Is it selfish to leave a good man?

[MadridGirl]

First time post but been reading this stuff for years!

I have told my husband our 18 year relationship is over. He is having some sort of break down as a result. He has always been a very helpful and kind person. He's says he loves me and will do anything. I feel horribly responsible for his mental health.

He never shouts, has never been violent. Does his best to be good and right and kind. But he is also very anxious, moody and withdrawn. For years he has avoided deep conversations, rarely touches me (I have to explicitly say I want him to and be very encouraging) sex is less than a few times a year, doesn't have friends etc.

Very attentive to the children and a very reliable dad. Never spends on himself. Does loads of housework, very selfless but sometimes he does these things to hide from connecting. He always denied this, said it was because life is busy etc. It's true that we've had some tough experiences- but all families do... I asked him to see a counsellor with me and also told him I couldn't live life like this unless something changed. Every time I raised it he would minimise, dent, he always refused and just got so upset and offended that I had criticised our relationship, in the end up I just gave up reaching out to him.

He agreed to see a doctor and a counsellor about a year ago when I really put my foot down, but he didn't do either in the end.

He has explicitly said he doesn't believe in talking about feelings, it makes things worse for him, not better.

Now I have said that I don't want to be with him he is shocked and distressed. He's acting as though I've gone mad and that I am selfish because we have two children.

He will insist on having the children half the time. He is being very nice to me at the moment but I know it's because he isn't taking me seriously and thinks I'll change my mind. I won't. I feel that under the surface he is furious. It's taken years to get here, and I am now done. I am almost phobic about him now, I don't want to be close to him- I am so much happier when I don't have to deal with his feelings. I want to be on my own and stop carrying all his anxiety and moods. I don't want to be with an introvert, it makes me feel lonely and trapped. I am 100 percent through.

So my question is, compared to all the people here who had violent,abusive, selfish and nasty men, am I justified in doing this? How do I square what I feel I have to do, with the view that I am being selfish?

Massive respect to you all! This thread has helped me enormously! Particularly as I'm about do deal with my in-laws tomorrow. Alone!! 'Not here for a long time- but a good time' as the saying goes!

So hard to walk away from feeling any responsibility for him, OP. But I think it's a bit like where I've got to - dreading doing it because he won't be okay at first, but knowing that you have to not take on further responsibility for him and how he deals with it. I know that too but still haven't got to the point where I can say go...feeling stronger and gathering strength for soon though. And every day things happen that reinforce my conviction that it's the right thing to do.

I also write, and when I read through how
bad things were and for how long it's been like this it really helps...Not easy reading though!

I get depressed on MN when women ask "is this abuse" as if that would give them permission to leave a relationship.

You don't need permission. It is ok to put you and your needs and wants first. As Mary Oliver said you have "one wild and precious life". One.

I would hesitate leaving a good kind man if I had small children who would be very disrupted by it - as in I would really weigh up whether i would be happier and the children would be happier. But I would still do it if I felt I was in a poor and unhappy relationship that was making me miserable. But that he would be unhappy isn't enough in my book - especially when he makes so little effort. You are responsible for your happiness - and that of your children. He is responsible for his own - and that of his children.

@MadridGirl - the hardest thing to live with is the guilt - but I always keep this in my head, I don’t have to justify my decision to anyone but me

@DishingOutDone my DH has been gone for 4 weeks now and he has only just told his brother, he doesn't want to tell anyone else as it makes it too 'real', he keeps asking me who I've told and I'm pretty open about it to my friends so have not been keeping it a secret.

I can't remember who asked this question about emotionally unavailable men, but for me I was only 17 when we met (been together 18yrs) and I guess I didn't really know what I wanted but also as times gone on I've changed a bit and he hasn't I guess.

@pallisers You are so right. Lots of posters on here are very quick to jump on the abuse word. My husband became an absolute Tw**face during our divorce and it was horrid... But that doesn't make him an abuser. He just lent on me far too heavily. To answer an earlier question... How could I have predicted this behaviour when we first met... Or even quessed how things were going to go when we got married. Of course I couldn't know... Because neither did he.... His behaviour was the result of a lot of different things that happened during our long relationship and of course I changed during that long relationship too... We just became incompatible I couldn't support all that weight any longer so I chose to leave. He spat at me during the divorce that I was taking the easy option... I totally disagree...the easier option would of been to go back and contiue pretending I was happy and satisfied and everything was perfect... But it just wasn't anymore.

Those of you talking about why we got into this- super helpful. I have changed a lot, I'm really committed to growing and changing... been in therapy, studied, challenged my bad habits.., we have grown apart. I couldn't have known how this would go. And you the choices I made so long ago are just that... long ago.

Sad here today. The feeling of responsibility is intense. Though he is trying not to lay it on me.

@MadridGirl - I empathise and relate. I know deep down that it's me that's changed - and on my darkest days, I wonder if it's me that's made my husband the way he is.

@vivariumvivariumsvivaria

"Not good enough to stay, not bad enough to leave" - that's exactly where I am.

I can't come to terms with the idea of staying but can't seem justify turning my children's world upside down either

I divorced XH for being moody, sulky, withdrawn and completely disengaged from our relationship. He knew I was very unhappy and lonely but would not spend time with me, he thought I would just put up with it and he preferred the status quo. I was very explicit about what I was looking for from marriage and he was aware that he wasn't meeting those needs at all, but the divorce surprised him.

Since we divorced I have a happy and full life and he has sought treatment for his depression. We are on good terms and he's coping well.

It is such a relief to hear all these happy endings.

While I'm terrified DH will do himself serious harm and / or become a hopeless alcoholic if I leave, it has also occurred to me that it might encourage him to seek help.

wits
Yes. It's actually very common - my husband was very shocked to hear I was done trying, even though I had been explicit that I couldn't keep it up for ever. I felt so sorry for him. He said he recognises that it was a kind of defence against thinking about his feelings, but he thought if he just focussed on practical tasks he could deal with our relationship in the future. He said he knew I was not happy with the relationship but he relied on the assumption that there 'was no off switch'.

It's sad really. But in the end, he's a person who naturally avoids the kind of connection that I need.

It just is what it is.

june

I don't think you can make someone the way they are. You're responsible to other people but only for yourself.

I know - most of the time. But when I'm feeling my most guilty, I do wonder if this whole mess is my fault.

june to be honest we will all probably carry a lot of guilt and responsibility. We wouldn't be in these kinds of relationships if we weren't quite available to those feelings. It's something I'm actively working on

I finally walked out on my husband. It was the hardest thing I’ve ever done, and although our divorce isn’t finalised yet, I feel guilty, and part of me wants to go back.

I won’t because I know I can’t live with him anymore. We were never really compatible, we just rubbed along together, had kids, who are now grown up. But now it’s worse as they have left home, and the cracks have got bigger.

People can’t understand why I left him, but they didn’t have to live with him. They couldn’t see how we wanted completely different things, when it came to food, or what was on the bed.. a thick or thin duvet, how we spent holidays, I was sociable, he wasn’t. We were like house mates, not a loving couple.

I’m glad there’s others in my position, I’m guessing it’ll take me two years as well before I feel free to move on without guilt.

@itsnotme I know exactly how you feel. My kids are teenagers and agreeing to co-parent 50/50 has to be the hardest thing I've ever done but I accept it as exH wanted it and he has same right to be with kids as me. I have to say since living separately it is becoming more and more apparent how very different we really were - with different attitudes to parenting among many other things. I'm actually beginning to wonder how we managed to "rub along" for so long!!!

iamthrough since living separately, I too realise how different we really are, and wonder how I stuck it out for 30 odd years with him. My close family understand why I left.

I have been back to the family home and he’s not a good house keeper at all, but I button my lip and just go to sort out my stuff or to discuss the divorce procedure. We are on very good terms, and it’s so much better.

I have a friend who’s divorced, she has a child, and her ex and her get on extremely well, contact each other every day, but if they live together they just fight !

I feel like I'm reading my life reading this thread.

My 'hero dad' husband is to everyone else perfect. I'm the bad one, imagine a mum having a job where she travels 30% of the time!

Yet he hasn't 'looked' at me in years. I've booked hotels and date nights and concerts and comedy gigs galore.

He has lied to me about the kids (so I don't get angry). He has supported and backed the oldest (his DSD) to go behind my back to do slightly dangerous/potentially illegal stuff.

He has nagged incessantly about the house but continues to leave crap behind him. Nags about me playing on phone but clocks 20+ hours a week on x-box alone. Moans about how much time/money I spend on gym/beauty and thinks 1 hr of 5 a side a week and no effort is enough for him.

I've never turned down a business trip in the last 2 years.

It took 2 years to get him to counselling- which turned out to be a very expensive person to listen to us argue. When asked if he wouldn't ever just back me up with the kids his response was "of course, if I thought she was right"

Then after 3 months of counselling he'll when I just had enough and said so, accused me of ambushing him with that, he had no idea.

In the last 5 weeks I've had, anger, mud slinging, shouting, accusations followed by tears and begging and promises - in cycles over and over. It's really unattractive

I just need to figure out how to get one of us out of the house

@DragonNoodleCake - I am stuck to think how to get one of us out of the house whilst still providing a home for DD16 and older one when she is home from uni. I could walk now and get a 1 bed flat but I am leaving a 3 bed semi and the dog.

I heard today on another forum that landlords are demanding that prospective tenants earn 30x the monthly rent. E.g., rent of £800, you need to earn £24,000 or you wont be allowed a tenancy. I was reliant on this being ok for my STBexH to get a flat quickly, now it looks like he wont get one at all. So he will stay in the house awaiting his equity from the sale. That sounds like a living nightmare.

Landlords I spoke to when I was considering moving out (I’m know staying put!) but they said their insurance wouldn’t allow a single person without a guarantor and also that I’d need to be earning much more than I am!

This is only tough because you find it hard to put a name in the despair that you feel in your gut. Just because there is no shouting / violence / overt abuse - and often they dynamic drives the other partner to “behave badly” or vociferous whilst banging their head against a brick wall by expressing their frustration and exhaustion. But it can be covert abuse (manipulative quiet control) or at the very least emotional neglect - and that’s not sufficient for a sustainable relationship. These guys often do just fine on their own - maybe they will be relieved of the pain (released from) of having to engage in emotional intimacy? Often there is seething contempt going on behind the eyes - if it’s drudgery for you there is no way that they are happy and fulfilled in this dynamic either.

*sorry I don’t mean “tough” I mean confusing or conflicted - FOG really (fear, obligation, guilt). And the “good Dad” label is a misnomer. A good Dad (or Mum) works in partnership and shows their child how they cherish the other parent.

Jumping on this thread too. I read this open mouthed at three in the morning after telling my husband we had to separate. I have asked him at various points over our marriage to get some help but he ignores it and I didn’t follow through. He is a great dad, and v professionally successful, but it is so lonely being married to him. He loves the children, but I always feel he would actually just prefer if we weren’t there and he could read his book or watch tv. In company he often just falls alseep - especially with my family. He has no friends of his own and makes v little effort with his family. Like @Miniloso I feel like I have I make every decision and get no support from him. A bit of a brain dump on my lunch break, but I just needed to join in.