Aibu to ask why we should bother?

[Blossomspring]

Lots of threads on here about people not taking CV seriously and I’m just not sure I get it.

How can you expect people to take it seriously when the government does not impose a proper lockdown?

Also lots of people sitting in judgement of those still trying to work, keep businesses open who haven’t been covered by the government’s income protection. How can you sit in judgement of people who might lose everything, who are being forced to choose between their health and their families as well as others and earning a wage to survive? Another sign the gov aren’t taking it seriously or allowing people to take it seriously.

If you want people to self isolate to protect themselves and others then you need to provide them with the income to do that and also force people to stay at home.

Im self employed and have now lost 6 months worth of work. Most people in my sector saying there won’t be work now for months. None of us covered by the measures announced yesterday. My death and even that Of my family’s is of less concern to me than not being able to survive and losing everything. It might be an unpopular view to publicly say but it’s not an unreal view.

You can only die once even if it is miserable and sometimes life is worse than death.

As long as my income isn’t protected and I’m forced to choose I will keep going out to try and find work and move around.

Should have saved for a rainy day. Maybe now you will take seriously the financial advice to save up an emergency fund that can cover a minimum of 6months living expenses.

How do you suggest the people who are living hand to mouth do that? Ignorance is bliss I suppose.

The government have not protected wages for self-employed people. And Stephen Barclay on radio 4 today seemed to pour cold water on the idea, saying it was operationally difficult.

Again, get angry at the government.

And thanks Rick :)

I believe there is not point in anything.. I can not imagine for a second that life would be normal after this.
I’m high risk, husband thinks I’m hypochondriac so does not believe me, sending me to supermarkets For hunting where I can get sick.. he thinks it’s not serious, does not keep any hygiene.
It’s so just crazy.
I don’t see point in anything anymore.
I feel scared, anxious, I can’t sleep. I developed now really bad heart palpitations from all this stress.. shaking nonstop.

I'm self-employed and have had to shut my business.

But I'd rather do that and survive on £94 a week than kill an innocent member of the public.

If I said what I really wanted to about this mumsnet would probably ban me - so lets stick to I dont doubt for a moment that I know far more about poverty than the OP.

www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2020/03/chancellor-announces-package-of-measures-to-help-people-s-financ/

It's very clear that the economy has to include everyone. The measures brought in yesterday will safeguard an awful lot (I imagine the majority) of jobs - that's a good start, and hopefully measures will be brought in shortly to cover the self employed and anyone who is slipping through the net.

Hold tight, OP, things are changing day to day very fast. Day at a time.

If you've been in poverty before you will know, as I do, that you can get through it. It's difficult, but you can get through it. And you will. Take heart.

Anybody who thinks a Tory chancellor will carelessly abandon his core vote of self employed small business people by doing nothing to assist them is panicking. More chance of a herd of unicorns galloping to the rescue with Jeremy Corbyn leading them wearing fairy wings.Have patience.

As far as I understood, Self employed would be entitled to ssp (£94 p/w) and that other measures are in the pipeline?

All our supermarkets are advertising for staff with immediate start, as are our local care agencies - 2 jobs that should remain secure during these difficult times, even if temporary.

I totally get where you are coming from - the other morning I woke up in tears as was worried we would have to shoot our dogs if we couldn't feed them, and even asked my OH which car still had the right emissions if we needed to gas ourselves!!!

Totally silly of me, but with all the media hype and panic buying, it is hard when you are tired to think more rationally.

Take care and keep faith xx

I understand what you are saying OP.

IRL most people are carrying on working as long as they are able, some are lucky that they can still get paid to do their regular job from home, other's are going to be financially hit as the places they work for have closed, or they have lost their business. Other people will continue to work no matter what, in those occupations which are most risky as they will be coming into contact with infected people (medical staff and a danger to shop staff, care workers etc)?

There will be so many people on minimum wage on check out in Tesco, worrying they will pick this up and pass on to their family.

We all have to do the best we can

@Cherryade8 ^Yanbu, I understand your viewpoint. The mortality rate of this virus is very low and mostly affects people who are very old with underlying health problems. Of course there will be exceptions.

But recession and loss of work will affect many more much harder than the virus.^

I think you are making a really valid point as is the OP. We are destroying the economy and people’s livelihoods and mental health. There has to be a weighing up of that and a balance. I think we may look back on this and wonder if it was worth the ongoing cost.

There are real hard and difficult decisions to be made.

OP, there are places temporarily taking on staff to meet demand for supplies.

If you do that to make ends meet you'll be out of reach of the self righteous who are calling you selfish. Their wrath doesnt extend to the people who are helping them stay fed while they stay in out of harm's way.

I am sorry you are going through hard times. Everyone is stressed.

But make no mistake your stance is entirely based on your needs and no one elses. You will most likely be afforded some protection and if I could be safe and stay home believe me I would.

I am an A&E doctor. I have increased my hours and am ready to go to work with inadequate protection to save the people like you and those you will put at risk. Healthcare workers are more likely to die from the virus and I am terrified. But I swear I am going to hold on to my nerve and treat people with compassion to the best of my ability unless I am too sick to do so. That’s my sacrifice. You should think about yours.

I understand OP. What I see IRL is that the people most vocal about shutting everything down and the most aggressive toward other people, are those who will not suffer that much from it (other than emotionally).

Exactly!

Also it’s not just old people - even though I get acid in my mouth from that statement.

A 27 year old fit and healthy woman died yesterday in Poland days after giving birth. The mortality rate for people aged 30-40 is estimated at 0.2% if healthcare survives the onslaught. If it doesn’t? Maybe upto 1%. And don’t forget all the other things we normally do to keep you alive we won’t be able to... like if you get hit by a car, or get sepsis (goes for kids to.) You need your healthcare system functioning.

I feel sorry for you Op - I can only begin to understand how worried you are.

However, if people carry on wandering around exposing themselves unecessarily to others this will go on much longer than it needs to. Then we’ll all be fucked. You’ll have no customers to tout business to anyway, they’ll all be in financial difficulties themselves. I would think it is a futile plan atm anyway to be trying to get business (why do you have to be face to face to do this?)

For now my dh’s business should be ok but I certainly don’t feel safe or complacent because in a years time, who knows?

If you are low risk, and your family are low risk, then as others say you might need to put your self employment to sleep for the moment as much as you can and take up one of the roles that are being advertised to keep the wolf from the door.
These are difficult times, be grateful you have nobody at risk in your family and have options to work. When its over the businesses will start up again, but we need to do what we can in the short term.

I am self employed and my income has been wiped out. And my business has had to stop. Im fortunate that as my earnings were not so great I was already on tax credits so I will survive. I have an extremely high risk 20 year old in the house so cannot take the chance to get some employment. I will see what I can do to diversify from home. We are going to have to be inside for the long haul.

Ive known poverty and Ive known homelessness too. And it was awful and yet Im still here.

Ive refunded every customer who had paid and now cant attend. I know many companies have chosen not to because the guidance on travel is not clear, but Im counting on loyalty and their return after this finishes. I think that many will see a shift away from these heartless corporations when they see how people are being treated. Likewise people and companies flouting what is seen as public safety.

How can you expect people to take it seriously when the government does not impose a proper lockdown

Maybe the government was hoping people would be sensible and think seriously about their actions and take responsibility for themselves and think about what effect their actions have on others.

I think the idea of keeping bars and restaurants open was in the hope that there would be a few customers in each and people would go to another place if they were going to have to sit next to another customer.

Instead people just piled in without a thought for their own health let alone anyone else’s

So now nothing is open.

If we don’t stop moving about then we will be in total lockdown

I am trying to get my mind round the fights over loo roll and people crowding into supermarkets to stock up so they don’t come into contact with other people and put themselves at risk.
Surely being in such a crowded place presents a big risk in itself

I think it's an impossible choice. If DP or I made a living through e.g. taxi-driving I can well imagine thinking there was no real way to carry on except by continuing to work. As it happens, we are both self-employed/freelance and, while I'm (I pray) going to be OK because of the industry I work with, he has seen all his work for the foreseeable wiped out in one go, and the whole industry's future is looking very uncertain.

Anybody who thinks a Tory chancellor will carelessly abandon his core vote of self employed small business people by doing nothing to assist them is panicking.
Those who pay business rates, who are the core Tory voters, are being protected. But freelancers, of whom there are a lot in the UK, are only being offered UC, which is an insult. Maybe the government is going to announce UBI, which would be the only fair and level way of proceeding IMO, but I'm not holding my breath.

I agree with clarity.
The NHS says self isolate if you have symptoms. Otherwise it’s be extra vigilant with hand washing and contact.

It does not say we all going to die if we get it. Most people are better after a week.The government says we need herd immunity. So we need to catch it at some point, just not all at once.

So yes. Whilst closing things helps with the contact issues, it’s not a crime to be open it use things.

The longer people don't self isolate the longer this will go on and the longer time you won't be earning.

Of course the government need to ensure that people can keep accommodation and be able to pay for food and bills, once you take everything away you leave people desperate and that leads to social unrest and criminal behaviour - desperate people do desperate things and then you are left with martial law and having to tackle with the army etc. If you want to contain that. You can't leave a lot of people with nothing

leflic that is NOT government advice. No non-essential travel meaning no social gatherings, no going out unless to buy food or get medicine. Dear lord washing your hands will HELP, but they think the virus is airborne so just stand near someone breathing for a good amount of time and you could get it.

Please look at Italy. Look at the army trucks transporting the dead. Look at the doctors and nurses who are telling you to take it seriously.

And if not look at North West London, where with only a few hundred cases they are running out of critical care beds. People will look back on this thread in a years time with pure horror at the warnings we refused to take note of.

People need to be looking at more than the mortality rate. Yes it is unlikely that people under 50 will die but they still get ill and require Intensive Care admission. The whole point of social isolation is to stop the spread to reduce ITUs becoming completely overwhelmed. If they are then harsh decisions will be made about who should receive treatment.

If they want everyone to stay at home, then they need to declare a lock down. Really what's the difference, they just don't want to call it that or say it out loud, but that's what they mean? There is no point beating around the bush with something so important. Call it what it is, and enforce it. There is no point in relying on people to make the right descision. Especially when it's come down to relying on the whole nation. You just have to look at the threads on here. sahm asking if they should still send their children to school because their dh is a key worker. I know quite a few people doing this irl. Most people are selfish. They can't be relied on to make the right descision on their own.