Lelarose Desperately Depressed #2

[thatsnotmymonkey]

Hi Lela, I hope this is OK, come over here. We will all be here for you. xx

Hi Lela

Just popping by to say hello and hope you are ok and feeling happier with the feeding. I was wondering how you were bearing up with DPs bereavement too.
Take care

Hi there. Thank you so much for thinking of me, can't believe you guys are still here you are so lovely.

I am only really able to breast feed ds first thng in the morning now which is really upsetting and I feel dreadfully guilty about it. It does however mean that dp can do a lot of the night feeding, and this is a tremendous help to my mental health.

Things are quite strained with me and dp as he is grieving but doesn'y talk about it much (typical man) and he has not had much work for a while.

I get terribly down some days and still wonder how good a mother I can really be with all my probems, but ds is really a gorgeous boy so I am very fortunate really I guess.

How are you guys?

Hey Lela, have been wondering about you. I am sorry things are not easy.

I think you will be just fine because it matters to you to be a good mother, so even if it doesn't fall into place naturally you care enough to compensate.
And that makes 100% difference.

I have some depression issues and apart form a couple of really bad times work hard not to let it impact on my 2 DC's. They know Mummy has sad times and I truly believe that we are close because I am honest with them whilst not making them 'responsible'.

And I have learnt to fake it if needs be. If it were a physical disability your little one would grow up with that and you 'manage', well in my opinion that can be the same with MH issues.

And I agree with Habbibu, in the end you compromise quite a few of your ideals, or at least alter them because it doesn't quite work and it is more damaging to doggedly persist at trying to be fixed than saying, OK, haw can we adapt and meet our needs.

Lela, you asked how I got better. I think a lot of it wsa just time, but there were a few other factors.

1. This was my 2nd. I'd suffered with depression after my 1st, also. Indeed, I think that it never really left me. But, being my 2nd, I'd already learnt that nothing you ever do will feel good enough. I'm a million times more relaxed with my second. We're presented an image of motherhood that is utterly unrealistic.

2. Medication. I'm still not there, even now as AD's send me hypomanic. (There's a question mark over whether I'm bipolar II), but medication has been an important part.

3. Getting a break from the kids, and accepting that it's OK that I want to be something other than a Mum occasionally.

4. More than anything else, going back to work. This didn't help that much after my first, as I was full of guilt and feelings that I was a terrible mother for enjoying my time away. I'm over that now. Work creates a balance in my life.

As I say, it's taken a long time. Best wishes.

Hi Lela - I'm still hanging around (like a bad smell!). Glad you are getting more sleep, it makes such a difference. Are you going to have another review with your psychiatrist, it might be worth getting something booked in as your hormones change when you stop b'feeding, just in case?? Sorry DP has gone into his cave to grieve, I am sure though that it must be a comfort to him that his parents met his DS so it's good that you got pregnant more quickly than expected IYSWIM. All ok-ish here, went back to work a couple of weeks ago, very different experience this time. I'm quite enjoying it which makes me realise I was actually ill before, not a workshy layabout! Take care, thinking of you.

Don'trun's tips are very good, lela - mostly good ideas for everyone, PND or no. You will get over the bf-ing guilt with time.

Hi thanks all of you for your tips. Funny you should mention work, as I've just started thinking about what would be involved in me going back. I visited my work yesterday and it literally made me feel ill with stress just being there. I think this is partly because it reminds me of how ill I was in pregnancy, when I was there trying to keep up a front all the time. Plus I hate my job.

Saw the hv today and she said ds is doing brilliant- she says he is more like a 6 month old than a 4 month old- good size, very alert (everyone tells me this, I dont know what a 4 month baby is usually like so maybe don't realise if he is particularly bright). She says he is really thriving, so not to worry about the breast feeding. So am trying to let it go.

Ever since I got pregnant dp has been putting pressure on me tp move 2 hous away to the countryside/small town where he is from (I live in a city). I told him that I didn't want to move for the first year of the baby's life as I had obligations to my work and also I thought I'd have more support here. Where I live is fabulous in terms of everything being on my doorstep, loads of mother baby stuff and I have made good friends with other new mums locally. I love living here. He hates it and is adamant about bringing ds up in a rural environment, which I can see the benefits of. Basically we have been discussing/ arguing about moving for the last year.

When his mum died at the begining of the year, I felt so bad for his dad (dp is an only child) being on his own now that I basically gave in and said we could move as soon as my obligation to return to my job for a while after receiving maternity pay is fulfilled (I think I have to go back for min 3 months or pay back maternity pay). Today the hv was telling to me about nurseries and I told her about moving and she asked me if that is what I wanted and I realised that, for all my talk about how I want to do this for dp and ds (I am the only one who would really benefit from staying here), and how I'll adapt and how it'll be an adventure, I really REALLY dont want to go. I feel sick at the thought and I know in my heart that I will be even more isolated and depressed there.

Dp is now saying I should go back to work asap in order to work out the time I owe them so we can move, or that he will find a way to pay back my maternity money so I dont have to go back. I tried calling HR today to find out my options but no one in. I feel rigid with tension and sick with stress. I am not ready to go back to work or to move. The strain of this is killing our relationship- there is NO WAY he will agree to stay living here much longer, so I am at a total loss. HV says I have to be selfish as my mental health will affect ds but lifes not like that when you are in a relationship is it?

People ask if there is a compromise, ie living somewhere in between but that is not an option as there is no point whatsoever in moving where we both know no one and have no reason to be there.

Sorry ridiculously long post but didn't realise how strongly I felt about this and have no one to talk to.

Hi Lela - didn't want to leave this unanswered, not sure I have the right advice but hope someone else will be along who is wise. It must be hard to separate whether you feel negative about moving because you are depressed, or whether all the pressure to move is contributing to your depression. My personal feeling is that you won't be able to work out how you really feel unless you can put the decision on the backburner until you are well. This might mean DP needs to be told that the subject of moving is not up for discussion for at least three months (or whatever timescale you feel comfortable with, that was just an example, not a prescription!) so that you can get well without additional pressure. I'm not sure what to say about going back to work to get the maternity benefit, for me going back to a job that I didnt feel happy with while ill with PND was not a good experience, but I guess a lot that would depend on why you don't like your job. If you feel the job is relatively easy and well within your comfort zone then it might be a really good thing for your self esteem. Hope you are ok and can have a nice weekend.

Thank you for replying. My job involves helping people with serious problems, which I am actually very good at, but I have neither the energy or the inclination to do it anymore.

I think you are going to have to be very straight with dp, and point out how it will affect him and ds. He needs to properly understand that you are ill, that it is an illness which is exacerbated by stress and isolation, both of which this move would bring in bucketloads. If you move away from where your friends and support network are, the responsibility for helping you through your illness falls squarely on his shoulders. Is he really prepared to face up to that responsibility and think through properly what it entails.

And while your ds is so wee the rural environment is really neither here nor there. It'll make no difference to him where he lives until he's at least, say, 3, but it will make a difference if the support network for his main carer (you) is removed. Your dp needs to think about all of this. The first year of a baby's life is hard, and my inclination would be Very Much to put things on hold until ds is a bit older and until you are a lot better. And you are getting better, so the environment you're in is clearly one that's conducive to improving your mental health.

As for work, I think that given you need to go back in order not to lose your mat pay, you should treat it as a decision you don't have to make, which is in some ways a relief sometimes. Some time where you are not "on duty" for ds may actually be good for you, and then you can see whether you're simply marking time at work, in which case, give notice, or whether the part of your brain which enjoyed being good at your job, and is no longer overwhelmed by the stress of pregnancy, kicks back in.

Thanks habbibu, you are spot on but dp will not accept this and now I've agreed to it because I feel so awful about his mum dying and its just a big old mess.

I feel like printing out your post there and showing it to him as it sums it up so well, but I dont want him to know about this thread and anyway he would just say I will make friends easily through the baby and not be isolated. I dont have any reason whatsoever to want to move to this place whatsoever other than to keep him happy.

Ask him to read up on PND, then, and then tell you that it's going to be so easy. he needs to face up to the fact that this may well make his life more difficult, not easier, and that the best decisions are rarely made at times of great emotion and great stress.

And you moving won't bring his mum back, it won't take away the pain, it won't fix anything.

I know, it was to help his dad really.

I dont think I have pnd as such but I am pretty sure I will go right down again with depression if I move there.

I have to go to bed now but hope to speak soon. Thanks x

I'm having one of the worst days of my life.

I read the threads on here about people genuinely regretting having children and question whether I feel the same and it terrifies me, because I cant hand on heart say no.

I wanted this baby so much, motherhood was my only ambiton in life, and now my world is falling apart.

Dp is away this weekend (back tonight) so I have been doing the night feeds again and its killing me. What the fuck was I expecting- babies need fed at night, deal with it for fuck's sake. My son has developed this habit of thrashing his head from side to side when I'm trying to feed him but when I take the bottle away he cries. I find this really hard to deal with at 3am when I am beyond exhausted and it takes twice as long to feed him. It makes me feel like screaming.

All the stuff he does is normal baby stuff I am just under so much stress and pressure I cant cope, its ridiculous. I know all new mums struggle and babies are not easy. This is very very hard to say, but because he is a boy I feel as if I cant even look forward to the future, I can't imagine being really close to him as he grows up. I'm having therapy for this, but the psychologist keeps cancelling appointments.

After feeding him during the night I was trying to get back to sleep and all I could think about was how to commit suicide. My thoughts go like this: It's the only way out, how shall I do it? I could just get up tomorrow, give him to my neighbour to babysit or something and then make everything stop. Then imagine myself hanging or taking an overdose and just falling asleep. Then I think no, no how will this ever be explained to my child in the future without it damaging him, how will dp cope?

I just cant go on like this. Sorry its not fair to share this on here but I couldn't possibly admit it in real life. I'm not threatening to kill myelf, I just dont know what to do. I'm not calling the Smamaritans, I just can't, sorry. I want to clean my house then go and buy some food and cook a nice dinner for dp coming home but I have only just managed to get dp to stop whingeing and have a nap and I had to get this out somehow.

Sorry sorry sorry I shouldn't be doing this i just am lost, I'm reaching breaking point again. I feel like I dont want to be a mother- I'm too old and too selfish to adjust to devoting myself to someone elses needs, my relationship is not stable enough and nor is my mental health. I really believed I would love it, I dont and I fear the future.

I always felt so alone I thought having a family would make me feel like I belonged, but all its done is make me feel like shit. I

lela - will be back asap. stay put.

ok, listen - you are in hardest bit of new motherhood, and you're doing it the hard way on your own for much of the time. Your family has just been through enormous stress and grief. It's not surprising you feel rotten, and it's ok to feel crap about something you thought would be wonderful. But you do need to get more help for your mental health - who are you seeing atm?

Checking in, lela - how are you this morning? Please try not to read your current state of mind as indicative of how your whole future is mapped out - life with ds will get easier, dp will find his grief more manageable, you will get more sleep.

Oh lelarose. You poor thing. You kindly posted on my thread about everyone being a better mother than me, and it was helpful, so let me try in some small way to make you feel better. I realise there are wider issues though which I hope others are helping you to work through both here and in real life, so this is just in ref to your last post.

Firstly - babies are bloody annoying sometimes. Just because it is normal for them to wake at 3am does not mean you have to smile sweetly while you pander to their whims. Even "Myleene fucking Klass" (ref your comment on my thread ) isn't supermum at 3am. Go punch a cushion or something equally satisfying if it helps you get out your anger. I go into another room and roar sometimes, until I'm so tired I'm not stressed anymore.

Secondly - I used to feel suicidal sometimes, if I could be arsed to actually do it. Now I adopt what I call a siege mentality. It's where I assume that everything from now on in my whole life is going to be shit, and when it (invariably) isn't, and I have a delightful hour with my DS, or he sleeps better, or I share a joke with someone at baby group I hold on to that very very tightly (almost obsessively so). It's these small nuggets of simple pleasures that keep me sane, and I see the small light at the end of the tunnel growing bigger. Eg. he will soon not need my breastmilk so I can stop the sodding pumping, he will be able to sit up and stop killing my back holding him on his playmat etc, he will be able to walk and talk soon-ish and all I have to do for now is get through day to day and head towards the light if that's not stretching the analogy too far.

Thirdly - I also don't know if I regret having children, but as it is too late to think about that now I am just trying to put that question on ice and try to answer it in twenty years when I have this big strapping, gorgeous, confident lad that I've raised and who still loves his mum as number one.

Fourthly - I too worry that my DS isn't going to be close to me growing up. But I don't accept that as a fait accompli, and will work on ways to be close to him. Maybe not fiddling about with a spanner under a car or going to watch planes at an airshow but real emotional support, guidance, coaching, taking him out for big dinners, playing board games, making sure we have "mum and son" time. If mums and sons weren't naturally close there wouldn't be the phrase "mummy's boys" or, conversely "daddy's girls" as having a daughter would be no guarantee of closeness.

You need some "you" time to recover your identity instead of trying to use your relationships with other people and "the family unit" as the key to your own happiness. I am still figuring out how to achieve this myself!

Agree with Habbibu that this is the hardest bit. It MUST MUST MUST get better, or we would all be only children.

Hi thank you both.

habbibu I was going to reply to you last night, sorry, but ended up talking to dp. I took a deep breath and said I regret having ds. The upshot is he says the problem we have is my "illness", I personally dont know where the illness ends and the stressful circumstances begin if you see what I mean. We have both agreed things cannot possibly continue as they are but I am stuck as to what to do next. I was seeing a psychologist once a week but she has cancelled several times including last week and I dont know when she'l be back which is a shame as she agreed to see us both together.

Sadly, I don't agree that this is the hardest part of motherhood. I believe that when he is up and moving about will be harder for me as I have zero energy to deal with a toddler.

Biggingercat who did I think I was posting on your thread when I was feeling like this? I just thought you should know you are not as bad as you think. You are still expressing milk to feed your child- I have stopped bf except for once a day because I found it too exhausting and hate myself for it so much.

Do I have PND? I dont know, it seems a convenient label as I was depressed before I had him and its not just my hormones ts the stress of my relationship and trying to accept I have to bring up a boy which I have no confidence to do. I 'm not saying pnd is just hormones, I dont know what I'm trying to say, just I was fucked up before I had a baby. Dp says he'll never have another one with me now, so thats another dream shattered due to my mental health.

I'm sat unwashed in my pyjamas after a horrible sleepless night ignoring my child to type this. (Fyi biggingercat I've put him on his tummy and he hates it)

I cant go on how I am but dont know where to turn now. I look at his beautiful innocent ittle face and it doesn't make me want to carry on living, it makes me want to get out of his life so I can't make him unhappy too. I realise how melodramatic that sounds but its how I feel.

Have to get dcs' lunch just now, but will come back to talk to you asap. I'm really glad you talked to dp, and that he is at least seeing that there is a genuine problem - this strikes me as important.

lela - at least you bf directly, even once a day. I can't be bothered with it as have no patience. I think anyone who does it, having tried and not had much success, is a flippin' legend.

I'm ignoring my DS at the moment too. I'm sure he won't remember.

Your DP is speaking in the heat of the moment. He probably means it now, and yes, another baby would CURRENTLY be a bad idea, but it may well change if you BOTH are able to address your issues. He seems to be part of the problem after all.

You badly need couples counselling (I have had it with my DP and it was very helpful). I would cut my losses and find another therapist who can commit to you properly without cancelling all the time.

You are your child's hero, the centre of his world and he can't see inside your head. He will only judge you by your actions (and you seem to be doing perfectly well on that score). Remembering that makes me carry on when things feel very very bleak.

Thank you for your honesty bgc, I think my biggest failing as a person and now as a mother is that I too have no patience.

We will def have couples counselling, I'm glad it worked for you.

I talked to a friend (another mum i just met through the baby) today about feeling like ashit mum and she was very supportive

Off to bed as phenomenally tired. Hope to speak to you again soon x

Argh - sorry it's taken so long to get back to you. BGC is spot on and very wise. I should tell you that I see your impatience and raise you an hundredfold - I'm hideously impatient, worse than a toddler. DH will back me up on this - his "just coming" sends me into a tailspin.

Being a "good enough" parent isn't just "good enough" - it's the right approach to take for your child. You can't be other than who you are, so you need to muddle out an approach to being a parent that makes the most of your strong points, and mitigates the weak ones. So I'm impatient, bad tempered and massively intolerant of whining, but I am good at going back to DD, telling her when I was wrong, and apologising, and she loves that - it makes her really happy. And ignoring your children is good for them - dd is brilliant at playing by herself (mostly re-enacting Octonauts atm, but hey, it's still imaginative). They don't need constant attention, just food, shelter, cleanliness and knowing that you love them.

I imagine the friend felt good that you'd owned up to difficulties - I think most people feel rotten a lot of the time, but it takes one person to drop the mask and say "god, I feel crap at this" before other people can say with relief "god, me too!", and then you all realise you're doing roughly the same, and your babies are doing fine.

I hope you get some sleep, lela. Hang on in there.