Plan C to ban household mixing being discussed.

[MercyBooth]

Absolute fuckers.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10113747/Covid-UK-Ministers-discussing-banning-households-mixing-booster-jabs-dont-halt-winter-wave.html?fbclid=IwAR1iNfWAFoAJywK8_wUyX04mCsqh3WKDg4ywZjme6fs5I9xqx5r_ppFwSXU

'it's why I keep saying the whole UK system is failing. One of the richest countries in the world and is seriously failing their people in basic health care in a pandemic'

Bollocks. It isn't 'failing' at all we have one of the best vaccination programmes in the world.

Thanks for the info re 3rd doses/boosters @TheVampiresWife. Who knew that what is called a booster with most folk is called a third primary dose for others when it is exactly the same dose and drug.

So weird that so many people seem to have already forgotten that vaccines were the promised way out. Now vaccine boosters and vaccines for teenagers is the way out apparently . How can anyone believe in that? What is the way out in another 6-12 months time? More boosters and vaccines from birth? Have they even tested 3 or 4 doses?

@Lostinacloud, no one knows. That's the reality. It's a moving picture. These are plans. They can't promise. The government weights up the costs and benefits of each at the time. As always through a filter of their own biases, (political and otherwise) and priorities. It's somewhat reactive.

@Lostinacloud

So weird that so many people seem to have already forgotten that vaccines were the promised way out. Now vaccine boosters and vaccines for teenagers is the way out apparently . How can anyone believe in that? What is the way out in another 6-12 months time? More boosters and vaccines from birth? Have they even tested 3 or 4 doses?

The government oversold the vaccines. Scientists were saying this at the time.

@JaniieJones

'it's why I keep saying the whole UK system is failing. One of the richest countries in the world and is seriously failing their people in basic health care in a pandemic'

Bollocks. It isn't 'failing' at all we have one of the best vaccination programmes in the world.

Thanks for the info re 3rd doses/boosters @TheVampiresWife. Who knew that what is called a booster with most folk is called a third primary dose for others when it is exactly the same dose and drug.

It's not a booster, as I've already said. It's a third dose. Boosters are given after six months, primary doses twelve weeks apart. Those eligible for third primary doses will get a booster six months after their third dose.

So you see, it's not the same as the boosters 'most folk' have at all - as the information I linked to clearly states.

And as for 'who knew' about third primary doses @JaniieJones - the millions of people who are immunocompromised and the HCPs responsible for our care did.

It's not a booster, as I've already said. It's a third dose. Boosters are given after six months, primary doses twelve weeks apart. Those eligible for third primary doses will get a booster six months after their third dose.

No one has any idea whether it's a booster or a third dose. Anyone who claims otherwise is lying, and if you believe them, you've been lied to.

The distinction is that if it's really a third-and-final dose rather than a booster, no additional doses would be necessary for quite some time afterward - much longer than six months. But no one has any idea whether that's true or not, just like they didn't have any idea whether a third dose would be necessary after the first two. That didn't stop anyone from telling people it wouldn't be. Maybe immunity will last 10+ years after the third dose, or maybe people will need another dose in a few months. Which those same people will undoubtedly insist is a "fourth dose" rather than a "booster." Maybe by the time we get up to nine or ten "initial doses," people will be more willing to question these evidence-free assertions about how long the protection lasts.

The only reason they're calling it a "third dose" rather than a "booster" now is because many global relief organizations have understandably criticized administering booster doses when most of the world still doesn't have access to the initial doses. I'm not sure why calling it something else would change anything there, but I guess that's why I'm not in charge of PR.

@PurpleOkapi

It's not a booster, as I've already said. It's a third dose. Boosters are given after six months, primary doses twelve weeks apart. Those eligible for third primary doses will get a booster six months after their third dose.

No one has any idea whether it's a booster or a third dose. Anyone who claims otherwise is lying, and if you believe them, you've been lied to.

The distinction is that if it's really a third-and-final dose rather than a booster, no additional doses would be necessary for quite some time afterward - much longer than six months. But no one has any idea whether that's true or not, just like they didn't have any idea whether a third dose would be necessary after the first two. That didn't stop anyone from telling people it wouldn't be. Maybe immunity will last 10+ years after the third dose, or maybe people will need another dose in a few months. Which those same people will undoubtedly insist is a "fourth dose" rather than a "booster." Maybe by the time we get up to nine or ten "initial doses," people will be more willing to question these evidence-free assertions about how long the protection lasts.

The only reason they're calling it a "third dose" rather than a "booster" now is because many global relief organizations have understandably criticized administering booster doses when most of the world still doesn't have access to the initial doses. I'm not sure why calling it something else would change anything there, but I guess that's why I'm not in charge of PR.

You do understand that I'm talking about a third primary dose, as opposed to a booster? Primary doses are given twelve weeks apart. Most people have two. Those for whom the vaccines may not provide a sufficient immune response (usually those severely immunocompromised due to illness and/or medication) have three, all at twelve week intervals. Those who have three primary doses go on to have a booster dose after six months, in line with those who are less vulnerable who have their booster dose six months after their second primary dose. So, primary are all twelve weeks apart, boosters are all six months after the last primary.

The issue is those who cannot produce a satisfactory immune response from two primary doses - for example, the medication I'm on means two primary doses are up to 70% less effective. It's not about how long immunity lasts.

To be clear - we're talking about the most medically vulnerable patients here.

And no, I don't think my rheumatologist is 'lying'.

This is what my DM who has compromised immunity was told too.

No some stranger on mumsnet surely knows better than your consultant?

'It's not a booster, as I've already said. It's a third dose. Boosters are given after six months, primary doses twelve weeks apart. Those eligible for third primary doses will get a booster six months after their third dose.'

I'm not sure what we're arguing about tbh. Whether a third 'primary dose' or a booster it is the same drug and same dose given by the same nhs. You will be called when eligible so why would your gp, consultant, ndn whoever know when this will be unless they are directly involved with the logistics and I'm guessing they aren't.

@AgnesNaismith

Nah - they can fuck off if they think I’m not seeing my family this Christmas - particularly as we’ve all had Covid.

Perhaps they should look at the firms expecting 100% attendance levels with no ventilation, or the ridiculousness of the tube and the fact no fucker wants to wear a face mask anymore.

The government and their cheerleaders in the press have been screaming at everyone to get back to the office for months.

Third dose and booster aren't the same dose

I understand the booster is a half dose

www.crohnsandcolitis.org.uk/news/third-covid-19-vaccine

Some info on the third dose vs booster.

If Pfizer then first, second, third and booster are all the same dose of the same drug.

If Moderna then the booster is a half dose.
Not sure what’s happening for third primary dose Moderna.

@JaniieJones

'It's not a booster, as I've already said. It's a third dose. Boosters are given after six months, primary doses twelve weeks apart. Those eligible for third primary doses will get a booster six months after their third dose.'

I'm not sure what we're arguing about tbh. Whether a third 'primary dose' or a booster it is the same drug and same dose given by the same nhs. You will be called when eligible so why would your gp, consultant, ndn whoever know when this will be unless they are directly involved with the logistics and I'm guessing they aren't.

Boosters are either Moderna or Pfizer, whatever your primary doses were. My primary doses will all be AZ. And for the billionth time, it's not the same as a booster. Did you read the information I linked to?

I am eligible, this is entirely my point. I have the letter from my consultant requesting that my GP arranges it as soon as possible. Third doses are given twelve weeks after the second and it's way past that for me. But because the system for administering third primary doses is all over the place, nobody knows how to arrange it - even though they agree I need it.

Your tone suggests that you don't believe third primary doses to be a thing, and you certainly have no idea how they work (despite this being explained to you and links to government information). It might be an idea to understand the subject you're talking about if you're going to get all supercilious about it.

@mrshoho

www.crohnsandcolitis.org.uk/news/third-covid-19-vaccine

Some info on the third dose vs booster.

@JaniieJones

And yes, Moderna boosters are half doses whereas primary doses are full ones.

Costs nothing to educate yourself

Let’s be honest, those accusing others of being selfish are actually worried about themselves. They’re worried that those not being compliant are going to pass it on to them. When they get righteous about the NHS becoming overwhelmed, what they’re actually thinking is, “I hope there’s a bed available if I need it” If that wasn’t the case, why should they care if someone else ‘isn’t following the rules’?

We’re all inherently selfish because we want ourselves and our families to survive. It’s just that some like to dress it up in moral outrage.

Bingo.

Basically, nearly all of us are the same, but not all of us are delusional hypocrites over it.

Confused why a plan C if they arent even implementing plan B..................

So who thinks Christmas will be restricted again :(

@LyricalBlowToTheJaw

Let’s be honest, those accusing others of being selfish are actually worried about themselves. They’re worried that those not being compliant are going to pass it on to them. When they get righteous about the NHS becoming overwhelmed, what they’re actually thinking is, “I hope there’s a bed available if I need it” If that wasn’t the case, why should they care if someone else ‘isn’t following the rules’?

We’re all inherently selfish because we want ourselves and our families to survive. It’s just that some like to dress it up in moral outrage.

Bingo.

Basically, nearly all of us are the same, but not all of us are delusional hypocrites over it.

This is bollocks. Of course everyone wants their own families to survive, but many people genuinely do care about others as well.

I do wish self-centred twats wouldn't judge everyone by their own standards.

Bit like Johnson thinking the public wouldn't follow the lockdown rules - because he thinks everyone is a lying cheating shit. Judging by his own standards.

Well said @rrhuth . You've nailed it with Johnson there!

@Sunset999

Confused why a plan C if they arent even implementing plan B..................

Exactly! 🤦‍♀️

“This is bollocks. Of course everyone wants their own families to survive, but many people genuinely do care about others as well.

I do wish self-centred twats wouldn't judge everyone by their own standards.

Bit like Johnson thinking the public wouldn't follow the lockdown rules - because he thinks everyone is a lying cheating shit. Judging by his own standards“

But if those strangers you say you care about make their own choices about their health or decide not to wear masks, why would you bother or see it as your duty to wear one yourself to ‘protect’ them? They’ve made a loud and clear statement that by their actions that they’ve assessed their own risks.