Where have all the Brexiters gone?

[MsHooliesCardigan]

Just that really. 52% voted to leave. I know Mumsnet isn't completely representative of the electorate but you would expect at least a few people to be banging the Brexit drum. The ones that were quite vocal seem to have lost their voice. Perhaps they're just bored with the whole thing but their silence really is deafening.

I don't know, feels like they're everywhere to me. Though that may be because I heard Bernard Jenkin on Today in the morning and the squirmy little fucker has been in my head ever since. Like the voices.

I also saw this being discussed on twitter today, in connection with Dominic Cummings pulling his account.

Financial plugs being pulled and/or the threat of legal action making people more cautious?

My above comment doesn't apply on here of course - I'm not suggesting that all the Brexit supporters on MN are shills - though we haven't had any visiting brexitspammers for a while.

I think that aside from a small number of people who really care about Brexit (either for or against) most have just got bored of the issue, and on the Brexit side probably a bit frustrated about progress too.

I suspect all the cheerleaders we had on here (apart from the paid ones, of course, who used to keep popping up every time it looked like there might be a problem - but as it's a new problem daily have probably got other places to spam), are very slowly starting to realise what an absolute clusterfuck it's turning in to, and have slunk away with their tails between their legs...

There's not a single Brexiteer, either on here or IRL, that can answer even the most basic questions about how the obstacles can be overcome so they've all gone back to their head in sand, fingers in ears, happy place.

There has been a significant reduction in the number on twitter too in the last 2 weeks. I suspect they were shillbots. Still get the "we won, you lost, get on with it" evangelist types though.

More like the twilight zone, especially on here. The threads all read exactly the same.

Remainer: pretends to want calm discussion with a winning smile

Brexiter pops up

Remainer: you’re just a fucking racist cunt really aren’t you? Believe the bus did you? Etc....... other rabid insults.

Brexiter: ‘sigh’

And on.....

To me anyway.

Can anyone explain to me how Brexit can get through Parliament.

The Government has a wafer thin majority.
Some Tories - Ken Clarke for example - will vote against regardless.
Other Tories in particular the Scottish Tories will vote against if it is a bad deal which is the most likely outcome.
Lib Dems are against as are the SNP.
So the interesting question is what will Labour - who are as divided as the Tories - do? Vote in favour of Brexit and thus prop up the Tory government? Or vote against on the grounds that while the people have spoken the deal is unacceptable? This will bring down the government and force a general election which on current form they would probably win.
I suppose Labour might be very cynical and support a rubbish deal in the expectation that the ensuing disruption would help to boost their numbers even more a year or so down the line. But that would be very high risk.

gamerchick that is utter nonsense.

I've never seen anyone called a 'fucking racist cunt' on here.

People do, quite rightly, get called out if they make racist comments though.

The reality is Leavers all bail out as soon as actual answers are requested.

When the rhetoric and sound bites run out, the silence is deafening.

Christ on a bike

Getting through Parliament? I suspect it depends on how many Labour rebels there are. I don't hold out much hope for a Tory rebellion - a lot of noise, and all bar Ken Clarke will dutifully troop through the Government lobby. Maybe not the Scottish Tories, but I am not 100% sure of them.

Gamerchick is right in all but the language.

Most have given up

I am not happy the way it’s going, almost makes you wonder if it’s intentional fuckwittery from the arsehats in the cabinet.

We don’t have all of the answers you seek, a leap into the unknown is never clear.

This is how strongly many leave voters feel about the EU that we are willing to go through this uncertain shitstorm to avoid a United Federal Europe with an EU army, one EU president and very little local economic power due to the creation of the European Minister of Economy and Finance.

At least we stayed out of the single currency, that might well have been the point of no return.

If I was a brexiter, I wouldn't bother with mumsnet Eu ref threads, the conversation does tend to be the same always so why should they bother. They don't have the answers to remainers questions and I guess they are mainly just content with the way things are going or not . Who knows.

museli we'd all be in a better place if people had put a bit more thought into the actual repercussions of leaving rather than being solely led by paranoid notions of the most extreme of outcomes.

I've always said I voted Remain as there was and is no plan to Leave.

You can't run a country based only on a desire to prevent something that's not even likely, to the detriment of everything else.

I fear decades of economic hardship and a bleak future for our children more than an irrational fear of eu armies or turkey joining.

The fact TM can't even say she would vote Leave now speaks volumes.

I'm sure most Remainers are dying to hear an argument which makes us think we were wrong.

I'd love to hear TM say 'I did vote Remain but because of x, y z I now believe that Leaving is the best thing for the country'

The trouble is, she can't because there are no upsides to speak of.

Bear,

Not paranoia, I am referring to Jean-Claude Junckers recent State of the Union speech.

TM would never vote leave either way, she supported remaining.

We. Had. A. Veto.

Why would they be banging drums? It's over. It's been over a really long time. This is starting to get a bit pathos guys. Just get over it and pray that the tories don't screw it up maybe talk about something useful, like the best way to make brexit work and brexit priorities?

What gamerchick said at 16:15:51
Debates (term used loosely) get very tedious when the opposite side deliberately misunderstand you and misrepresent your position.

We don’t have all of the answers you seek, a leap into the unknown is never clear.

How often do people in their personal lives take complete leaps into the unknown? Not often I would hazard a guess, unless they are really desperate as e.g. refugees fleeing war.

I still say that it's up to the Leavers to make it work - they want it, they should have some clear ideas - telling us to get over it won't solve any problems.

Nah, not biting.

gamerchick nailed it.

The tedious nature of debate with remain supporters stopped me bothering. That and the constant, moronic co-opting of those who didn't even vote onto their count as if non voters can be considered to be siding with their view but not mine meant it just become an exercise in confronting wilful stupidity which wasn't really going to get anywhere. Repeated pointing out that young people are not smarter than older people because they went to university when access was massively expanded and older people didn't have the same chance gets wearing. Pointing to evidence that IQ has shifted a tiny tiny bit in the time since IQ tests were devised as proof that the slur on stupid older people has no merit and being told I was stupid gets wearing. Pointing out the assumption errors and biases in the Treasury model and the uncertainty range is much greater than the relatively small delta gets you nowhere so I stopped bothering.

If anything I wonder why remain supporters seem to be willing a disaster on the Uk and supporting some frankly confrontational and obstructive bahviour on the part of the EU. So the EU wants to damage the Uk after it votes to leave. I understand that, spurned lover etc. What I don't understand is that remain supporters saying this proves we shouldn't have voted out as if staying in an organisation that consistently fails to live up to its principles and resists reform is a good thing. The EUs quasi imperialist "trade but only on my terms" approach is rather proving the points made about sovereignty and decision making for many.

but hey.... being called a rascist xenophobic ill-educated cunt does get wearing, especially when called that by people who think they are so tolerant of the views of others.

As for Bearbehinds comment that voting remain as there was no leave plan prepared by the remain supporting establishment is interesting. No planning went on by express command of the hierarchy who were campaigning to remain. There were plans and commentary prepared by others outside of government with opinions on what the Uk could opt for. Some made for very interesting reading indeed.

Brexit is a hot ticket right now where I am and smart people who want their profile raising are heading that way. I can't do the hours given my parental responsibilities but as problems arise people are working the problem on the assumption that nothing is known on exit. Novating several trillion of notional EUR derivatives to new entities in the EU is going to be a challenge. Only 18 months to go.

There were plans and commentary prepared by others outside of government with opinions on what the Uk could opt for. Some made for very interesting reading indeed

Have you followed up Pete and Richard North’s commentary at all?

The more intelligent Leavers accept it’s clusterfuck. The less intelligent have gone very quiet. The least intelligent along, with Tory Taliban and propaganda rags, are the only ones left banging the Brexit drum.