Charlie Gard 13

[muckypup73]

This is a thread following the legal and ethical questions raised by the recent court case involving Charlie Gard.

Please could we refrain from insulting or otherwise "bashing" his parents. It isn't in the spirit of Mumsnet and will get the threads removed.

Please could we also remember that at the heart of this case is a terminally ill baby and his heartbroken parents. There are those participating in and watching this thread for whom these issues are painful. Please let's try and be mindful of them when we post. This isn't a place for name calling or trivialising the very real pain they feel. Many parents of severely disabled children are on here.

Lastly, here are some hopefully useful reference points of facts surrounding the case.

13 July GOSH position statement on latest hearing (includes update on Charlie's condition):
www.gosh.nhs.uk/file/23611/download?token=aTPZchww

7 July GOSH statement on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/news/latest-press-releases/latest-statement-charlie-gard

June 2017 Supreme Court decision:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6rPmvGlNhA&app=desktop

May 2017 Court of Appeal Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2017/410.html

April 2017 High Court Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2017/972.html

GOSH FAQ page on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/frequently-asked-questions-about-charlie-gard-court-case

twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/888812161170116610

I realise the discussion has moved on a bit but I mentioned on the previous thread a TV documentary series about transferring very sick babies and toddlers and said I’d try to find more details. I’ve been able to find two links to the series, but can’t find it on Youtube:

www.radiotimes.com/tv-programme/e/d6mbdg/childrens-accident--emergency-episode-guide/

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04jm8pf

The series is currently being shown on Pick TV (Sky 152) with the title of “Children’s A&E”. It is interesting to watch, though upsetting at times, because it shows how challenging it is to move very sick babies.

chairman of GOSH statement

twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/888813049389428736

twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/888813744616243201

The treatment of the medics is absolutely relevant. But cross posting the hysterical rantings of a number of deluded keyboard warriors is achieving what in your eyes? Apart from giving them more publicity? Do you really think you're performing some sort of public service? That GOSH haven't been aware of the threats being made?
Every so often these threads degenerate into a frenzy of outrage at what other groups are saying. It takes away from the real issues and the measured discussions that have gone before about the legal, medical and ethical issues and the personal accounts that people have shared about their own experiences. And means that ther is a real risk that the threads will be deleted. Report the crap that you read on CA. But think about what it achieves by posting it here.

GOSH could not find anywhere to transfer Charlie to when the relationship with the parents broke down. So moving him is somewhat irrelevant. The parents will not agree with any setting if they do not trust doctors. Plus no hospital or hospice will want a future court case when things go wrong. As they surely will. So any TV programme does not apply in this case.

twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/888814232359366657

I quite like the Holland piece . We've had a turbulent few years (two children born prem and dying, another in hospital for many months) and it helped me look at things differently and put things into perspective. Horses for courses though, it's not going to help everyone.

I think a lot of the CA supporters are going to back down quietly as the family get more and more irrational blaming the hospital...

I am disgusted by the way some people are acting in relation to this. Abuse and death threats to the dedicated staff at GOSH is just beyond the pale. It is getting out of hand.

I find posting CA stuff here to be somewhat distasteful. By and large their views are irrelevant to the court case. GOSH will
deal with harassment via the Police. They are doing that. We should all condemn this deplorable state of affairs. Posters should also recognise that a social media storm is not a riot. I think the needs of this child is the only issue that is the subject of the case and I look forward to a resolution on Tuesday with no chance of an appeal. I think the judge will make it watertight.

The judge has expressly said he cannot go to the Usa at the moment so speculation is a bit futile. No other ICU is about to receive him.

MPs get death threats. Lots of people do. We have nasty elements in society that hide behind social media. I am amazed anyone is surprised. Hardly unexpected.

I've posted occasionally, but not much... Rejoining the discussion now if that's okay.

I saw some comments earlier (think it was the previous page?) about why Charlie himself has so much attention, with comparisons to people not caring about starving children elsewhere in the world, other terminally ill children and I think we have to look at how Charlie is being presented.

He is a cute, white and 'healthy' looking baby. Basically, he is very marketable. Not accusing the parents of marketing him- it's just how it has turned out- but you can see why he's so popular. If he were an adult in a diaper, I doubt there would be the same outcry, as sad as it is.

How stupid can you get?!?! It's another tactic by GOSH and they're making it up..really?!?!

The Metro quote " the couple’s lawyer, Grant Armstrong, argued that the hospital should not have told the court the scan results as it was medical information and should not have been put in the public domain."

Their lawyer is an idiot.

What bloody lawyer doesnt know about disclosure and the on going duty of it.

What about this new child mentioned a while ago on the thread being treated and used as 'new evidence?'

Who is the Alfie that keeps getting mentioned on here.

Well personally I think the sudden resurfacing of death threats etc and behaviour points to one thing really. People are realising what the verdict is more likely to be. And boy, they don't like it. ( has visions of supporters surging into hospital to try and stop it on the day). Wtf has happened to our society?

I cannot see how the judgement can be written up without reference to medical information. Going to court rather means it is public.

He is a little boy at Alder Hey who has been very ill for a few months and nobody can establish why. Alder Hey have discussed end of life options with his family but they are resisting.

Laura Gard has in the last few moments posted a warning on CA that any threatening posts will be reported to the police. I wonder if it's too little too late, given her part in the hysteria that has led to these threats in the first place? Fair play to her for posting that though.

Its made the news on radio 4! Hope they throw the abusers in prison!