Is it selfish to leave a good man?

[MadridGirl]

First time post but been reading this stuff for years!

I have told my husband our 18 year relationship is over. He is having some sort of break down as a result. He has always been a very helpful and kind person. He's says he loves me and will do anything. I feel horribly responsible for his mental health.

He never shouts, has never been violent. Does his best to be good and right and kind. But he is also very anxious, moody and withdrawn. For years he has avoided deep conversations, rarely touches me (I have to explicitly say I want him to and be very encouraging) sex is less than a few times a year, doesn't have friends etc.

Very attentive to the children and a very reliable dad. Never spends on himself. Does loads of housework, very selfless but sometimes he does these things to hide from connecting. He always denied this, said it was because life is busy etc. It's true that we've had some tough experiences- but all families do... I asked him to see a counsellor with me and also told him I couldn't live life like this unless something changed. Every time I raised it he would minimise, dent, he always refused and just got so upset and offended that I had criticised our relationship, in the end up I just gave up reaching out to him.

He agreed to see a doctor and a counsellor about a year ago when I really put my foot down, but he didn't do either in the end.

He has explicitly said he doesn't believe in talking about feelings, it makes things worse for him, not better.

Now I have said that I don't want to be with him he is shocked and distressed. He's acting as though I've gone mad and that I am selfish because we have two children.

He will insist on having the children half the time. He is being very nice to me at the moment but I know it's because he isn't taking me seriously and thinks I'll change my mind. I won't. I feel that under the surface he is furious. It's taken years to get here, and I am now done. I am almost phobic about him now, I don't want to be close to him- I am so much happier when I don't have to deal with his feelings. I want to be on my own and stop carrying all his anxiety and moods. I don't want to be with an introvert, it makes me feel lonely and trapped. I am 100 percent through.

So my question is, compared to all the people here who had violent,abusive, selfish and nasty men, am I justified in doing this? How do I square what I feel I have to do, with the view that I am being selfish?

Many similarities to my situation OP, I recognise some of the things you say about your H. I know that when I tell mine that I want him to go later this Summer, all hell will break loose - he relies on me for everything from paying the bills (he gives me all his wages but then takes no responsibility for money other than to ask me why we are skint) to being around to blame. Everything must be my fault.

My DCs are 16 and 18 but I know full well he'll start talking about custody and that I am taking the kids away from him, even though one doesn't live here anymore.

So last night we went out to a mutual friend's party and he was pleasant and polite. Everyone says what an amazing man he is because he's so polite. Because he was polite last night , a friend asked me this morning if I'd changed my mind - "surely you must be happy with him, you enjoyed last night" she said. We've been married 33 years. As if I would throw that up if I wasn't sure! Should I give it a bit longer and see if things improve?! (oh and she thinks he's the best a man can be because he empties the dishwasher!)

It seems your H does things to absent himself from your relationship, you've called him on it, he doesn't like it. Having written all that I don't know how to square what I think is essentially your guilt, because I have it too. He was playing with the dog earlier and I was thinking this is awful he won't have that dog much longer and I know he will isolate himself once we split up; all my fault.

(BTW should just say he can't stand the dog its one of his biggest complaints that he has to walk it but he expects it to be available to play with when he feels like it. Bit like me!!)

He sounds fucking awful, actually.

How old are the kids, in terms of custody? He does sound like he'll be hellish to deal with in that respect - potentially spiteful? If the kids are 6 months from moving out, for example, I'd wait it out, 10 years away would be a different situation.

dishoutdone

Yes. Because he's so helpful and is now making an effort, he's meeting my friends to tell them what a state he's in. They're telling me how distressing it is, and asking if I can't give it another try.

I'm like, okay you marry him then.

Standing up to his distress is taking everything I have. It's maddening when someone points it out like I hadn't noticed.

Pics in red. It actually helps to hear someone say that. I am so tired of his status as the world's kindest man

Oh and the children are primary schoolers. I had been thinking I would need to make it work until they were older, but then one day I just snapped. I couldn't do another day.

I am in a somewhat similar situation too OP. My DH isn't a bad person and I know he loves me and our DS very much but I do not love him anymore and I am done.

I have been begging him for years to stop being so negative and to look after his self better physically. He has chosen to ignore me and continue being a miserable, overweight twat and I've recently told him that I want a divorce.

Now suddenly he's trying to lose weight and take care of his appearance and he's become needy and pathetic, which puts me off even more. I feel like a horrible person for not trying anymore, but I don't love him and I can't imagine ever being in love with him again. It makes me feel horrible.

But I have to remind myself that I've been trying and he's had literally years to change things and now it's simply too late.

I waited all my kids' lives trying to make it work. My youngest said to me the other day "I've never known you to be happy".

So do it now.

Neither the op nor the second poster would be unreasonable to leave. There are more ways to be controlling than by shouting and foot stamping,

Telling your friends is manipulating - that's unlikely to be a new thing - suspect there have been many other occasions he has got his own way by doing this.
Refusing to engage in conversation or discussion about issues is controlling - basically saying 'I don't care what you think this is who/how I am'. Minimising and dismissing not just your concerns but your feelings and YOU.
Your wants and needs have always been unimportant compared to his - and it's not about being introverted either. Introversion doesn't mean discounting other people's needs - especially if you love them.

BorinationStreet

Yes. Same here. For years he wouldn't look after himself. Has hinted that me working out is vain/selfish/inconvenient... and now he's joined a gym, having dental work and getting his hair cut regularly. What's really sad is that he's good looking, I didn't need him to change. I just wanted him to do something for himself, take care of himself, engage with life.

But it's just too late. I'd have worked with 20 per cent of what he's doing now. But he resolutely refused to take what I was saying seriously.

I'm actually offended that what I need didn't matter until it impacted on him.

Hecateh
I'm going screenshot your post and read it again and again.

Whether he means to or not, his passive control has done me real harm over two decades. It's insidious and disorienting because it's so slippery. The fact that he doesn't mean to do it in an obvious or calculating way excused it for me, for a long time.

But not now. I think it's self preservation. I couldn't continue if I tried.

I am terrified of how this will all play out though. Especially for the children. I actually think separation can be fine for the children, but I think he will make it hard. And claim he's doing that for them, rather than own it.

Oh dishingoutdone

I am so sorry. That's so tough. I know exactly what you mean. I am actually a positive up beat sort of person. I got to the point where I was aware I was toning down my cheerfulness because I somehow didn't feel it was okay...

Please remember- it's never too late to become who you might have been.

Also. I am aware I've not listed my own faults or given all the disclaimers about how he would see it differently etc.

BUT I am trying to train myself out of this. I feel like I have given up my truth, and ignored my own feelings by focussing on his perspective for decades. Even writing this feels outrageous and like I being self centred and bad, but I am really trying to challenge that. Because those are the feelings that made me tolerate stuff against my instincts for so long.

Just wanted to say am also going through something similar.
I also feel like I spent years trying to improve our communication as a couple but he just couldn't/didn't want to put in the effort. I thought I could stick it out because he also is on the surface super-helpful around the house, with the kids, in practical ways but it's always felt not quite right - he doesn't take any responsibility overall, so I've compared it to having a live-in cleaner/babysitter over the years!
I told him/we agreed to separate over a year ago, but it turns out that he thought that was just a phase I was going through, that it wasn't permanent. But he's not taken any responsibility for making arrangements for a new life apart, saying it's because I chose to separate and it wasn't what he wanted. So he has a room in our family house at the moment but any plans for moving forward have to be made by me - otherwise he'd be just sitting there in his room for years!
I've also found it hard because he is so dependent, unhappy, can't fend for himself, clueless etc. But I'm also becoming stronger realizing that it's not okay for me to bear that pressure and responsibility, that I have to distance myself from him so he has to live his own life - otherwise it feels almost a little abusive, controlling through neediness and passivity...
It's okay to separate from someone whatever the circumstances if they're not meeting your needs. It sounds like you've given him so long to try to improve things together, but enough is enough.
I understand about becoming them-phobic and just not wanting to have them around - think it's years of things building up and just not being okay to carry on.
I'm feeling stronger in myself and reasons for doing this. I hope all the advice from others here helps you and that you don't feel alone in this situation - I think there are many of us going through the same too.

Is he a 'Good Man' though?

I am so tired of his status as the world's kindest man

Google "street angel, house devil."

If your kids are primary schoolers, leave now, whilst your mental health is still good enough that he cannot attempt to use it in child arrangements proceedings. Document all your good parenting and involvement in the school/doctors (and his lack of involvement). Document, document, document, and put it in a safe deposit box. Obviously, the same goes for financial infomation - all you can get your hands on. Meet with good solicitors and engage one, ready to go.

Leave and find out how the other half operates but don't be disrespectful and try to go back.

There is a woman out there for him and he probably feels alone and cannot talk to you as you clearly don't understand depression and anxiety. It takes hold of you and the fact he is still trying says a lot. Do you think you will get better out there??

why would you want to be disrespected used and talked to like a object rather then a person. And if you cant deal with introvert then why the F*&K did you marry him. I feel sorry for him, he sounds like a INFJ

Anilk. Thanks. Your situation sounds much tougher, my husband isn't hopeless, he's successful, creative etc. He just won't connect with me. But there are parallels too. Once it's over, it's just over. And it's almost as though it's out of your hands. I don't know how you move forward from where you are though... if someone doggedly refuses to accept an ending, what do you do? I am going to press to sell the house so we can go our separate ways.

Scorpvenus1

Wow- such an aggressive post.

No. I have no interest in being treated badly, that is not why I am breaking up with him. If you read my post that will be clear.

And yes. I imagine he does feel he can't talk to me and that I don't understand. But he refused counselling and a number of other options for several years. So that's not all on me.

I could explain why I married him and what has changed, but there's something about the time of your post that makes me think you're not a good listener. So I won't.

@MadridGirl - don't engage!

if someone doggedly refuses to accept an ending, what do you do? I am going to press to sell the house so we can go our separate ways.

@MadridGirl - have a look at the thread www.mumsnet.com/Talk/divorce_separation/3402371-support-thread-for-those-divorcing-against-stbex-wishes-2

Thanks DishingOutDone thanks for the link. I'll look now.

You're right about the don't engage... I was just a bit shocked as I'm already feeling quite vulnerable. But I'll ignore from here.
X

I saw this article and thought it was amazing. Like reading about my OH who I have just separated from. Again outsiders think he's lovely, and there is a truth in it but as for being in a relationship which him it's too hard and I suffer too much as a result. I'm in a lonely marriage as a result and it's so difficult.

www.dailyom.com/cgi-bin/display/articledisplay.cgi?aid=69851

cantbeat
Thanks for the link. It's really interesting if I had come across it a few years ago I would have built up the courage and asked him to do it with me- as I did with various other approaches on working on the relationship. But he would have said no. And belittled it and made it sound stupid or been distressed I had asked.

Now, I imagine he would agree. But it would be me saying no. I just couldn't now. I've given up. Without even meaning to. I absolutely and categorically couldn't pursue this with him now.

Timing is everything.

Madridgirl- interestingly the same applies to me. I've done a lot of soul searching in the lead up to the end of my marriage. Gone around in circles because I didn't want to face the truth that i have to make one of two horrible choices, stay with a man who will never understand me or vice Versa. Or go. Life with an emotionally detached man is such hard work and makes you question everything. Best of luck.

canbeat
Thanks. It's sad isn't it? I see it as a mental health issue really. He genuinely is a good kind man, but unconsciously he has all these ways of avoiding connecting and punishing me when I insist. I wish we could have made it work, but we can't. I don't feel I have a choice now. It's just over. Now I I need to focus on how to keep us both being king to each other and the children.

Good luck to you too