School pupils vaccinated from September

[Totalbeach]

This is in lots of papers today. Such as:

www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/19274021.secondary-school-pupils-set-get-covid-jab-september/

And:

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/02/nhs-england-draws-up-plan-to-give-covid-jabs-to-children-12-and-over

What’s your reaction?

Mine is that I 100% won’t be allowing my children to be vaccinated.

In the whole pandemic so far, 12 children under 15 have died in the U.K. That increases to 32 in the under 20s. The mortality rate is vanishingly tiny. A huge percentage of kids don’t even get symptoms at all.

The government has assured us till they are blue in the face that schools are safe and that children don’t spread it so it will be interesting to see what kind of enormous gaslighting they attempt to pull off to persuade parents they now need to vaccinate their kids.

The long term effects of the vaccines are totally unknown and recent events with AZ have proved rather horribly that even after a vaccine is rolled out, serious effects can come to light. Including events that disproportionately affect certain age groups.

I’m fully vaccinated (including first Covid vaccine) as are my kids but there is no way I’d let them be vaccinated in September. With any of the vaccines.

I'll let my dc decide for themselves as it stands today 1 would have it straight away 1 isnt so sure. We'll talk it through when he time comes same as we did with the HPV (eldest has had BTW,younger not yet old enough)

[quote btwwhichonespink]@jumpbounce 16, I could accept even if I didn't agree with it. 18 would be better. But not 12/13/14. they generally aren't competent at that age to truly understand the risks vs. benefits, and are also more likely to feel they have to do it if everyone else it, or if the nurse asks them directly. What 12 year old girl would say no to a nurse?[/quote]
Plenty. There are always a couple at the HPV sessions that decide they don't want it after all, usually because they're afraid of needles. sometimes they change their mind after sitting down and getting over the initial panic response, sometimes they don't. It's their consent that's needed, not anybody else's - because it's been established in Law that they are as a rule, competent to make decisions regarding medical treatment for decades.

No nursing team is going to pin a kid down and inject them forcibly.

My DD is 17 and would have the vaccine. Her year group has had such disruption to their education with no GCSEs last year - I want year 13 to be as normal as possible for her without anymore self isolation 🤞🤞🤞

@freeingNora

My children won't be having it

There seems to be some confusion about the vaccines, they don't stop you getting covid they just help you manage the symptoms with your immune response so it doesn't kill you. It's more likely that a fully vaccinated asymptomatic person will burst the bubble or bring the infection into school through assumed immunity.

A link about the vaccines cutting transmission

www.reuters.com/world/uk/english-data-shows-vaccines-cut-household-covid-19-transmission-by-up-half-2021-04-28/

Also if you are referring to the small percentage that will still get infected after vaccination. Well once you fact in the transmission data too. The chance of two vaccinated people infecting each is really small.

Hope that helps if you haven't been keeping update. I know initially they refused to comment on transmission until further evidence and that caused some confusion.

So if it was always this unsafe why did Gavin Williamson threaten court action on schools that wanted to close earlier for Christmas. @CoffeeWithCheese has a point about how they will yet again have to gaslight their way out of something

About bloody time.

Mine will have it when available. If there was a local vaccine trial wed sign up (have discussed with them already). We're keen to be part of the solution rather than subject to media hysteria.

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people and the lack of understanding and ignorance of basic science.

@Gobbeldegook

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people and the lack of understanding and ignorance of basic science.

It's not that people don't understand science. Many do. I do.

But yes, not wanting to put our own children at risk of side effects from the vaccine might be selfish from your point of view but my children are everything to me and I will selfishly put them first in every decision I make.

We've had a discussion about it and mine had already decided that it would be more sensible to have the vaccination. In fact they couldn't see a reason not to. I'm happy for them to protected. At different times each of them has had to isolate because some of their friends rested positive. At one point nearly all of two year groups were isolating.

@Gobbeldegook

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people and the lack of understanding and ignorance of basic science.

I can't imagine having a CEV child during this pandemic. So worrying for you all. I think like with adult vaccinations most people will change their minds nearer the time. Obviously some won't but enough hopefully for that not to matter. People just need to hear evidence from places like Israel or America were they are already vaccinating some teenagers. By September we will have more information and parents will be less worried.

@Gobbeldegook

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people and the lack of understanding and ignorance of basic science.

Same situation and wholeheartedly agree with you. I cannot wait for the day young DC can have the vaccination.

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people

People will put their children first, as you do yours. That's perfectly natural and calling them selfish is unfair.

@Gobbeldegook

As a parent of a CEV child I cannot understand the selfishness of some people and the lack of understanding and ignorance of basic science.

And a lack of understanding that any one of their “healthy slim” children (to quote a PP) could unexpectedly become CEV themselves.

Every child is only ever one illness or injury away away being CEV themselves. Not a nice thought but one that unfortunately many people have experienced.
I also think people have an impression of someone who is CEV as being extremely ill on a daily basis and not able to lead a normal life. Typical ableist nonsense on mumsnet. They don't realise that many CEV children led completely normal day to day lives pre pandemic and that actually you wouldn't be able to pick them out in a crowd. No one in my child's class knew my DC was unwell until covid came along and they weren't able to attend school due to being CEV.

@jumpbounce

All those who say they won't consent for their children to have the vaccine. What if your child wants it...will you go against their wishes? Are you aware that children under the age of 16 are able to provide consent for medical treatment themselves provided they are Gillick competent?

There is no way a child will be vaccinated against their parent's consent with this new vaccine. It's a legal minefield.

In my case I'm not worried as my children will go with whatever I decide. They're not worried about Covid.

@Gobbeldegook

🙄 I'm rolling my eyes so much they've gone dizzy.

Antivaxxers 🤷🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🙄

Very lazy namecalling.

Fully vaccinated people with fully vaccinated children are not antivaxxers because they won't agree to vaccinating their children with a new vaccine with unknown long-term effects against something that is vanishingly unlikely to harm them.

@Totalbeach I beg to differ, many new vaccines have been introduced over the years and young people have had a choice.
It is a legal right in any medical decision. The covid vaccine is no different people are getting on like this is some kind of never seen before experimental vaccine when in reality it has passed through all the same channels as every vaccine before it.
Most new vaccines always have some controversy around them but they don't adjust a young person's legal right to make a decision.
This vaccine is no different than any other new vaccine in recent years we have had a new meningitis vaccine in the young people age group and it didn't lead to as many damn conspiracy theories.

@murbblurb

'not my kids not my problem'

Quite the biggest 'fuck you, world' I have read on here and that is saying something. We were that close to a collapsed NHS and huge supply chain problems. Even without long covid.

Fix the bloody NHS then. Not voting Tory would be a start.

And its no legal minefield at all. The laws are there children are legally, if deemed competent, able to consent for medical treatment and procedures. This is absolutely no different despite everyone's drama about it as though the government have suddenly decided to inject lethal substances into children against their parents will

@Barbie222

Yes, I think it's a good idea. We don't want a reservoir where the virus can mutate and undo all the hard work of the vaccination programme.

We have plenty of those reservoirs. Entire countries.

Without proper border control and track & trace, we can't pretend that we're going for zero covid by vaccinating children.

@Totalbeach

(though I’m sure that’s what they will wheel out to try to scare parents into vaccinating!)

Out of curiosity, what reason do you think they (the Government? The NHS? Not sure who you were thinking of) have to want to scare people into being vaccinated? What's in it for them?

@Totalbeach 'fix the NHS' the very thing that is the reason we have a successful vaccine programme to get us out of this mess in the first place. I don't think it's done a bad job of that to be honest. There are millions of people around the world would be only too grateful to have been offered a free covid vaccine in the same timely fashion most adults in the UK have been able to avail.
No amount of 'fixing' of a health service would have been able to have dealt with covid running freely through an entire population with no mitigation evidence of which can be seen in other countries.

Every child is only ever one illness or injury away away being CEV themselves

Which is what we have been saying on disability benefit threads for years. Yet people kept voting for cuts.

[quote jumpbounce]@Totalbeach 'fix the NHS' the very thing that is the reason we have a successful vaccine programme to get us out of this mess in the first place. I don't think it's done a bad job of that to be honest. There are millions of people around the world would be only too grateful to have been offered a free covid vaccine in the same timely fashion most adults in the UK have been able to avail.
No amount of 'fixing' of a health service would have been able to have dealt with covid running freely through an entire population with no mitigation evidence of which can be seen in other countries.[/quote]
Nope, I'm not talking about fixing the NHS by making most people not need it. I'm talking about making it fit for purpose - which it isn't.

I'm not tolerating the NHS being underfunded and on its knees year after year and us all scurrying round trying not to need it, even to the extent of vaccinating children against something that doesn't affect them.