Leavers Lagoon - all systems are go. all lights are green

[surferjet]

Good news yesterday < gets out green highlighter >
Still work to be done but it’s another step in the right direction.

Ps: completely given up on the Brexit Arms as it’s been taken over by remainers.
This is our chilled out place to post on in the run up to March 2019.

Positive people only

Assuming you meant me by she' (bit of an assumption)

As previously discussed, the demographic of MN is predominately women - apologies if I triggered you in any way by misgendering.

Erasure of maleness is such a problem after all, I'd hate to be complicit in it.

or we walk....

And we break an International Treaty. How noble of us.

And if by magic, someone pops up to prove the point:

Merely repeating what other Leavers have said on this and other threads.

NI will be sorted

Lets hope it is - in some way that is acceptable to the Northern Irish. Otherwise the whole place could go up in flames again. Have you ever been there? It’s a beautiful country.

or we walk

Much as I love this country , there is a tiny part of me that wants this to happen , so we can put paid to this nonsense forever.

So having, I hope, established that we all value the premise and successful operation of the International Treaty that is the GFA/BA/peace agreement,
do leavers accept that leaving the EU28 must wait until that issue is resolved and the international peace treaty amended by agreement of all the parties to it, together with any constitutional steps required to adopt the amendment(s) to reflect the agreed resolution?

Yes been there.
I hope for peace. But also common sense.
The leaving of the EU is an extraordinary event people can do and will react to these events and accept it can mean changes.
Only an ignorant person would say never never never it can't be done.. after all a tree that won't bend will snap in a storm and die.

The trade bit is so so telling.... it means no to your BINO

It's not at all because, as you've admitted by default, there's no countries we couldn't have traded with before.

The EU have said, crack on, negotiate deals with countries you could have traded with before, and you think that's a great break through.

Your argument might stand up mummmy if the Irish had had a referendum and also voted to Leave. Despite Farage's noisy efforts they haven't done and nor does it look likely. So the ball is firmly back in the Westminster court - either break an international treaty, or stay within the CU/SM.

You’d have to be pretty ignorant not to realise how fragile peace in NI is. The assembly has been collapsed for a year, no accountability on the cash for ash scandal yet potentially ripping up GFA is not a worry to brexiteers

I'm with you frumpety, part of me actually wants this to go massively tits up.

Part of me would like us to walk off the clif and fall flat on our face.

At least then we'd have to deal with the aftermath and quickly, instead of stringing it out pretending everything will be fine.

Yes, the only thing that pisses me off is that the inevitable BINO will lead to continued whinging by the headbangers.

Peregrina

As you say, the alternatives are:

"So the ball is firmly back in the Westminster court - either break an international treaty, or stay within the CU/SM."

This would appear to be the case, as no-one has come up with any other viable and immediately implementable solution (apart from currently non-existent technical means). But Brandy has said above:

"Of course the border between NI and ROI is a real matter to be dealt with and the GFA is worth fighting for. Why on earth do you think anyone would think other wise?"

That being the case, we're left with the other alternative of remaining in the SM/CU.

Everyone happy with that?

I would be happy with that , business would be happy with that , we can still do all these amazing trade deals and our Parliament remains sovereign as it always was , its a win win

Do we still get a say in everything that happens in the EU ? do we still get the MEP's no-one ever seemed overly bothered voting for ?

By the time it gets to that, and I have no doubt it will, it will be Leavers idea.

frumpety

"Do we still get a say in everything that happens in the EU ? do we still get the MEP's no-one ever seemed overly bothered voting for ?"

Ah, there's the rub, as Mogg points out in his "vassal state" comments, with which I have some sympathy (mind bleach needed). The only way I can then see over that hurdle is to remain within the EU, which both preserves the GFA and prevents us from being a vassal state.

Which Leavers can't agree with, so round we go again.

It won't be BINO...
It will be free trade as the ability to sort trade deals hints at if you just stop your inability to see change is ahead.
DD told you this...
GFA will be altered to deal with this unless they want no deal and boarder as WTA will by default Demand it...
It's not a case of we broke the agreement it will be seem as it happened because the GFA never covered an exit plan....an unforseen once only event...

TBH, the fecking useless MEPs like Farage and the rest of the UKIPers are hardly going to be missed.

There are many, many leavers who didn't give Northern Ireland a moment's thought before casting their vote - Fine (well, ish)

There are almost as many leavers who don't see why they have to think about it now - Not fine.

'Northern Ireland will be sorted' is a facile, idiotic thing to say. It's a really complex problem. And it is leave's to solve. Face up to responsibilities.

'We will walk' is unforgivable. I don't think leavers really understand how that would be viewed internationally. As if the UK hasnt done enough to tank its reputation.

So over to you Leavers. As it stands, staying in the customs union is the only answer (as the EU have also concluded).

If you don't want that, then we need some seriously hard graft from the leave side and the best minds on the job. Bear in mind that the GFA was decades in the making and involved some serious firepower from U.K., Ireland and beyond.

There may be a way, but the powers that be need to get cracking. So far they've achieved nothing.

OFDO mummmy you can't even name countries we want to 'sort trade' deals with.

One prominent leaver on the brexit arms thread admitted ages ago that she had no idea how NI and Brexit would work. Worn as a badge of honour.

Do you think David Davies would have had the skills to negotiate the GFA?

Mummy how, under the GFA/BA/peace agreement - "GFA will be altered to deal with this"? What are the steps that must be taken to alter this international treaty? Clue - it's in the Treaty and International law.

Mummy2017
GFA will be altered to deal with this unless they want no deal and boarder as WTA will by default Demand it...
It's not a case of we broke the agreement it will be seem as it happened because the GFA never covered an exit plan....an unforseen once only event...

Why do people keep talking about the GFA being altered as if it's something that will happen easily.
Have you any idea how difficult it was to agree the GFA.
The Irish Government and Nationalist parties are parties to the agreement, they oppose a border. Please tell me how you're going to "amend" the GFA without their agreement?

As for your "unless they want no deal" - that sounds like a threat.

So over to you Leavers

Has been said a million times before, but....

Do you actually, truly believe that the few leavers who post on these threads are part of the Brexit negotiating team?

Really?