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Original poster

Should I just let them carry on stealing?

191 replies

Toytownupthehill · 17/09/2021 07:47

My elderly DM has had tens of thousands of pounds stolen from her by my two siblings for entirely different reasons. When I try to intervene I am told it is none of my business, which is true, it still pains me to see someone stripped of everything that she and my DF worked for. I have power of attorney but I can't stop her being robbed. Should I just give up?

OP posts:
KaptainKaveman · 17/09/2021 12:10

This thread is the drip-feed of the century.

IveGotASongThatllGetOnYNerves · 17/09/2021 12:13

What are your plans to help your mum when all her money has been stolen and she has nothing? Will you be financially supporting her? Have her move in with you?

Waitingforthecowstocomehome · 17/09/2021 12:16

@Toytownupthehill

I am not quite sure how any of this has become my fault, I am fully aware that my relatives are criminal scum but I am not involved with their activities. If I reported them to the police then my DM would have to enter residential care, she doesn't want to do that and it would remove any semblance of independence that she has left.
If she’s getting stolen from left right and centre then the independence thing isn’t going so well. You have a duty to report them to the the Police and adult social care. To fail to do so, is failing in your duty with power of attorney and actually as her daughter as well. You need to take action for goodness sake.
sloutside · 17/09/2021 12:17

What is the point of starting a thread like this in legal matters and then not providing any information at all which would mean people could actually help?

What are the mother's living circumstances? Who does one of OP's siblings have access to the debit card and pin? How is the other sibling stealing from the mother? Why will the mother end up in residential care if OP reports the stealing?
So many questions and no answers.

DomPom47 · 17/09/2021 12:19

Get a new card and change PIN number and you take out the money from mums account. And when she needs to. I am sorry but if you are that concerned yet unable to do anything then a residential facility may be best.

2bazookas · 17/09/2021 12:24

Your DM permits them to spend her money and provided her card and PIN for them to use.

If she still has mental capacity, then I suggest you formally cancel the POA and let hell mend all of them. Then you won't be the person blamed or held responsible for her losses.

If she has lost mental capacity then you should contact her bank and ask what can be done to prevent her, or anybody except the POA, having access to her account and card.
LIke, changing the card PIN.

KaptainKaveman · 17/09/2021 12:26

If the OP is aware of continuous stealing and does nothing about it then she is complicit.

MajorCarolDanvers · 17/09/2021 12:26

@Toytownupthehill

I am not quite sure how any of this has become my fault, I am fully aware that my relatives are criminal scum but I am not involved with their activities. If I reported them to the police then my DM would have to enter residential care, she doesn't want to do that and it would remove any semblance of independence that she has left.
Why would she have to go into residential care if you report this to the police?
Panningforfish · 17/09/2021 12:29

Assuming you’re in England, make a safeguarding referral to Social Services. They will assess for capacity and involve police if needed and support her to stay in her own home if at all possible.

starfishmummy · 17/09/2021 12:31

*It's true you can't act until the person lacks capacity and the LPA is registered

OP hasn't made it clear if that's the case*

This. If the POA has been activated then the OP could stop this
But if the mother still has capacity then it's up to her, however I would be questioning whether she still has capacity if she doesn't realise or care about what is happening.

Lovemusic33 · 17/09/2021 12:31

It’s hard to prove anyone is stealing anything if your DM doesn’t accept what’s happening and has allowed them to use her cards. Unless your DM reports them it’s unlikely anything can be done. I know it’s frustrating, I have relatives like this too but unless you get your DM too see what’s going on and to stop giving them access to her money there’s not much you can do.

Anordinarymum · 17/09/2021 12:38

OP I know someone in exactly the same position as you albeit the other two are not drug addicts.. but they have taken money from 'Mum' over time and it is not small potatoes. One one them has literally had tens of thousands of pounds and the other one is not covered in glory either.
They both managed to turn this around on my friend with power of attorney and all because my friend tried to protect some of the money by keeping it safe.
They were going to call the police.
I think when they realised they were not able to do so since they are thieves it all died down, but now my friend with POA feels like she has the weight of the world on her shoulders with them watching every move even though they have never offered to and will not pay a penny back.
I would say to get good advice before doing a thing

TatianaBis · 17/09/2021 12:42

PoA can be used with the agreement of the individual if they have not lost capacity yet. My father has not lost capacity in general but he can’t get in and out of his bank accounts or keep track of money any more.

I can deal with this banks with his permission.

SpeckledlyHen · 17/09/2021 12:44

@KaptainKaveman

This thread is the drip-feed of the century.
Well I am not even sure it constitutes a drip feed to be honest and there really hasn't been any useful information forthcoming for anyone to help.
TriciaMcMillan · 17/09/2021 13:06

To all the people authoritatively announcing that the individual must lack capacity to activate a financial LPA (not everyone, but a surprising number), this is completely untrue. Financial LPA can be activated by a capacitated individual at their discretion. Amazed how many people are declaring this as indisputable when it's just not true. Health and welfare LPA is a different matter.

www.gov.uk/lasting-power-attorney-duties/start-using-power

Orchid1967 · 17/09/2021 13:08

@Toytownupthehill

None of the money has been given, it has all been stolen.
If its been stolen then you MUST report it to the Police. Most forces have a specialist section that deal with this type of crime as its becoming increasingly common. You can't deal with this on your own so need help. Your local Neighbourhood Police officer will take details and pass it onto the detectives who deal with this.
flippertyop · 17/09/2021 13:10

The information here is so sketchy it's impossible to advise. If you don't want to give the info on here you need to speak to someone you are prepared to tell the full story to

JoborPlay · 17/09/2021 13:13

@Toytownupthehill

I am not quite sure how any of this has become my fault, I am fully aware that my relatives are criminal scum but I am not involved with their activities. If I reported them to the police then my DM would have to enter residential care, she doesn't want to do that and it would remove any semblance of independence that she has left.
Why would she have to go in residential care?

I suggest you:

  • contact the bank and have all access to the account removed for anyone but you.
  • get a new debit card and pin issued
  • contact adult social care about getting your mum carers at home/ alternative accomodation if they are living with the thief
  • contact the police.

If you aren't willing to do those things you need to give up your LPA.

TatianaBis · 17/09/2021 13:19

[quote TriciaMcMillan]To all the people authoritatively announcing that the individual must lack capacity to activate a financial LPA (not everyone, but a surprising number), this is completely untrue. Financial LPA can be activated by a capacitated individual at their discretion. Amazed how many people are declaring this as indisputable when it's just not true. Health and welfare LPA is a different matter.

www.gov.uk/lasting-power-attorney-duties/start-using-power[/quote]
Yep. As I said above I’m using it for my father in exactly that circumstance.

TriciaMcMillan · 17/09/2021 13:26

I saw, but it seemed to be getting drowned out by all the people who knew better!

simitra · 17/09/2021 13:27

Who is telling you it is none of your business?

Your mother or the siblings?

TriciaMcMillan · 17/09/2021 13:28

@TriciaMcMillan

I saw, but it seemed to be getting drowned out by all the people who knew better!
Sorry, that was supposed to be in response to @TatianaBis.
Jux · 17/09/2021 13:29

Does she 'have capacity', though? Could it be said that as she is letting this happen, she doesn't, that she's not able to manage her money?

Why would she have to go into a home if adult social care got involved? Surely, if she were not being robbed then she could pay a carer if they thought she needed one, or they would put care in place for her otherwise.

Sightlinesandsolutions · 17/09/2021 13:33

@TriciaMcMillan sure (though depends on terms), but this isn't about LPAs generally. This thread is about a very particular and very complicated family situation. The OP/attorney is very agitated and, from the little she's divulged, the donor appears unwilling to take any kind of action at all so unlikely to activate. Under the circs, I think it makes sense to keep things as simple as possible.

TatianaBis · 17/09/2021 13:33

@TriciaMcMillan

I saw, but it seemed to be getting drowned out by all the people who knew better!
Very true!