First Pregnancy Missed Miscarriage (Part 4)

[Kiki061190]

Hi ladies!

Our previous thread is now full so I’ve made a new one 😘

Hi guys, hope you don't mind me joining?

I've been reading all your comments and sending love and luck to all of you who have suffered losses ♥️

I'm 29 and had a MMC in August this year. I was very lucky to get pregnant on our first cycle of trying and it would've been our first baby.

I was so excited, really didn't think anything would go wrong, naively thinking that as I'm (relatively!) young and healthy I'd be fine.

Had an early reassurance scan privately as I had a bit of spotting, I was six weeks, and the sonographer only saw the gestational sac. I was anxious but she said perhaps I'd ovulated earlier than I thought and if so then what she was seeing was normal. Referred me to EPU.

Went to EPU a couple of days later for another scan. Still no yolk sac or embryo. Had HCG done then returned a couple of days later to have it done again. Initial HCG was high - 63,000 - and did increase normally. But they saw it being high as a red flag, I think, so on I worried.

By 8 weeks and after a couple more scans there was just a growing gestational sac and I had the option of surgery as there was no uterine bleeding today suggest a natural MC was pending.

I cried and pleaded throughout this time to have the surgical management ASAP but they made me wait until the sac measure 25mm, which by eight weeks it did. A blighted ovum missed MC. My MH throughout the weeks of waiting suffered hugely.

I had MVA surgery as I didn't want a GA. I had cervical shock immediately after and fainted in the stirrups. It was extremely painful (and I refused morphine - stupid!) but I was glad when it was over and I came out of hospital.

So - I'm pregnant again. I've had one cycle in between - period arrived 30 days after day of MC, didn't prevent the following cycle and now I'm five weeks three days.

I'm having spotting again. Scared. They told me I should come back to EPU to have an early scan but I'm scared to. The early scans, anxiety, waiting etc drove me crazy last time. The spotting is light and doesn't last long, had two episodes of it and it's really just a few spots of diluted-looking blood.

I had this last time and they said at each scan there was no bleeding in the uterus so I'm hoping it's nothing to worry about but just so anxious. I want the scan and I want to finally see a heartbeat but also I don't want to go too early and have the same agonising wait for nothing. What would you do? When would you book in, if you were me, and I'm sure many of you have been? I want to wait until there's no doubt as to what's going on, but also if the same happens again I don't want the MC or surgery to be any worse than it has to be, if that makes sense??

I feel for all of you ladies who are going through the same or similar. If anyone can advise I'd be really grateful ♥️

Hi @APinkMouse. Sorry you're going through this, must be very stressful. Personally, I wouldn't go before 7 weeks if everything seemed fine, BUT if you're spotting and considering your history, I'd go to a GP and to the EPAU as soon as you can. I'd be thinking about progesterone level check too. Spotting may be completely innocent, but it may be a sign of low progesterone, so don't let them fob you off. I hope everything goes well for you this time xxx

@APinkMouse Have a look at the PRISM Trial and advice notes on Tommy's website xxx

@MrsMGE thanks so much for your reply and advice! I had wondered about the progesterone thing and have just read about the trial and would definitely like to give it a go. Have you tried it?

I do have a regular cycle and ovulation and have never had any bleeding between periods ever (unless pregnant, apparently!) so thought I'd be okay on that front but I'd try anything to have DC.

Would I ask about it at the EPU? I have barely any contact with the GP and it takes about three hours to get a chance to speak to them on the phone!

Will they be able to test me during this pregnancy? I've already written it off in my head I think.

For the prescription I'd go to your GP I think. But then, I don't want to mislead you as the procedures vary. Can you go to your GP tomorrow morning? Or self refer to the EPAU, whichever is quicker? I think you need to explain the history to them. It is uncertain whether progesterone will help, but it won't do harm, and it seems you meet the criteria.

I haven't followed PRISM personally because as you would have seen from previous posts, I'm not pregnant following my MMC yet. PRISM was published just over a week before my first diagnosis, I didn't even know it existed at the time. However, I had spotting before my MMC which was completely dismissed by the midwife. I am now temping this cycle and I read that relatively low temp in the luteal phase may also indicate low progesterone. It's too early for me to say yet, but I am definitely keeping my eye on this, and once I get pg again, I will definitely be asking for progesterone, especially if I spot again.

I very much doubt you'd achieve anything over the phone as you'd need a prescription, can you just go in early tomorrow and explain what's going on and ask to be seen by your GP? I'd personally do that, I think. I understand where you're coming from and of course there's no guarantee this is going to help, but you've seen the stats - worth giving it a go, I think. Xxx

Also @APinkMouse I'd go to the EPAU regardless in your circumstances. You've been advised that and considering your history, it's only sensible to have a scan there ASAP and get advice from them. I'd like to think you'd be able to discuss the progesterone point with them too (although the attitudes vary, not all EPAUs are super helpful - but you need to ask) Xxx

Hi @APinkMouse I'm so sorry for your loss. I completely agree with @MrsMGE regarding the 7 week scan and progesterone. My GP prescribed progesterone with my current pregnancy. She told me low progesterone can be difficult to diagnose so she just prescribed it as it's a cheap and safe drug. I didn't have spotting but two previous losses. I warn you, most gps won't prescribe it. EPAU didn't know anything about it. Also my obstetric doctor doesn't believe it works. That aside I think Prism speaks for itself. I would see the GP in the morning and take details of the trial. If you can see a GP with a specialism in obstetrics even better. Failing that you could try and get a prescription privately. I'm not sure how that works. Good luck, I hope your GP supports you! Xx

@Catconfusion can I ask you, how were your temps in the luteal phase, say in your last cycle before your current pregnancy for ease of finding (if you remember/have a screen shot)? I need to continue temping for few more days to see things clearly, but I am wondering what the normal level is. Xxx

@MrsMGE that sounds like a good plan and I'll try and get in at the docs or EPU! Our EPU is variable, depending on the nurse, but the one who got my treatment sorted really advocated for me last time and was amazing, so I feel like she'd listen. I'm tempted to take the day off work anyway as I'm frazzled and this spotting has made me anxious. It's stopped now - really wasn't much - but still worrying.

I'm sorry for your loss and hope you get the news you're hoping for this cycle 🤞 it's an absolutely mindbendingly horrible waiting game after going through a MMC. Sending luck for a healthy pregnancy.

Thank you @Catconfusion - your GP sounds really reasonable, I hope it's the same for mine. I'll definitely try and get a prescription somehow. If I'm too late for this pregnancy maybe it'll help for the next one. A massive congrats on your pregnancy too - hope to be in your shoes soon!

Thank you @APinkMouse. It's been a journey for me, with lots of ups and downs, both on the physical and mental side, and it's not finished yet. I'm taking everything very easy and I am protecting myself in so far as possible to avoid any unnecessary stress at the moment. It's working (so far).

If I was you, I'd take a day off and get it all sorted. You'll be worrying tomorrow anyway, what's the point in stressing out. Just so you know, my spotting was also temporary, on 3 occasions in total, twice very, very minor, and once a little bit more substantial, but still small. I can't confirm this was because my baby died, but the date if the latter seems to be matching date-wise based on the measurements of my baby at my second early scan, so there is at least a possibility there. It doesn't need to be a huge, dramatic gush of blood or a long spotting over many hours or days. Xxx

Thank you @MrsMGE. It's such a horrible journey, but I guess we've just got to stay hopeful that there will be an end that'll make it all worth it one day soon ♥️

I don't think the mental agony ever quite goes away, we've just got to take it day by day, I guess. I felt the lowest I've ever felt after mine so I totally get where you're coming from. I've also had the medical treatment (I had a termination as a teenager that I don't like to think about as it was a product of a DV relationship) and it was horrific. The people who say it's 'like a heavy period' are out of their minds! It's a hard thing to cope with and I hope you heal soon.

Can also relate to the pain of pregnant friends and family members. Both of my sisters are pregnant and were when I had my MMC, one is a week ahead of where I would have been. As much as I adore them and can't wait to have new nieces and nephews it's all tinged with sadness tbh.

Hey @MrsMGE they hovered at about 36.7 - 36.8. This is the cycle before I got pregnant the first time around. It's the only one I carried on temping once O was confirmed. I hope it helps! Xx

Thanks @Catconfusion yes, very helpful!

My temps have gone back up today by about 0.3, to 36.62C. I'm 6DPO according to FF, I'll keep temping for a full cycle, but by the looks of things this cycle is unlikely to be longer than 32 days. What a difference after last month, I'm quite confused.

@SunStruck How are you doing today? Xxx

I'm alright thanks for asking @MrsMGE ❤️ at work today keeping busy! It's not worse than my usual period (I'm a heavy bleeder!), but let's see if anything else happens. My Dr hasn't come back to me yet so don't know when I'm going for the next scan to check products are out.

I've been a bit inspired by you today, I've booked a long weekend to Kuala Lumpur - My DH is going there for work for a week, so I'm going to fly out for a long weekend in 2 weeks time 😄 get to stay for free as his work pays for a nice 5 star hotel. Go for a few nice dinners and tour the city during the day! I can't wait, need a break for this whole TTC business before we try again!

@APinkMouse I'm so sorry to hear 😔 I would also go to the EPU if I were you, they could prescribe progesterone and baby aspirin that could help if it's just some spotting. You might also want to check the sac is in the right place. I know it's not ideal but take advantage of it when you can... and look after yourself!

@Kiki061190 and @Catconfusion so glad to hear you ladies are feeling better! Must be amazing to be further along now and finally get out of that worrying stage (although I know you'll always worry in a way). Take advantage of feeling well and eat lots of good and healthy food 😄 have you broken the news to everyone yet?

@MrsMGE oh 6 DPO, exciting! :) it's good that the cycles shortened a bit! How are you getting on with temping? I'm attaching my last cyclehere if it helps. Please note I have a bit lower body temp than what the norm is I think, we always sleep with AC on here at 21C! And blue is when I caught (pregnant). If I dont catch, temp comes crashing down when I get my period (usually same day). Hope it helps!

@APinkMouse Welcome! So sorry for your previous loss, the ladies here all have been through a similar experience. Congratulations on your new pregnancy. @Catconfusion always told me the chances of this happening again are slim. It’s not impossible but it is slim. I hope you find comfort here in this thread!

@SunStruck You are an amazing woman! You are dealing with this so well. Hope you feel better soon!

@MrsMGE A temp dip at 5dpi could indicate an implantation dip?

Thank you @SunStruck, I'm going to try and get some, you've all provided wonderful advice so thank you 😊

Thanks @Kiki061190 I really hope you're right! I'm finding it comforting to remind myself that this is an entirely different egg, and an entirely different combination of cells so there's no reason not to have hope that there'll be an entirely different outcome this time.

I've booked in for a scan tomorrow morning at the EPU so we'll see! I'll only be 5+5 by LMP so I'm not getting my hopes up that I'll see much. A GS and a YS would be promising, and they can at least check whether my spotting is uterine or not.

I'm rubbish at understanding temping so sadly can't offer anything useful to @MrsMGE, but I'm happy to be here and learn from you all!

@Kiki061190 Hello! Yes, you're right, I did read about this, but I don't know, I'm just not feeling it this month. I think it's because the first half of the month was very stressful and then O appears to have happened not long after that and early in the cycle for me. So there's a big part of me that doesn't quite acknowledge it did happen if you know what I mean?

How are you doing? Was the scan today? Xxx

@MrsMGE It’s so hard to predict the outcome with temps but so glad you have confirmed O. It’s great it’s happened a wee touch earlier though! Scan went ok today. Baby was awkward again! But have a due date of April 16th now. They said 20 week scan will pick up if baby has any abnormalities. For just now it’s a little wriggler!

Hey @SunStruck! KL sounds brilliant, I've never been, but deffo on a bucket list! Great idea! Look after yourself now, hope everything completes for you before you go so you have a chance to recover physically before travelling. Thanks for the chart! Tbh my luteal phase temps are very similar to yours. No idea if this means they're on a low side cause obvs I don't sleep with air con on in this country 😂 I'd sure have hypothermia! 😂 How are you feeling? I'm thinking about you every day xxx

@APinkMouse Hope everything goes well tomorrow for you! Don't worry re lack of temps advice, I'm only temping for the first time, so far from being an expert! Xxx

So happy for you @Kiki061190 ❤️ 16 April sounds sooo close! I think in my head it's nearly Christmas, then Easter and then little Kiki will be here ❤️ What have you been up to recently? Xxx

@Kiki061190 oh amazing news!!! All well and wriggly ❤️ a little Easter baby, how cute!

@MrsMGE thanks for thinking of me, I went to the gym this morning and started cramping after, a lot! I'm at work now but had to run to the bathroom a few times just to sit there as the cramping is so intense. I can't go home really so I've taken strong painkillers, hopefully they will kick on soon. Hopefully this is the worst of it, passed some clots but is just like a heavy period really so I can't really distinguish what's what. I'm just hoping this will end this week 🙁

I actually think temping is good, it confirms that you ovulate (or not) each month and us easier to predict things. It's not for everyone, especially if you usually wake at different times, but since I wake up at the same time every weekday it's very accurate for me. I have my fingers crossed for you this month 😘

@APinkMouse good luck today ❤️ push for a transvaginal scan for higher accuracy, it's not too early to see a sac and a yolk sac ☺️ I'll be thinking of you today!

@SunStruck Do what feels right for you, but personally I didn't go to the gym for a few weeks after the MC for that exact reason (not to mention during the process, but I had misoprostol as you know and could barely breathe between the pain, cramps & vomiting, so a different scenario to yours). Just don't push yourself too hard now cause you might haemorrhage. I'm amazed you're in work today, no chance to work from home? Xxx

Thanks @MrsMGE and @SunStruck for your luck! It worked. I was absolutely shaking with anxiety going into EPAS. I had the dildo cam scan and she found a 3mm embryo with heartbeat and yolk sac, and she couldn't see any uterine bleeding so spotting is maybe cervical. I cried. I was expecting an empty sac again! She was lovely and gave me a photo though there's not much to see, just a tiny tadpole. She put me at 5 weeks 6 days which is bang on really. Was very surprised to see HB so early.

I will try and breathe a sigh of relief but I doubt the anxiety ever goes away after a MMC so I'd love to stay a part of the thread if you'll have me!

@SunStruck I think you should definitely rest and enjoy some Netflix, or just take it really slowly on your workouts for a little while. Although I think the fact it's really painful is a signal that the worst will soon be over xxx

Brilliant @APinkMouse. I know the worry is never really over, but at least try to relax now. I'm glad you went, well done you. It's a stressful thing to go through especially if you worry things may not be quite right.

So I've plucked up the courage and went to my appointment with the Mental Health nurse this morning. I've been digesting on it since. She was lovely, kind and gentle.

She doesn't think I have PTSD, but she said I am definitely still grieving and I do have triggers which are bringing all the emotions back. She actually lost a baby too so she could relate to what I was saying. She said I'd need to still have symptoms after 6 months to be diagnosed with PTSD which means I'd need to watch myself and come back in Dec/Jan. She said for now she can tell I have low mood and I am still going through grief which is absolutely normal and I should let myself live through it for now. It's a form of reactive depression (not clinical) which for most people goes away after a few months. She said I put too much pressure on myself and I am not kind on myself. Advised to do relaxation exercises and do all the things that make me happy and relaxed within the next few months and see where I am. She said I'm a very strong person and she believes I'll overcome this, but need more time. And if the bad thoughts remain, then she'll work with me to teach me coping mechanisms.

This is in a way good and bad news. I am kind of relieved that perhaps it isn't as serious as I thought. But then, what if it actually is? I think I tend to come across better on the outside even though I'm fighting a war inside. I understand that she's saying I need to allow myself more time, but I'd like a professional to give me some practical tips as to how to cope with the triggers in particular. I read a lot about PTSD and frankly I do think I meet most of the criteria and I trust Tommy's views as they specialise in this field. I don't particularly like the fact I have to wait for someone to say right, yes, it's been 6 months, so now you have it. Maybe it's not a full blown PTSD, but I definitely have triggers and need to put a healthy coping strategy in place so they don't set me back on an otherwise, good road to recovery.

Anyway, I'm blabbing too much now. I am pleased I went, I can see her points, but tbh I'm also happy I'm on a waiting list for counselling to begin from January through a specialist local baby loss charity. I hope this is going to help and I can see talking in real life helps a lot. For now I guess I have no other choice than to look after myself and take a wait and see approach. Xxx