Aibu to ask why we should bother?

[Blossomspring]

Lots of threads on here about people not taking CV seriously and I’m just not sure I get it.

How can you expect people to take it seriously when the government does not impose a proper lockdown?

Also lots of people sitting in judgement of those still trying to work, keep businesses open who haven’t been covered by the government’s income protection. How can you sit in judgement of people who might lose everything, who are being forced to choose between their health and their families as well as others and earning a wage to survive? Another sign the gov aren’t taking it seriously or allowing people to take it seriously.

If you want people to self isolate to protect themselves and others then you need to provide them with the income to do that and also force people to stay at home.

Im self employed and have now lost 6 months worth of work. Most people in my sector saying there won’t be work now for months. None of us covered by the measures announced yesterday. My death and even that Of my family’s is of less concern to me than not being able to survive and losing everything. It might be an unpopular view to publicly say but it’s not an unreal view.

You can only die once even if it is miserable and sometimes life is worse than death.

As long as my income isn’t protected and I’m forced to choose I will keep going out to try and find work and move around.

I personally would rather stay alive, lose my business, lose my house and rely on the pittance or benefits than lose a family member. YABU.

I understand the difficult situation you’re in, I really do. But you have a moral obligation not to put others at risk also, you are putting other people’s lives at risk.

It's not as simple as you're just risking the life of you and your family (as if that isn't bad enough). You're risking the lives of everyone else! It's a thoroughly selfish point of view and the government announced measures to protect income yesterday.

You're ridiculous. Get a grip ffs.

But losing everything is putting my mental health at risk. I have felt suicidal at the thoughts of losing everything I have.

And before anyone jumps on to say I don’t know what that’s like - it’s precisely because I have known that that’s why I dread this happening again. Grew up in abject poverty, benefits, sleeping rough.

I refuse to go through it again or be thrown back into the benefits system. I’ve paid tax and NiCs and no one is guaranteeing 80% of my salary.

The thing is it’s not even about whether it’s unreasonable or not - it’s how I feel and I know I won’t be the other one. If you force people into this situation some people will choose the path Im taking.

You obviously didn’t listen to their announcement or read my post. They have not announced measures to protect a significant proportion of working people - people who are more vulnerable than PAYE at normal times let alone now.

If you force people into this situation some people will choose the path Im taking.

OP, are you saying that you don't believe there's a risk from coronavirus?

Because your posts suggest that either you think the government is over-egging the risk or that you don't care about the people who might die from your refusing to self-isolate/socially distance.

Im saying if you give people nothing to survive on and treat them vastly different to everyone else then you cannot expect them to do what you’re asking them to do.

If I’m prepared to risk my own life and that of my family’s to try and keep work going etc Im hardly going to care about the general population am I.

Tbh I don’t expect people to agree with me. As I said it is what it is and it is worth thinking about.

I guess that’s where capitalism and ultra individualism gets you.

can you drive? Lots of work for those who can and whatever you do normally may not be available however much you look. Maybe you could find work as a hospital porter or stacking shelves at a supermarket or as a care assistant If you really grew up in poverty. You will get benefits your family will probably survive as long as others are not selfish. And if you really grew up in poverty and escaped it it's highly likely you would have savings and insurance.

I understand OP. What I see IRL is that the people most vocal about shutting everything down and the most aggressive toward other people, are those who will not suffer that much from it (other than emotionally). People think the government will take care of you or you can just go on benefits, not realising not everyone is covered, benefits take forever to come through and don't amount to much.

DH and I know at least 8 people now who have lost their jobs or businesses and have no idea how they will pay rent or feed their families. That is not a minor sacrifice, it is terrifying. I have been there myself, I know.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be a shutdown but there should be more sympathy toward the people whose lives are being destroyed, not just telling them to suck it up.

I think they will announce extra measures for self employed in the coming days. (I live in hope).

The more people go out and about, the more this virus is spread.

Please dont jeopardise other people's lives.

I say this from a place of bad mental health too. Its been a horrendous week. But we've got to pull together to beat this thing.

Hospital are in dire straights. People need to listen to the drs and itu nurses. Its desperate. Please dont add to their burden.

Italy

Jus a thought... but I’m actively choosing not to use businesses who aren’t bringing in measures to halt this. The ones who will stay open at all costs.

Money is a massive driving force and in the UK we have had it forced down our throats that money is king since the 80's.
What I keep coming back to is I'm help!was against the poverty that will come but I can help not spread it.
Things won't be the same afterwards but if that is the worst I face I've no complaints.

But I do get where you're coming from OP. It's shit and you must be very scared

Exactly dreaming. That is exactly my thoughts. People moaning on and panicking are those less likely to be financially hit.

Already - I don’t know if you’ve been on benefits but I’m not sure if I would call it surviving. Barely surviving maybe. Existing yes I guess. I certainly do not want that. I would choose not to go back to that. In that case I will just live the best life now until I die of Covid.

As for “if you really grew up in poverty you would have savings and insurance”. It’s offensive but I LOLed particularly as I guess people find my views offensive on this.
Yes I have savings - but they will go soon enough and more than that PAYE have savings and they’re not being expected to rely on those to anywhere near the same extent compared to self employed and freelancers. No I don’t have insurance not sure why you think I would.

This is such a warped game of ‘would you rather’. Would you rather your family die or you lose your job? You chose the death of your family, warped as fuck.

Yes money is a massive driving force in the UK. I hope Covid helps address that.

But certainly I don’t feel particularly minded to look after myself or others when I need to go out and find work. Asking some people to just go onto benefits and run through their savings isn’t good enough for me.

If they want to halt this and be fair they should guarantee everyone’s wage or bring in a basic universal income. Until that happens I will be forced to make these choices and will make them and I certainly can’t be the only one.

Oh poor me, it's not fair. Sunak will be sorting out self employed next. He understands small businesses and self employment, but, obviously, he should have attended to your very important needs before those of anyone else. Hope you have enough loo roll.

Isthistrue - you obviously have a very naive view of life in the UK and what life is like and has been like for those who have nothing.

Bit you’re not the only one. You only have to look at the sentiment here to refugees and people in war yet at the start of this people fighting over toilet roll and panic buying. People look out for themselves always but love sitting in judgement of those who are making the same choices in different ways.

I do think that we do need to be considering peoples mental health a lot more in all of this. We already know that mental health provision are struggling with demand, this could absolutely cripple the system. Yes we need to be social distancing as much as we can but there has to be some kind of balance.

Longwayoff- yes very helpful thanks. Clearly from someone who has bought lots of loo roll.

I've always supported UBI but under these extreme circumstances it's the ONLY sensible option imo.
Take away the destitution possibility and permit people to concentrate on the job at hand.

I never thought I would say this about a Tory chancellor but Sunak is doing well, hope he goes all the way.

I think YANBU. The government should do more to help self employed people because many will feel they dont have a choice if they themselves are healthy and dont have any vulnerable relatives etc but they lose everything if they distance themselves. I mean the shops round me are fairly busy, people don't seem to really be stopping popping to the cafe etc so I think it's a bit harsh to say 'die vs lose your house/business, I know what I'd choose', because the chances of dying are much much lower. And presumably the chances of your clients dying are much lower or they woukdnt be working with you / booking you. It's hard and a lot of people are in the same position as you

Yes Queef. I think that’s true. If you want people to concentrate on the job at hand and fight it properly then yes bring in proper measures and take away destitution for all.

Thanks Oooh. That’s exactly what I mean if you force people to choose people obviously will choose what suits best. I do hollow laugh at those sitting in judgement of others and trying to promote the value of life when clearly they don’t understand very stark realities for others.

@blossomspring your attitude stinks. I'm self employed and rent. The situation is dire, but I'd rather survive on ssp than risk killing people! Especially my own family.. All about you and your lifestyle by the sounds of it.