housing, lack of decent job opportunities and poor transport links in many areas are a terrible drain on this country. It is far too London centric.

Lilyoverthevalley SallyWD I totally agree with you both(and holiday here in the UK too) We are comfortable, and run a car and live within 20 minutes to the Coast.I think people here are often a little complacent about Health Care ,Schooling etc,My friend DS and family live in US ,they have a gun culture with handguns kept in their desks ,and no real healthcare apart from privately with their company. We have one of the best Countries in the world .Lets celebrate it!

Why would you celebrate something that has clearly got so much worse in the last 10 years just because someone else is worse?

Its not a race to the bottom!

That’s an excellent idea @Jaxhog

As an immigrant myself, it’s hard not to emphasise that ‘going back home’ is never as easy as it sounds.
That being there on hols for 2~3 weeks isn’t the same than living there.

@YellowEyePenguin I’d read around the general issues about moving back to your own country after so many years.

Of course the grass always seems greener on the other side. So I can see that dealing with the issues of day to day life in NZ returning to the UK appears attractive. Equally if you are dealing with the issues of day to day life in UK then moving to NZ appears attractive.

It is important therefore to take a non emotional logical view of the pros and cons of each country with a particular focus on what would be best for your children.

From a personal perspective having experience of South Island NZ and the UK in balance I would be staying in NZ but clearly depending on your personal circumstances eg a great job in a nice house is better than a shit job in a small apartment whether that is in the UK or NZ.

In truth, a lot of this post would also apply to NZ.

@YellowEyePenguin you might want to read about reverse culture shock - the culture shock one feels when they move back home after some time abroad. It’s always worse the longer you’ve been abroad.

Here fir an example of what it means

@YellowEyePenguin another question for you

If you move back to the U.K., how will things work for you re your pension?

I think your user name tells us you are a glass half empty on that divide 😂

I haven't read anyone else's responses, but we too lived abroad for a period of time in my DHs' country. We moved back in the UK more than 10 years ago. And I would say to you, given the way you feel and your living situation in NZ where money is tight and you can't afford to do up your house or explore the southern hemisphere, just come back.

No, the UK isn't exactly the same as it was 15 years ago. Where is? It's been a tough few years, as I'm sure you know and have also experienced in NZ. We had the Brexit vote, which was horribly divisive for the country, set family members against one another and produced a result that many of us were devastated about (and still are). Then we had the pandemic, which was shit. Since then, we've had a big rise in the cost of living. Inflation has risen sharply, mortgage payments have consequently shot up, as have bills (particularly energy). The price of food has gone up a lot, even the basics. A lot of people who were managing before are now struggling, because the cost of everything has gone up in a very short space of time, and wages haven't kept pace. So yes, tough times, but it's not a lot different to what I hear/experience in other countries.

OP your DPs aren't going to get younger. Your homesickness isn't going to go away. Your DC are a good age to move back (i.e. they're primary school age and moving before your eldest starts secondary is a good time to make the move) and they'll grow up as little Brits if you move back now. If you put off moving until they've left school, they'll be Kiwis and they quite possibly will want to stay. Carpe diem. Come home.

My user name is whatever it is and has nothing to do with a concept quite well known in the expat community.

Maybe you’d like to explain what your own lived experience as an expat is? As well as tte ‘going back home’ part?