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Covid

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can we cancel the coronavirus?

222 replies

elmouno · 28/08/2020 17:59

If you compare Coronavirus deaths to like TB or whatever, it's really not a big deal. No deaths in Scotland in about 6 weeks and very few deaths per 100,000 people in England. At this point it just feels like a giant wealth transfer (since the FED printed all that money in the US) and assets could be bought on the cheap.

So can we cancel it all now? No more lines and all that. Everyone can calm down. As far as plagues go, the coronavirus was mostly bark, very little bite. Considering the hygiene of the public at large, if it was as contagious as it has been described, everyone who has been to a supermarket would have caught it by now. But that's not what has happened.

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CrunchyCarrot · 29/08/2020 17:30

OMFG the technology simply doesn't exist to get a microchip small enough to be invisible and pass through a vaccine needle

Exactly this.

And the national Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) system for anyone who owns a car.

Yes, thank you for reminding me Croissant. I mean this whole thing is daft, people can already be tracked. It's not news!

What I really want to know is, how do 'they' get the govts of such diverse places as Russia, Iran, North Korea, the USA etc to all agree on this 'reset'? You know Trump would want to claim it as his idea!!

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 17:40

We don’t know that social distancing has done anything. There is zero proof that masks have done anything.

How do we “know” anything. It seems obvious but as this thread demonstrates, it seems it’s not?

It is true that we have not demonstrated using rigorous scientific observation and method that social distancing works, and I’ve often seen this used by Covid sceptics to argue against containment measures. The argument goes “there’s no proof X, Y or Z works, so why should we comply”.

However, to achieve this we would need, firstly, one suitably large and diverse population isolated and infected with Covid and scrupulously obeying a set of social distancing rules, and another equivalent population infected with Covid in which social distancing did not take place. The results would be analysed over a period, and conclusions drawn. The study would need to be peer reviewed to provide assurance over the rigour of the methodology, testing and interpretation. Ideally this “experiment” would be repeated a number of times with slightly different parameters, and a synthesis of the results drawn in conclusions that - if broadly consistent - would form a scientific consensus. However, this is clearly impossible, not to mention unethical. To insist on such a hurdle being cleared before public health policy can be set is ludicrous, and nothing could be ever be done (which is exactly what the libertarians want).

Expecting “proof“ in such a scenario is as ridiculous as refusing to be drawn over whether carrying a pan of boiling water down the stairs on your head isn’t safe, because a scientific study hasn’t proven whether it is dangerous, or refusing to jump out of the path of a moving train because you don’t have definitive evidence that moving to the left or the right is the more suitable alternative.

The world’s response to Covid, by necessity, involved applying the wide breadth of knowledge it did have about infectious diseases to determine a course of action that was reasonable and consistent with what we knew. Given that evidence indicates that Covid’s primary mode
of transmission via the respiratory droplets, distancing people socially so that droplets from their breath cannot be passed from one to another is a very reasonable thing to do, obvious even.

Has it been irrefutably and rigorously scientifically demonstrated that social distancing works? “No”, that would be impossible for the reasons given

Do we need such “proof“ for confidence to be highly confident that it does have an impact? Again, “no”, the body of evidence we do have, coupled with reasonable deductions, is enough for very high level of confidence that social distancing does help prevent Covid transmission..... in the same way I’m highly confident that carrying a pan of boiling water down stairs on my head is dangerous, despite the absence of a double blind scientific study demonstrating this.

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 17:50

How do you get from "we want to flatten the curve" to "everyone go fuck yourselves we are never going to end this?”

Who has said or implied “everyone go fuck yourselves we are never going to end this“? And how does this fit with your WEF reset theory?

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 17:56

@onedayinthefuture

I’m often wrong about stuff. If you believe I am, then I’d be happy to discuss.

I question why ours lives have changed so much too, and whether what we are doing is proportionate and reasonable too. There are many things I would change, and I’m not a cheerleader for Government policy - far from it.

The posters I’m disagreeing with aren’t questioning why their lives have changed, they are arguing with confidence that we have been duped.

rosie39forever · 29/08/2020 18:17

everyone go fuck Yourselves we are never going to end this
I don't know a single person who doesn't want to end this shit show today, the sacrifices we have all made are immense. I'm also pretty sure there's not a government on the planet who wants to suppress their economies for a minute longer especially capitalist economies such as ours.

netflixismysidehustle · 29/08/2020 19:16

OP I believe there's a programme on Channel 4 called Hunted where celebrities/members of the public go on the run and try to avoid being caught by "Hunters" whose job is to track them down. Somebody on here will know more about I'm assuming that during the course of the episode, the hunters find the people that they are tracking via phone signal, financial transactions, cctv etc

I am interested in the conspiracy theory that Bill Gates is more interested in people's whereabouts than companies who makes Alexas and Google Homes who know where their devices are but could probably monetize knowing where you are in relation to devices like Alexas, Ring Doorbells and Google Homes.

CousinKrispy · 29/08/2020 19:39

Untoasted breadGrin

Gingerfish91 · 29/08/2020 19:49

Oh this crops up on every thread.

The only reason we haven't had HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of covid deaths is distancing.

Yet in Spain the cases have been rising dramatically since mid June yet the hospitalisations and deaths remain low.

latticechaos · 29/08/2020 19:54

@Gingerfish91

Oh this crops up on every thread.

The only reason we haven't had HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of covid deaths is distancing.

Yet in Spain the cases have been rising dramatically since mid June yet the hospitalisations and deaths remain low.

I CBA arguing about it. The reasons for this change are all reported widely.

This whole debate about covid is totally draining. If you really think it's made up, that's up to you.

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 20:39

@elmouno

Alternatively, Covid-19 is just one in a long line of viruses that has emerged through humanity’s history... it’s nothing especially unusual, somewhat more deadly than 1957 Asian Flu, but less deadly than the 1918 Spanish Flu. World Governments are responding in a way that reflects modern-day expectations for protecting the health and wellbeing of society. You may believe their response has been excessive, inappropriate and counter-productive, but it’s nothing more exotic than that.... There’s absolutely no need to invoke global conspiracies to explain our current situation.

The echo-chamber of certain corners of the Internet, along with the ever fertile imagination of febrile minds disillusioned with, and distrustful of, their Governments have spawned this dystopian fantasy you have been sucked in to.

AdelaidePlace · 29/08/2020 20:52

Having just read the 'coronavirus lung' thread, by seriously long term debilitated Mumsnetters, this thread is sickening.
Despicable.

elmouno · 29/08/2020 21:05

Supposedly we just needed to wash our hands, now we can't catch it from surfaces. Now it's airborne, but if it lands on a surface, you are fine. You are also fine to sit in a crowded cafe as you get subsidised for the pleasure on Monday-Wednesday.

Keep changing the story guys. At the beginning I also was very worried and watched the videos of China on Twitter. Do you think the governments didn't know of the lockdowns starting in China from 2019? Really? What are all those intelligence agencies for?

It was intended. It is bullshit.

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Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 21:07

Having just read the 'coronavirus lung' thread, by seriously long term debilitated Mumsnetters, this thread is sickening. Despicable.

Presumably they must be Bill Gates’ stooges who created some fake MN accounts.

onedayinthefuture · 29/08/2020 21:13

@Derbygerbil fair enough, apologies.

AlecTrevelyan006 · 29/08/2020 21:53

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53951764

Cases rising but deaths not

Is it time to get back to normal?

RoseCider · 29/08/2020 22:35

now we can't catch it from surfaces. Now it's airborne

Do you have links for this?

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 22:35

@AlecTrevelyan006

Cases rising but deaths not. Is it time to get back to normal?

You could have written the same thing two months back in the USA. The states affected had to significantly tighten measures again once hospitalisations rose to risk overwhelming systems as increasing deaths followed in its wake.

Getting “back to normal“ as a society whilst cases rise, and inviting the old and vulnerable, including the 2.2 million who have been shielding, to return to their pre-March behaviours, on a hunch that Covid will just fizzle out, would be an act of stupendous criminal irresponsibility. There may be a small chance your optimism is proven to have been justified and you confound scientific and medical communities around the world, but if you are wrong, it’s not just the susceptible, vulnerable and old you will have decimated, you will have ensured a massive curtailment of non-Covid medical work for a second time and, more than likely, cratered the economy even further in the process.

I’m as sick of Covid as the next person, but putting our collective heads in the sand whilst we cross our fingers and hope for the best, is utter madness, and would turn the current mess into a catastrophe.

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 22:53

now we can't catch it from surfaces. Now it's airborne

No reputable scientist has said you can’t catch it from a surface, just that the risk is far lower.

Imagine spraying a perfume atomiser into your face, (very roughly mimicking someone speaking to you from that distance), you’d likely cough and splutter as you inhaled the perfume. You then walk away and come back a few hours later and touch the table that the perfume spray fell on to, and then rub the corner of your mouth a few minutes later.... A fragment of perfume transfers from the table to your hand, and an even smaller fragment transfers from your hand to your mouth, of which an even smaller amount makes its way to your respiratory tract, but there’s no coughing or spluttering this time as the amounts involved are minute.

It’s readily possible to conceive of scenarios where surfaces could transfer much more of the perfume (ie virus) to your respiratory tract, but these tend to involve being pretty careless and unhygienic (eg you spray and then moments later pick up a pen from the table that you start biting the lid as you stress over a situation).

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 22:56

Keep changing the story guys

Yes, scientists continue to learn and the situation continues to unfold, so things change. It’s a complex situation so things often change in a haphazard way as the Government are far from perfect. There’s no reason to invoke anything sinister.

Derbygerbil · 29/08/2020 22:58

Do you think the governments didn't know of the lockdowns starting in China from 2019?

And what lockdowns were these? I can’t see anything about this.

JS87 · 29/08/2020 23:25

I loose track of all the threads but if this was the one talking about flu deaths in the USA in 2018-2019 there were 34 000 deaths from influenza and so far there have been 180 000 covid deaths this year.

Triangularbubble · 30/08/2020 00:05

Op I thought you had children you were so worried about catching the virus that you wanted them “taught” in a bubble of ten in the Debenhams down the road by Susan who used to be a soft play worker but had no actual teaching experience or qualification? Make your mind up.

elmouno · 30/08/2020 01:14

@Triangularbubble

I want smaller bubbles because I don't want them popped all the time, which is inherently what will happen with large bubbles.

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elmouno · 30/08/2020 04:46

Look at this data.

can we cancel the coronavirus?
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elmouno · 30/08/2020 04:53

Only 6% of Covid deaths are actually from Covid.

Source: CDC
www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#Comorbidities

It's all bullshit.

can we cancel the coronavirus?
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