Why kill Dr Marwan Sultan?

[TakeMe2Insanity]

Just that, why kill one of the few (2) cardiologists and his WHOLE family? So much for the targeted attacks. Or shall we go with the current zionist theory that all of Gaza is a sleeper cell.
Israel needs to be held to account for the hell they have created.

https://arena.org.au/politics-of-counting-gazas-dead/

For clarity: I am referencing their research to highlight the scale of civilian suffering, not to make an opinion-based claim. The figures are estimates based on collected data, and even taking conservative verified numbers, the impact on children is catastrophic.

I didn't accuse you specifically of being a Hamas apologist.

If you assume my comment was aimed at you, maybe ask yourself why you would leap to that assumption.

Because it was a reply to SharonEllis who had replied to me.

You quoted me today at 11.14.

In response to a post I made earlier today in which I said "Hamas apologists do not use valid arguments. They are a proscribed terrorist organisation in the UK" you responded, "Accusing me of being a Hamas apologist for pointing out facts is absurd".

Again, No real discussion on the points I’ve made on here this morning- just picking fights.

I commented (to SharonEllis):
Just going to tactically ignore this then are we?
If it’s not about the hostages the only “justification” left is Hamas. Yet international law is clear: civilians, especially children, cannot be deliberately targeted to get at a military group. Starving, bombing, and flattening entire neighbourhoods (even farmland) to pressure/punish Hamas is illegal. Repeated, systematic attacks on civilians are war crimes- and possibly genocide. Targeting Hamas doesn’t magically make mass civilian slaughter lawful.

SharonEllis commented (to me):
It’s not me that ignoring things. You keep repeating that Netayahu is to blame for rejecting ceasefires, as if Hamas was being reasonable. You can't just ignore the fact that Israel will not, and should not be expected to, allow Hamas to remain armed and functioning.

You commented (to SharonEllis):
Yes very much an implication that Hamas are being the more reasonable ones here.
Hamas apologists do not use valid arguments. They are a proscribed terrorist organisation in the UK.

I commented:
Accusing me of being a Hamas apologist for pointing out facts is absurd.
Netanyahu has repeatedly rejected peace deals, and international law is clear: Israel must distinguish civilians from fighters. Deliberately killing hundreds of thousands of children under five cannot be justified as self-defence

Yes, we read it all the first time thanks. The way you distort and exaggerate things feels like bad faith Im afraid so Im not particularly interested in further discussion. I may pick you up if you say things that are obviously untrue.

The real reason you’re refusing to engage is that there’s no longer any justification for Israel’s actions. You have no real argument to make.

I’m not posting in bad faith- I’m highlighting verified reports on the humanitarian crisis in Gaza, including the impact on children. Dismissing the discussion as ‘bad faith’ without addressing the evidence doesn’t change the facts.

In my experience, It’s also evident from some users’ posting patterns that as soon as a point reaches a dead end- or they can’t counter the facts being presented- they work together to bury the thread with nitpicking, trying to make the points they want to avoid disappear.

I do think its funny when people say we 'work together' on these threads. All I can say is it reveals something in the way your mind works rather than any sort of reality. Maybe look back at the way you chose to make your argument to see why someone might choose not to want to discuss with you.

I thought you weren’t engaging with me anymore? You certainly haven’t engaged with any of the actual points I’ve made regarding Gaza.

I really hope there's a small bunch of people working together to derail as it means there are potentially less genocide apologists in society as a whole. Very frustrating on a thread though when they don't deal with the actual points.

I have no qualms about stating it is because of the holocaust I feel Israel is particularly important. That’s not to minimise the difficulties Jewish people have faced since.

I also do not consider it victim blaming by questioning how Israel can its citizens safe going forward and how to reduce chances of a further 7/10. A plan for the governance of Gaza is finally being discussed and Hamas have agreed that will not remain in charge and have proposed as well as previously accepted ceasefires under this condition.

I do question how further flattening Gaza and destroying Gaza city with the accompanying death and suffering of its civilians helps improve chances of longer term peace- with Hamas already agreeing to step aside.

It adds to concerns about proportionality of ongoing Israeli actions in Gaza when there is an alternative being suggested - a ceasefire that Israeli citizens and IDF military leaders have also supported.

I’ve noticed this. It’s like you can’t post a complicated post with several points- as one particular point will be picked up on, and used to derail the thread.

I agree- no one actually addresses the crux of what is being said. We’ve all agreed that it’s no longer about the hostages anymore, so Israel’s response currently hinges entirely on ‘self-defence’. I’m also struggling to see how their actions are making them any safer, unless the intention is to ensure that virtually no Palestinians are left who could pose a threat.

If you wish to make this point, make it without inventing the death of 350,000+ children. When people push back on a lie of that scale it's not nitpicking, its pointing out untruth.

Your argument would be more powerful if you stuck to the truth. Like everyone keeps telling you.

I don’t know who the ‘everyone’ is that you’re referring to.

Nowhere have I ‘invented’ the death of 350,000+ children. A source has estimated that the death count of under 5’s could be as high as 380,000.

Exactly! When people state things we believe to be false of course we have to challenge that and it's not "nit-picking" to point out this figure is just someone's opinion (or co-authors opinion) & by no means mainstream thinking.

@Wedonttalkaboutboris must find every thread they post on gets derailed yet you see on other threads that pro Israel and pro Palestinian posters can debate perfectly amicably when everyone just sticks to the truth or clearly states that what they believe is their opinion.

@Twiglets1 you really do use the phrase “we” an awful lot, I never use that phrase to refer to other posters can you tell me what “we” refers too?

No.

so you can’t tell me what you mean when you constantly say “we”???

It’s not that I can’t, it’s more that I’m bored by your constant little deflections from the actual conversation.

If I were one of the Pro Pals who believe we are co-ordinating responses to deflect from what Netanyahu is doing in Gaza, I would be starting to wonder if you were a double agent.

Well that would be some level of paranoia, I am just like most people saddened and very frustrated seeing international law being trashed and innocent civilians killed in a dystopian hell, normal human reaction. I am also horrified at the amount if posters on here trying to justify war crimes with misinformation and deflection

For anyone else who wants to express their opposition to the actions of the Israeli government, I found this today which I am going to use

the “No Thanks” app, which first appeared almost two years ago carrying a large list of companies and brands consumers might consider boycotting because of Israeli links.
The app has become a key tool for the BDS movement that targets Israel economically for the actions of its government and its military in Gaza.
Along with a list of companies and brands to boycott, the app allows users to scan barcodes to find out more about the relationship particular products have with Israel.

Isn't that handy? Damaging Jewish business and businesses with links to Jews- for the actions of their government. An app for everything these days isnt there?

I assume you've got a similar app for Russian, Saudi and Chinese businesses?

I haven’t found one yet but will let you know if I do. Not boycotting Jewish businesses just Israeli, there is a big difference