What is life really like in the UK?

[YellowEyePenguin]

I apologize in advance for the long post! But I would really like to get some opinions from people.

My British husband and I (also British) are currently living in Dunedin, New Zealand, with our two daughters, ages 6 and 8. We've been in NZ for 15 years now and are really considering moving home to the UK. We never intended to stay in NZ but, long story short, accidentally got swept along with life and are still here. On the whole life is pretty OK. We're very happily married and our kids are at a wonderful school. We're also really lucky that my sister and her family live in the same city. However, we just pine for home. We're both very close to our families but find, because of the time difference, it's incredibly hard to keep in touch as much as we'd like, and our parents are now in their mid seventies. I feel scared at the thought of missing out on their last decade or so. And wish my children could have a relationship with them.

On top of that we feel like it's so hard to make any connections here. We love our house and the wildlife and coastline. But we have very few friends and so most of our time is spent as a little unit of four. We're also increasingly frustrated by the enormous cost of living and the fact that we'll never be able to afford to improve our house (for example, double glazing would cost $70,000 and so we're forced to constantly battle the mould and the condensation). We can't afford to explore the rest of NZ and so are confined to our small, geographically isolated, city. Any money we do have goes into a separate account used for trips to visit home. And we're miserable at the thought of growing old here.

The issue is that we are trying to decide what to do for the best; particularly for our girls' sakes. Both of our parents are really concerned that we want to return to the UK and they believe that NZ offers a better life for them. Both sets of parents have mentioned that the UK doesn't feel as safe anymore, with increasing violence and aggression since Covid. And that there is a general feeling of despondency in the country.

We don't feel that NZ is the utopia that a lot of our family seem to think is. It has its own political, economical and social problems. But we're really trying to gauge whether our parents' concerns are true. We know the country will be different to when we last lived there and expect to have dissatisfaction with various things, but hope that being close to family again, and the countryside etc will outweigh it.

Id love to hear how you all feel the situation in the UK is at the moment. And I do know that it is entirely subjective and will depend on where you are, your income, your relationships and so on. I'm just going round and round with the looming decisions, especially as I would want to move relatively soon, while my daughters are still young.

We're hoping to relocate to Norfolk.

Editing to add that my major concern is the children. They are both very sensitive and find change challenging. In some ways i feel like life could be better for them in the UK, but I worry that they might be really impacted by the upheaval. Also, their school is just amazing, very nurturing and supportive and I would be so sad to leave it.

I think everyone will tell you differently. I haven’t seen an increase in aggression post Covid but I think people are more selfish and so used to being in their own homes they forgot how to be considerate to others. If you can afford to buy a house in Norfolk, it is lovely there but it is an isolated part of the Uk. The NHS isn’t great, also consider if you could afford private health care.

The minute I read that I thought AI.

It's totally different in style to the OP .....

UK is just different to where you are, but not bad. We moved from Germany to live in a rural area in England, so our experience will obviously be different to those who live it cities and towns.

I would not say we feel less safe since COVID. But I know the COVID situation left a lot of people with anxieties about life. So I think those people would say they feel unsafe, while safety has not actually deteriorated.

We have many of the first world problems. Food is expensive, utilities and fuel are still expensive since the Ukraine conflict, and housing is expensive - rental and owning.

Healthcare is reasonable, but waits for appointments can be long. Schools are also reasonable in our area too, our children all did well.

There are still niggles from Brexit, but things have largely settled down, unless you live in NI I would guess.

The rest of the problems are much the same as many western countries I feel.

Hope that helps.

Both sets of parents have mentioned that the UK doesn't feel as safe anymore, with increasing violence and aggression since Covid. And that there is a general feeling of despondency in the country.

The problem with threads like this is that it always attracts the “doom-mongers” who love to come on and moan about the uk. I don’t recognise any of the above and the NHS is always “on its knees” - and probably always will be depending on what you take this to mean.

I love our life here and would hate to live somewhere as remote as NZ. I’m in an expensive suburb in the north so maybe I’m in a bubble but I believe Norfolk is lovely and has much cheaper property in comparison?

Ultimately if you’re not happy in NZ then surely you have to do something about it? A bunch of randoms on the internet can’t decide for you.

I think if partly depends were you live so it's maybe worth asking on local Norwich Facebook pages if they exist. I live in northern Scotland and the kids go to a great school, the housing prices are high and rentals are ridiculous, you can still get a doctor's appointment but all dental care is largely private only now. It's relatively safe and I have notice people seem more aggressive since COVID but that's because I am in a customer facing role. There has been no marked increase in violence. Food costs have risen drastically as have electric and gas though.

People keep saying ‘healthcare is non existant’ - who are all these people in hospital then? Are they not being treated (for free)? My dear old dad has been in A and E twice in the last month - collected from the care home by ambulance, observed for 8 hours, x rays etc ( two falls), then taken back by ambulance. I have a GP appointment this week, I’ve recently had my well woman check, mammogram, cervical smear, poo test and my husband his PSI - all in the last six months. Babies being born safely all over the place!

Is it worse than it was - clearly. Is it non existent- no.

As a teacher I think the same about schools. Are they struggling with money - yes. Are they uniformly terrible - clearly not. Our global education stats are improving. And if you think other European countries are better with SEN, think again.

I don’t think this gloomy vision helps the OP. She really needs to drill down and look at specific Norfolk house prices, opportunities etcetc.

I am a ‘returner’ as is one of my children and my husband lives here as a European. In the end there are pluses and minuses everywhere- it’s just really important not to continually compare when you’ve moved but to embrace the change.

I wouldn’t. This country is an absolute mess. Your sister is there, your kids are happy. I would move abroad if I could. Your parents may die in the next ten years . Then you’ll be stuck here wondering why you moved back.

I would recommend doing a lot of research about moving to the Norwich area.

-Cost of housing, and realistically what you’d be paying. Mortgage rates are really high here atm. It’s really changing the market.

-NHS hospital and GP surgeries nearby. As PPs have said, most of us are experiencing incredibly crap NHS care here. Long wait times for any kind of appt, ambulances wait of hours or telling you to go to a&e yourself. General crap and neglectful attitude from NHS staff. I’ve had to pay for private care for my little boy because of this.

-Almost impossible to find an NHS dentist now, even for children. Even my 2 year old is private.

-Schools is a big one, especially as you say your kids are at a great school. You’d be entering mid-school so I would suggest you research the quality of junior schools around the area and potentially even call up the LA to see which schools they could even get you into, as they are all so oversubscribed. You may end up with them going to different schools. There was also a big news item last week where 150 schools had to close urgently because the building structure was a risk of collapsing.

-Other general costs of living. Supermarket food prices have gone through the roof.

Money will make all the difference here. And finding a nice house to rent. The rental market in the UK is bad. Houses are few and far between. I would start looking for housing and see what is available.

if you are comfortably off then I would do it but if not. Then no.

Yes just to reiterate what PPs have said - rental market is getting worse here. Because of the massively increasing mortgage rates, landlords are now having to sell up and reduce their portfolios, reducing the number of properties available and therefore increasing rental costs.

I used to live in Norwich. It was lovely. My friends who are still there say crime and antisocial behaviour have increased massively the past few years.

The NHS has a funding and staffing crisis. (I have some inside knowedge on this, not just what the papers say. It's bad, and there is way more to come.)

Schools are underfunded, understaffed and literally crumbling (google UK schools concrete).

And someone mentioned our fantastic universities - yep, they also have a huge funding crisis, staff casualisation, brexit and government have messed up their income models, and they (and studients) have forgotten what education is for. Staff layoffs are in the hundreds - in individual universities - and whole departments are closing.

You will need to rebuild your social network from scratch.

Not just mortgage rates - changes to tax breaks and BTL rules mean a lot of landlords are getting out. Which could be good for people wanting to buy, but not for renters.

Also it’s worth remembering that NZ is your dcs home. Not the U.K. The U.K. will have no other meaning than the place they go on hols from time to time and where grand parents live.

My dcs are bi National too. always lived in the U.K. That’s their home country.

Now of course, it’s still ok for you to move to the U.K. but it will be a move to a foreign country for them which you might or might not be happy with - see for eg how you’d feel if you were moving to Canada instead. Would it feel right to do that on your dcs pov? I personally would have no issue with that, esp at their age. But I’m aware that not everyone feels like that.

Is there any chance your parents and in-laws could visit you in NZ for longer periods of time?

@theresnolimits the government has just cut down the amount of money available to schools for SEN children.
Just at the time when referrals for autism are in the increase and schools experience an unusual increase in children needing support (eg non verbal in KS1).

The SEN provision isn’t getting better here….

Another stark difference between NZ and the U.K. is the attitude towards covid.

I have no idea what’s your position around that but be aware that the U.K. has a very ‘hands off approach’ to covid with no testing, even in hospitals (unless people get very clear symptoms and the test is needed on a treatment pov). No boosters any more etc….

Maybe important for you (or maybe not).

Crime rates are consistently low in Norwich and it was named as one of the. Eat places to live in the UK by the Sunday Times in 2021.

Agree that the rental market is a disaster and only going to get worse. On the flip side it’s possibly a decent time to buy one of the houses that landlords are selling up if you can afford it given the higher interest rates.

I'd say the way we handled COVID was far better than they did in NZ, completely freaky way of treating the whole situation if you ask me.

I wasnt judging the U.K. or NZ answer to covid @Breakawaytour .
Just pointing out it was/is very different and could influence the OP.

It’s up to her to decide what’s important for her. Regardless of your or my opinion on it.

There is literally a BBC news article today about vulnerable people being offered a booster.

I would avoid moving just to avoid being stuck in rental accommodation. The market sounds absolutely insane and prices.

We've been governed by a corrupt conservative government for many years and a needless austerity has decimated public services.

There is also the self-inflicted shit show which is brexit and that has sown such vicious division in the country I have no idea if the nastiness that does exist, will ever dissipate.

My DS is about to move to Australia. He has zero hope of being able to buy here and is paying £1200 in rent for a room in a shared house. Surviving but what sort of life is that?

Yes from 70yo onwards and immunocompromised (very strict list there too).
Which means only a very small portion of people will get them - unless you are happy to pay £120 for the shot.

The OP and her family will not have access to it.

Yes exactly. The most vulnerable people who actually need it. Most other people have had 3 vaccines and it is not deemed needed.

Vaccines are offered when needed. I wouldn’t use this as an example to scare OP:)

We live in a northern city and I would say we have a high quality of life- we earn ok wages, children go to a good school and an abundance of activities for then. City is very child centred- we also have access to lovely countryside within an hour. Yes the NHS isn't perfect- fully agree with that.
Nowhere is perfect as you've found. We have lived abroad in 3 different places and always feel at home in the UK despite its negatives. Our friends around the world are all dealing with their own challenges.

I think if you have a good income and secure housing in a nice area then you can have a great life/ lifestyle in Norfolk. I would rather have Norfolk than NZ anyday. I would feel very isolated in NZ.

Personally I haven't noticed any difference post Covid to my life, however it is true that services are struggling. We are lucky we can afford health insurance and pay for dental care when needed. Access to Europe and the rest of the world is a huge positive.