Mass sexual assaults in Cologne on New Years Eve Part II

[Pinkchampchoccies]

Just in case people want to continue discussing this.

Remember the rather hefty prison sentences handed out after the recent(ish) London riots? 2yr prison sentence for looting a bottle of wine type of thing. Really seemed to stop the riots pretty quickly. The German judiciary need to follow this example. If they cannot be tried for sexual assault (can't understand how this is even possible in 2016)then there must be some sort of rioting laws in Germany. Even coordinating rapes could be viewed as incitement to riot.

(Not a lawyer so may well be speaking out of my arse)

Luna, try questioning why you're more concerned with the image of refugees and migrants than the women who were attacked. You don't happen to be an ex-social worker in Rotherham, do you?

Cannot believe the response. Army? Water cannon?

Also totally trashed my opinion of the guardian. Feel exactly as water does on first page

It hasn't been largely balanced. If the solution is knee jerk blame when all the facts don't seem to have emerged then I will diasgree.

I am appalled and unnerved by the attacks. Not quite sure with the obsession of pc here. If you're into free speech etc then you should be able tocope with someone disagreeing with you.

Landfriedensbruch should be applicable. Literally "breaking the peace of the land" Maybe nosuchthing could comment as a lawyer. Wiki says it can carry a sentence of up to 10 years of

Several times I've tried to respond to this thread and each time I deleted it, thinking I was being too sensationalistic... But in light of the reports coming out that the attacks happened in so may places on NYE... here goes.

A PP suggested what happened in Cologne was a near-perfect crime - I agree. Easy to organise, to recruit volunteers, no training or specialist equipment required. Easy to move quickly - perhaps this was intended for Munich, as per the intelligence we were told about? Easy to hide it from CCT and to melt into the background afterwards. As another PP said, events like NYE make a good cover.

I've no idea if ISIS or a similar group organised it but I bet they and others are watching the outcome and fallout carefully. It seems to have created a huge amount of unrest and fearfulness. It's encouraged some to up their anti-Muslim rhetoric. It's been an effective attack on the Western values they despise. despite not being as "wam-bam" as guns/bombs. We may yet see more of this sort of thing.

Right, so the women who were attacked, who identified their attackers of being specific ethnic origins, they're making knee-jerk assumptions, are they?

So what's your solution? All I have heard is criticism of this thread.

My only outcome of this is that I will not accept what happened in Germany/Austria as an acceptable byproduct of anything. And I don't care what the anything is, I will NOT accept it.

One service Man = terror attack.
Mass organised attack on Women = let's cover it up.

. It's encouraged some to up their anti-Muslim rhetoric. No, not anti-Muslim rhetoric. Anti-ideology- that-is negative-toward-Western-women-and-all-that-entails rhetoric.

Thanks fourmummy - that's a better way of putting it.

I will not accept what happened in Germany/Austria as an acceptable byproduct of anything

This.^
Whether it's organised terror or just random drunken horny men, whether it's recent migrants or 2nd generation, whether it's hatred of women or a desire to teach the West a lesson... I don't care. It's not acceptable to feel entitled to sexually assault a woman. The feeling of entitlement is what needs to be dealt with.

Just checking into the new thread. Thanks.

I'm never buying the Guardian again and will be telling them so. Every sector matters to them except women.

Can any good come out of this?

What about a link for the Guardian to this thread on twitter?

No Council, have some common sense. I am talking about the knee jerk responses, such as the need to restrict refugee intake or to make immigration law stricter when there is no evidence that the attacks were organised solely by people that have just arrived in Germany. I am also talking about the generalisations which seem to suggest it is representative of Islamic culture. Even if the attacks were orchestrated by recently arrived refugees, the number carrying out the attacks is still only 0.1 per cent of the amount that entered Germany last year.

The facts do not minimise the seriousness of the assualts or the need for these criminals to be punished.

Whilst the enormity of the attack is unprecedented, the behaviour is not. Women are assaulted by men in the street, in nightclubs, on trains by men of all kinds. This goes on daily. One youtuber, Sam Pepper, even assaulted women on his youtube channel and thought he would get away with it by describing it as a 'social experiment.' Footballers and other young men have gang raped women, all from various backgrounds.

Vertigo that's a very good idea- can anyone do that?

I think this needs a massive, loud, bolshy march through Cologne. I'd love to jump on the bus and join in.

ME men like these, full of hatred and resentment over many issues political & personal, hate European women. I have it from my Iraqi friend and his wife that the EW is indeed referred to as "white meat". That is a piece of information for this thread and not a generalisation. Do you honestly think they refer to EW by nice names?

As regards assumptions ... I'm not sure what you mean in this context. Airport and homeland security is based on possibilities/probabilities; the world's stock exchanges exist on 'probability' as do medical diagnoses, etc. And the biggest area that has 'probability' at its core is the Actuary industry.

It would be remiss of any city or police dept not to anticipate that this type of attack will occur again, perpetrated by men of same origins. It's happened in Cologne, Hamburg, Bielefed, Frankfurt, Stuttgart, Austria and Switzerland. It would be irrational to be on alert for another similar attack but look at an entirely different ethnic group. Where is the logic in that?

@Guardian on Twitter. Think of adding a punchy has tag that has a German translation.

Polenta, it is not an acceptable byproduct. I am not arguing that, there are no excuses for it. It should have been reported sooner and condemned more vehemently and the blame should never have been ascribed to the ladies it happened to.

Nobody should have to put up with being attacked. There is a sense of entitlement in many men and the laws we have in place in many European countries largely let the attacker off the hook. People should be prosecuted. We have laws for that, but they don't seem to address it. The problem seems to be where men get their ideas about women and sense of entitlement in the first place and tackling misogyny.

Oh FFS give it up LunaLodbrok

Stop trying to minimise this, by comparing what happens to women in Western countries every week, that is exactly what you are doing.

Just stop now, stop with the derailing.

When there have been similar incidents in Sweden and, German police officers from Cologne have denied claims from higher-ups, according to which the perpetators were unknown. Most people controlled were Syrians. Perpetators did it mostly for "sexual amusement" is published in the welt, I don't think it's 'Kneejerk' to start looking at immigration policy

Yes white people do also rape, but this type of incident hasn't happened before and if reports are to be believed there is a common trait amongst the purporators wether they are first/second or third generation then that is still a fundamental issue in which we should also be looking at the immigration policy.

Luna
Your minimisation is out-fucking-rageous Luma Oooo Yes rapes happen. Ooo Yes gang rapes, ooh yes Ched (Chad whatever his name is) Evans. Oooh Grim shit. You will surely agree.

The ''La La La', things happen eh?' is bad enough...

But where there are 100s (the multiple to be debated) attacking 100s (factual) of women? Get a fucking grip; this is a completely different level

luna you are derailing for the sake of it.

For the sake of women everywhere, enough now. If the cultural issue cannot be talked about now, then when can it?

#StopMinimisingMassOrganisedAssaultTerrorismOnWomen