Aibu to ask why we should bother?

[Blossomspring]

Lots of threads on here about people not taking CV seriously and I’m just not sure I get it.

How can you expect people to take it seriously when the government does not impose a proper lockdown?

Also lots of people sitting in judgement of those still trying to work, keep businesses open who haven’t been covered by the government’s income protection. How can you sit in judgement of people who might lose everything, who are being forced to choose between their health and their families as well as others and earning a wage to survive? Another sign the gov aren’t taking it seriously or allowing people to take it seriously.

If you want people to self isolate to protect themselves and others then you need to provide them with the income to do that and also force people to stay at home.

Im self employed and have now lost 6 months worth of work. Most people in my sector saying there won’t be work now for months. None of us covered by the measures announced yesterday. My death and even that Of my family’s is of less concern to me than not being able to survive and losing everything. It might be an unpopular view to publicly say but it’s not an unreal view.

You can only die once even if it is miserable and sometimes life is worse than death.

As long as my income isn’t protected and I’m forced to choose I will keep going out to try and find work and move around.

The ssp currently being offered is for self employed who are sick/isolating due to current guidelines and is the same for every employee who doesn't receive enhanced sick pay

How about self employed who are NOT sick/isolating but cannot work because their industry has come to a grinding halt?

I am sorry you ever had to experience sleeping rough OP, that is so wrong.

What sort of work do you do if you don't mind sharing?

People are so self-righteous and virtue signalling about people being "selfish" and "killing old people". But everyone is hard wired to protect themselves and their family first. Like the "put your own oxygen mask on first" instruction.

If you had to choose between your children starving and sleeping on the streets, or possibly infecting people to be able to keep your home and food on the table, what would you do? I know the honest answer.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe, yes you are right. Everyone is selfish, be it for wanting to survive and not end up destitute or isolating due to being in a at risk group.

But the attitude of some posters is shocking. Let the proles risk their lives stacking shelves without any protection as long as people with cushy jobs WFH stay safe.

Are you mad ? this is VERY different to flu - its double interstitial pneumonia NOT FLU ......have you SEEN the footage from Italy ???

Mumsmas data from Italy does show that this is behaving like a 'flu'. It’s a virus. Flu viruses do kill older, and vulnerable groups. Older citizens do have underlying respiratory issues. The most recent Italian statistics show that 99% of people who have died had underlying problems. 600k people die every year in UK. The vast majority are over 60 years of age. The vast majority of these have underlying respiratory and/or pulmonary issues.

Oh no, LightAsTheBreeze, you'll be upsetting the narrative of the thigh-rubbers now with that very pertinent point.

Ugh.

You've had lots of good advice that you have flat out ignored. If you are worried there are plenty of key worker jobs that require no experience:

Get a job as a delivery driver
Get a job in a supermarket
Get a job in food production
Get a job sorting mail

Self-employed people have paid far less tax, therefore they are responsible for more hit when times are hard. This is what you signed up for.

The government will probably bail you out though.

I think a total lock down needs to be put in place. I must admit I ventured out this morning to get immodium for OH's stress poos, flowers for my mum's grave and to collect a parcel. Pub across the road from me was noisy last night, not heaving but busy. My 71 year old dad is more or less self isolating and is bored but cheery. Me and DS13 are both a bit snotty. OH is stressed out as he has underlying health issues and will be probably be told next week to stay in but we're not clear if that is to self isolate or just socially distance and how long for? Is it still for 12 weeks?

I don't think there's enough clarity around who needs to socially distance only and who should actually self isolate. The two terms are bandied around and confusing matters.
OH also suffers with anxiety and is being told at work that he'll have to take unpaid leave. He can't get a sick note as he's not sick and can't get an appointment at our surgery to ask his doctor to sign him off work with anxiety (which I can understand as it will add to financial implications overall for NHS and govt). He's panicking that his particular type of steroid will become hard to get hold of.
I work for a council and we are being asked to stay home and work from home if possible. I am being given a work laptop but that will only be set up on Monday.
My service has more or less shut down (education type setting) but I work with 3 chaps in a warehouse and there is plenty we can crack on with, manually. Limited to what we can do at home on a laptop but we will be paid regardless.
I have told them I will need to work from home at some point so that I can home educate the 13 year old. The work we have could potentially see us out quite a few weeks but I'm going to tell them on Monday I'm going to work from home as much as I can once I've got my laptop sorted. It's not my fault I won't have much to actually do, but as long as I'm logging in I dont think they really care! The council are taking us to do so, so we may as well and our management have already buggered off and left us to do what we want.
Some staff in our office are going in, some are staying home.
I think the lack of clear guidance and actual info is forcing people to make these decisions for ourselves.

*But your woe is me / I'd rather get covid rather than go back to the poverty I had in childhood IS ...... I don't know what to call it? Defeatist. Selfish?
*
Yes, I'm afraid it is selfish. I'm ill with what's probably COVID-19, and it's really horrible. Last Saturday, I thought I was losing consciousness because I was too tired to cough anymore, and couldn't communicate with Andy, who was talking to the paramedics, to tell him that I wasn't sleeping but fighting to stay conscious.

I don't mean to sound too harsh, because I can tell you're desperate. But please don't say you'd rather have COVID-19, you have no idea what you're saying.

MrsNettle, we're all looking out for ourselves - and to a lesser degree, each other too. I was reading a thread from a poster that is ranting on about her daughter being a doctor and having to 'treat selfish idiots'. I gauged the grief that this mother is feeling about her daughter so I haven't posted on the thread but what we should ALL be doing, without exception, is practising good hygiene - and many people still are not.

The vulnerable and the elderly need to be protected and mothers' day this year is going to be difficult. I'll be delivering a massive lasagne to my mother's doorstep and waving through the door. She has her dog at least. We're all doing what we see fit and hopefully, the herd immunity will bring down the mantle of some protection that the government envisages.

Posters being utterly spiteful on a chatboard isn't getting it done.

Best wishes to everybody, everywhere, whatever their views are. This is shitty for everybody and nobody deserves it.

Wallowinginfilth, your rush to 'educate' the OP has made your reading deficient. OP states, in her first post, that the government measures don't apply to her job so your 'government will PROBABLY bail you out' is just a bit pathetic.

Any good advice on the thread is being lost in posts like yours. Useless and spiteful in equal measure.

I get where you're coming from but you're behaving appallingly. Ive been laid off and don't know where my next pay is coming from. A lot of people are in the same situation but you saying you'd rather die and everyone around you die than you be a bit skint for a while is disgusting and will obviously put people's backs up.

If you want to work that's fine- go out and get a job as a key worker as somebody has suggested. I've had lots of experience and HATE the idea of going to stack shelves as in my head it's taking ten steps backwards.. but I'm going to do it to feed my family and to help 🤷

I understand you OP. The financial hit from this is not being felt equally and why wouldn't people be more afraid of economic ruin for themselves than a virus that in most cases wouldn't kill them?
Please don't jump down my throat anybody, we are taking the isolation measures very seriously, and I do understand exactly what is at stake here, my point is I totally understand and sympathise with the OP's pov and situation. I do think a temporary job doing something else is the answer here.

Feelings - it might feel a step backwards for you but it’s such a necessary role that is getting more and more respect. Good on you and your positive attitude

You are not being unreasonable, OP, I too am self employed, as is my DH, and we are very, very lucky that neither of our industries have been affected so far. People talking about saving have no idea what it is like to live with no disposal income. I love the notion that anyone who doesn't have savings has spent all their money on luxuries . Even if my work disappeared over night, working in a supermarket is not an option as I am high risk and need to self isolate. I am very, very grateful to everyone that keeps the lights on and the food on the shelves. Some MPs are gathering evidence on how the current crisis is affecting the self-employed, it might be worth getting in touch.

MP Tracy Brabin is compiling a dossier on how COVID-19 is affecting the self employed. (across all industries, not just broadcast/events/entertainment)
If you've lost work due to being ill or have had work cancelled due to the virus, please let her know your story. If enough people tell the government what is going on out there it may help form future policy.
Her email address is: [email protected]

I can't believe people are worrying less about themselves and their OWN FAMILY dying and more upset they might have to go on benefits?! WTF???!!

This is why we are going to end up in the same position as Italy. We are ALL going to be severely affected one way or another.

And no not everyone is selfish. I don't have anyone close to me in the at risk group but we are all staying home unless someone needs to go shopping FOR EVERYONE. Whoever said about people getting evicted through not paying rent has not been watching what Boris has been saying. This was my big worry but still chose to do the right thing for everyone.

Although I suppose we a;ready live on the poverty line so I can 'afford' to care about my family and all your families.

I agree that we should go in lockdown and just get it over and done with. So many oriole carrying in as normal, so why should businesses shut. Let’s get the lockdown over and done with - the sooner the better for everyone.

OP supermarkets are crying out for shelf fillers etc. just go and do that.

YANBU

To those suggesting that it is only self-employed people who should have 6 month's money set aside for emergencies that is just not true. Everyone is advised to do this in case of unforeseen circumstances such as job loss etc. It is not unique to the SE.

I am SE have lost 100% of my income within a week period but I will not be entitled to UC as 1. I am not sick and 2. I do have a very small amount set aside for my retirement. However this will not stop me trying to find other work because I do not want to be working until I am 70 because I am recovering from this period of zero income. I will try and find work with a supermarket or some other "key worker" role. I do fall into one of the at risk categories but if the government want me to stay at home they can pay me a basic living allowance. Also If they want to apply a savings exemption they should apply it to employees with savings as well and those who have over 16000 should not be paid the 80% until they have spent all their savings. We will all be paying for this for years in the form of increased taxes and austerity so the least they can do now is be fair when helping people out so that there is a sense that we are all in it together.

feelings would you be doing it though if it WERE'NT to feed your family - and help?

No need to be like that, the OP isn't in your situation, has no kids. Put yourself in her shoes and ask yourself the same question - answer it honestly (to yourself), no need for grandstanding.

Go get a job then on the 111 line, or in a supermarket, or the other vital jobs loads of people will not be able to do while self isolating.

Both my sons are self employed, they are locking down to protect their families.

A lot of the problem is people not putting any money by for emergencies which in the old days folk did. We never expected the state to step in, my granny told me of the parish council aka church that would help you out only when you were on your knees.

We have a mortgage and have very little in savings, probably enough to cover half a months essential bills.

DH is at higher risk of serious complications from Coronavirus due to underlying health conditions. We are doing everything we can to ensure we do not catch it or pass it on to our loved ones. I am currently able to work from home but my contract runs out in June so will have no income after that. The possibility of repossession is scary but given the alternative something we are prepared to risk. If we lose our house and end up on benefits I see that as temporary, yes it would be extremely difficult and we are not underestimating how difficult but we are hopeful that as things slower get back to normal over the coming years we would be able to work and provide for our family again. If one of us were to die from Coronavirus that in my opinion would be much worse.

I understand money problems are tough, but health is the most important thing and I think some people will only realise that if the unthinkable happens.

But some people can’t put money aside for emergencies. Some people can’t go and get other jobs now as they have children at home from school.
There are no winners in any of this and it affects so many. But as it impacts so many that gives me comfort that the government has to help .

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe I meant they might announce measures to help her. I don't think my post was useless or spiteful.

I am facing the prospect of losing my job when I come out of self-isolation. I got veiled threats from my boss that I might not get sick pay because my family members have symptoms and I don't. Even though my partner is a key worker, I can't afford to put both my children in nursery and I can't ask my parents for help as they are vulnerable. But if they don't close the shop that I work at soon I'll have to hand in my notice and won't receive a penny from the government either.

I'm not making woe is me threads. I'm planting seeds. Looking at whether I can do supermarket jobs in the hours I can work. I'm looking how much I'll have to pay in fines to get my isa. I'm not endangering my vulnerable loved ones.