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Original poster

He wants them for Christmas

231 replies

foreverdieting · 15/10/2014 10:29

Hi, my ex had an affair and left me and the kids (then 2 and 4) three years ago. Moved in with the other woman and they live just over an hour away. He has the children over night every other weekend and might have them for a week once a year. He's a good dad and even though they don't want to go initially they enjoy themselves once they are there. I've had them every Christmas since the break up as I feel that it was his decision to leave us and the kids should wake up in their home on Christmas morning.

Anyway he's saying he wants them Christmas eve and Christmas day. I've said that he could come and get them after lunch on Christmas day so we both get to see them. This isn't good enough for him. The thought of not seeing my children Christmas morning breaks my heart, I'm sitting here sobbing trying to ignore his text messages. I don't have any family nearby but do have a boyfriend now who will be here xmas day so I know I won't be on my own. What do I do???

OP posts:
AlbaGuBrath · 19/10/2014 11:24

We don't actually know that Christmas morning is the sticking point for him though. All we know is that we wants the whole day and isn't willing to consider the split that was offered. My point is this, if he turns down the reverse split what does the OP do then? It shouldn't be falling solely at her feet to sort this out. If he wanted the reverse split would he not have just said that?

clam · 19/10/2014 11:30

I've lost track of this now, but has the OP said at any point that they might swap with who has the kids in the morning and who in the afternoon?

bf1000 · 19/10/2014 11:32

If she puts offers in writing and his only response is to refuse to negotiate and continue to demand the full day then she is building evidence should he take it to court of her being willing to discuss and negotiate and suggest child focus resolutions.
She could ask why he is so focussed on a full day (maybe there is something he wants to do with the children that needs a full day - such as seeing wider family, maybe his parents are coming for christmas and it may be the last time he thinks the children will get the spend christmas with their grandparents [who knows his reason maybe he has none]). THis could lead to further discussion about other contact in holidays which would enable him to do activities that take a full day at a different point over the xmas period.

2 people sticking heals in is only detrimental to the children. if he has no good reason and wont negotiate then there is little OP can do but stick to past arrangement and other either a swap this year or next but she will know and have evidence that she tried everything to enable children to send morning with their dad

bf1000 · 19/10/2014 11:33

no I dont think she has clam

WakeyCakey45 · 19/10/2014 11:35

We don't actually know that Christmas morning is the sticking point for him though

As it's a sticking point for the OP, who has said that her "heart will break" if she doesn't have her DCs on Xmas morning, it's unlikely to be something she proposes, is it?

HeadDoctor · 19/10/2014 11:40

Alba - hence the "if" in that sentence. And if she offers a suitable compromise and he refuses then I'd say she's within her rights to say either it can stay as it is or with half day split alternating the morning. No one is suggesting she just gives in every time he asks for it. Just that she doesn't get to have the final say because he had an affair or because she does the hard graft on a daily basis.

And she hasn't offered a compromise of splitting the day, that's what they already do. Unless he wants the whole day to be able to go and see family who are further afield and he would accept the OP having them for the whole day next year in return then my guess remains that it's Christmas morning that's the issue rather than actually wanting them for the whole day.

clam · 19/10/2014 12:13

But I would think that not waking up with your kids on Christmas morning would be slightly more bearable if you knew they were coming back home mid-late morning. Surely not seeing them at all, all day, would be much harder?

"Just that she doesn't get to have the final say.... because she does the hard graft on a daily basis."
Now you see, I reckon that does qualify her to have the final say. She's demonstrating on a daily basis that she is the parent-in-charge. He appears (and obviously we don't know for sure) to have abdicated his responsibilities on that one. Saying that he can't have the kids because of work is not something that resident mums parents have the luxury of saying.

HeadDoctor · 19/10/2014 13:18

Yes of course it would.

And I think we will have to agree to differ. In my opinion, my childs need for a relationship with their father trumps my need to be rewarded for my hard work.

clam · 19/10/2014 13:48

The relationship with their father would be better advanced if he could be arsed to see more of them throughout the year on a regular basis. Christmas Day is a side issue, I think.

bf1000 · 19/10/2014 14:33

Maybe he should reduce his hours at work and subsequent pay and then he could see them more - of course that would also have an impact on maintenance but he'd be able to see them more.

ChippingInLatteLover · 19/10/2014 14:36

A child does not build a relationship with their father on Christmas morning, they build it by having him act like a parent, not an uncle who sees them twice a month and doesn't do any of the parenting...

He's not interested in being a parent to them.

ChippingInLatteLover · 19/10/2014 14:39

He could see them more without reducing his hours - he could still pick them up on a Friday, the OP & the children don't have a problem with that, only him. He could do 4 slightly longer days and one shorter day and pick them up from school & take them out for dinner. He could have them more weeks in the holidays...

He could do a lot of things but doesn't.

bf1000 · 19/10/2014 15:33

OP said it would be picking up at 8pm on friday - he lives an hour away which would mean not getting home till 9pm and thats would make bed time very late for young children.

Not all employees would allow flexability to work longer days and finish early. depending what he does that may not be possible for him.

Yes he could have them more in holidays unless he's in a job that are strict on holiday entitlement and give set dates off or put restrictions on amont of school holiday leave

all details we cant know

clam · 19/10/2014 15:47

But these are decisions working mothers have to make all the time - making their job fit around their children's needs and routines - or vice versa, depending which way you look at it.
And what often happens is that they have to take a hit on their income.

Original poster
foreverdieting · 19/10/2014 16:13

I can't believe what a response this has got. thanks again for all of your thoughts. I don't want it to get into a slanging match though!

Someone mentioned I've not been writting on here much, sorry have been busy! I have read all the comments though.

I'm going to speak to him about it, I need to be strong as he knows he could actually walk all over me. If he really won't pick them up after lunch on Christmas day from here then (like someone else wrote) I will pick them up from his after lunch. However after reading the comments I need to make him aware that he needs to make more of an effort in seeing them/calling/over skype etc on "normal" days going forward.

OP posts:
bf1000 · 19/10/2014 16:20

thanks for update forever - i hope the kids get to see him more frequently after this - good luck with speaking to him

clam businesses are usually more accommodating and understandable of flexible working when it comes to the mothers than the fathers especially when the fathers are NRP in my experience although I realise this isn't across the board.

inabeautifulplace · 19/10/2014 17:04

I can offer a child's perspective. My parents split when I was 10, and I never got to spend Christmas morning with my dad after that as a child. We did do Boxing Day there, but that's always a damp squib in comparison.

Looking back, it would be nice to have a few more memories of my dad at Christmas.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 19/10/2014 17:48

I was also a child once (a long time ago) I used to spend Christmas week (returning day after boxing day)every year from age 4+ with my dad and never with my mum not having Christmas with my mum ever has not had any negative result

whyMe2014 · 26/10/2014 01:05

My husband walked out on me and my 2 children in Aug for the OW.
I have always been the main carer and he never really got involved unless I dragged him.

He has always worked on their birthdays and Christmas. He never read them bedtime stories let alone make up xmas stockings.

Since he moved out he has tried to destroy me, emotionally, financially etc. He has threatened to take the kids and not bring them back.

He doesn't want them in his 'new life' but he is using access as a tool to get to me. I have always put them first.

Why does he have equal rights just because he left us?

How can waking up in a strange house on any day be good for the kids? They need to be in a stable loving environment and he will not provide it.

I think the parent-in-charge (if that's the phrase) should have more of a say over someone who rocks up when they want to.

HeadDoctor · 26/10/2014 01:50

He doesn't have "equal rights". It's the children who have rights, not the parents.

whyMe2014 · 26/10/2014 08:27

If it's the childrens right then they should be able to wake up on Christmas day in a place where they are loved and cared for not as tools to get back at the ex wife.

differentnameforthis · 26/10/2014 09:48

That is the only fAir thing emotionally for them

As someone who NEVER got to spend Christmas with my father, (because my mother wouldn't allow it) I disagree!

whyMe2014 · 28/10/2014 00:22

I think every case is different. Your mother may had a good reason at the time.

My stbxh has been using prostitutes etc and I just don't know what or who will be in his house when my children are there so I'm concerned for their welfare every time he sees them not just at Christmas.

differentnameforthis · 28/10/2014 03:20

Your mother may had a good reason at the time. Nope, just a controlling narcissistic woman who hated my father because he reused to put up with her screwing his brother.

differentnameforthis · 28/10/2014 03:22

I'm concerned for their welfare every time he sees them not just at Christmas. Being concerned for welfare is understandable. I wouldn't suggest any child goes anywhere where their safety is/might be comprised.

However, the op didn't say that...she just doesn't want to wake up without them on Christmas morning. I don see this as a good enough reason to prevent her children having these experiences with their father.

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