Please someone make it stop now

[Bellahadthese]

It's heartbreaking
The gaunt, haunted images of children who are being starved to death, the amputees, the orphans, the women who used ivf to have a child that was blown to bits, the 40 newborns left to starve to death in neonatal ward
The hospitals bombed
Charity kitchens and bakeries bombed
Aid workers bombed
Tents bombs
Schools bombed
No universities left
Nothing left
I don't want to hear ooh but Israel has a right to exist
NO state that behaves like this has a right to exist
How can anyone justify Israel's stance?
This didn't start on Oct 7
This isn't about hostages
This is about human rights and why you think it's okay for Palestinians not to have any
I was a kid when Band Aid came about and remember how we raised money for Ethiopia
The fact that this is a man-made famine is abhorrent
I know there are good people in Israel- none in government sadly- but the West has blood on its hands for allowing this slaughter
Be honest you don't think that Palestinians are human do you that's why you don't care
I will never believe the western lie of democracy or human rights or freedom of speech again
It's all a big fat lie

Agree with this, both things can be true, Gazans are suffering and Hamas raped women.

The IDF have raped numerous women and men.

It's been disproved over and over about the Hamas rapes

Shocking. Absolutely shocking.

And I know for a fact that this isn’t that uncommon a belief.

I’ve had to pull back on a couple of friendships with women, lovely, successful women, who deny that Hamas carried out any rapes on 7/10. It’s really scary what sectarian hatred can do to a person.

It's been disproved over and over about the Hamas rapes

Well that’s a barefaced lie

Those of you who parrot "but what about 7/10?" on every single thread, do you now think maybe Israeli has made it's point? Do you think that 52,000 dead, hundreds of thousands wounded, displaced and traumatised is enough? Do you think about the children who are slowly starving to death as a direct result of the actions of the Israeli government? And a world that is afraid to stand up to you?

Do you not see the mirror to history and weep?

I don't think Israel was 'making a point' as you so flippantly put it. I think Israel was and still is fighting to destroy an enemy that has vowed to commit the same atrocity against Israel again and again.

Why don't you just call for Hamas to surrender, hand over power and return the hostages? That ends the war too, doesn't it? And gets around the rather unpleasant prospect of another 7 October? Why isn't that what you're calling for first?

And gets around the rather unpleasant prospect of another 7 October?

Unpleasant. Your words to describe one short, awful, pointless massacre, followed by a cold blooded genocide.

You should be ashamed of yourself.

As if Hamas surrendering will stop Israel obliterating everyone and everything in Gaza in sight. Israel has an agenda and blaming hamas is the excuse. All i read on here is how hamas want to destroy israel when its obvious to rhe world its the Palestinians being systematically destroyed.

I cant stomach warching rhe news about VE day celebrations then straight into the destruction of Gaza. The parallels are too obvious. Palestinians aren't seen as human by the Israeli government. They are seen as trash, to be desposed off at will.

Its sickening, beyond sickening.

I'm not ashamed of myself. I called it an atrocity and it's very obvious I take both that atrocity and the war that was its consequence very seriously.

What I am ashamed of is all the useful western idiots on here who can't bring themselves to admit that Hamas should just surrender and hand back the hostages then this war can be over. When there's Gazans protesting and risking their lives for it.

You think Israel is 'making a point' with its war on Hamas? And you're upset with my phrasing? OK then. 🙄

I don’t really know how else to say this, but Israel isn’t “making a point”. 7/10 was an act of war. And war kills, wounds, displaces and traumatises. This is exactly what war looks like. And it’s horrific. But humans have always had war, and we always will. I don’t get the constant posting as if this specific conflict is some kind of exception to this. It isn’t.

It’s almost impossible to get any accurate idea of how many Hamas operatives are embedded in residential buildings, hospitals etc. It’s equally impossible to know the rapes and other abuse committed by Israel. The propaganda and manipulation of social media and AI makes it incredibly difficult.

It needs to stop but it won’t. Hamas clearly wants Jews wiped off the face of the earth. Israel wants Gaza for itself. There is literally no long term solution where there’s such hatred and unwillingness to live alongside each other. It’s a war of attrition with the innocents bearing the terrible cost. Sudan, Yemen, Myanmar, DCR - all as atrocious. We are a tribal, warmongering species. No winners, no losers. Just suffering. We will and can never stop these conflicts.

Mostly agree with your second paragraph. What makes us a such a successful species is also our downfall, our intelligence, our aggression, our tribalism.
There are examples of these conflicts ending though. We are capable of amazing things as well as terrible things. I agree that we'll never rid ourselves completely of conflict but each conflict individually can be solved.

"We are a tribal, warmongering species." @Ferretedaway

Yes we can be, but there are those who benefit from warmongering and so it suits them to encourage and facilitate it.
Go check out the share prices for BAE and Rolls Royce since Feb 2022.
We all wish that our pension funds are in those.

More and more Israeli's are waking up to the horrors they are inflicting.

https://shaielbenephraim.substack.com/p/i-used-to-say-israel-was-not-committing?r=mxkd7&utmcampaign=post&utmmedium=web&triedRedirect=true

It gives me no pleasure to accuse my country, my friends, and my family of being part of a genocide. I spent months arguing against this. Early in the war, I said that those who accuse Israel of genocide are acting in bad faith and spreading a blood libel. I was right about some of these malevolent actors. But my conclusions were wrong. The seeds of genocide were sown early on. Then Israel escalated its acts against the Palestinian people to a point where I could not stay silent.

My journey to this understanding had several signposts. First, I realized Netanyahu was not running the war in a way conducive to defeating Hamas. Second, I was exposed to the horrific way Israel treated its prisoners in Sde Teiman. Several officials admitted that they lied to me and the press about those conditions. I started wondering what else they were lying about. Then the slaughter of paramedics at close range and the cover-up made me ask further questions. I started looking at things I had avoided. A campaign to bomb all hospitals in Gaza. A move to destroy all clean water sources in the Strip. The routine shooting of children by snipers. The picture became undeniable.

I will do my best to lay out the framework for why I think there is a genocide in Gaza. I hope I get it right. But I can no longer remain silent. I do not want to be complicit in genocide.

The roots of the current conflict run far deeper than recent military operations. At its core lies a fundamental and deliberate attempt to negate the very existence of the Palestinian people as a distinct national, cultural, and political entity.
This denial is not a recent phenomenon but a systematic strategy that has been central to Israel for decades. From the earliest days of Jewish settlement in Palestine, there was a pervasive narrative that portrayed the land as "a land without a people for a people without a land" - a mythological construct that effectively erased the indigenous Palestinian population from historical consciousness

So you are saying that the Israeli’s, with all their intelligence, their state of the art military equipment, their highly trained personnel and financial and political backing of their western allies had no option but to carpet bomb, starve and terrorize a civilian population? And, at the same time, manage to gun down their own surrendering hostages, murder aid workers and prevent any independent media coverage of these “consequences”? Do you really not understand that as they punish Hamas for their actions as a terrorist organization so their own barbarism as a state will be judged?

Actually, forget that. You’ll never see it.

Even Trump admits the Gazans are starving - we are seeing war crimes right in front of our eyes in 2025 from a close ally of the UK.Where's Bono and Geldof when you need them ?

US President Donald Trump said Monday that his administration will help get food to “starving” Gazans amid a two-month-and-counting Israeli aid blockade, but added that Hamas has made it “impossible” by diverting humanitarian assistance for its fighters.

“We’re going to help the people of Gaza get some food. People are starving, and we’re going to help them get some food,” Trump told reporters during an event at the White House.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/trump-well-help-starving-gazans-get-food-but-hamas-making-it-impossible/

Yes we can be, but there are those who benefit from warmongering and so it suits them to encourage and facilitate it.
Go check out the share prices for BAE and Rolls Royce since Feb 2022.

And this is the utterly tragic part I agree. Too many nations are literally invested in prolonging these conflicts. The plot of a recent Dr Who episode had the Dr landing on a planet embroiled in a terrible war. The invaded country were fighting aliens they believed lived underground. These aliens didn’t exist but were the creation of a weapons company who made a killing (so to speak ) from the sales of the arms needed to keep the conflict going.

I hate to be a pessimist, but as a species our successes in ending conflict are few and far between. Especially in this century where the causes, means of waging war and chance of accurately reporting on it, gets ever more complex and harder to end. Too many powerful people have too much to lose by working towards a long lasting solution.

Yes, starving people during wartime can be considered a war crime. According to international humanitarian law, particularly the Geneva Conventions, deliberately starving civilians or prisoners of war is prohibited.

Article 54 of Additional Protocol I to the Geneva Conventions (1977) specifically prohibits the use of starvation as a method of warfare. This includes obstructing access to food and supplies for civilian populations, or using starvation as a means to harm them. Similarly, the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court (ICC) also criminalizes acts of starvation as part of war crimes.

The intent behind these laws is to protect civilians and ensure that warfare is conducted in a way that minimizes harm to non-combatants, particularly by ensuring they have access to basic necessities like food and water.

So, if a military force deliberately prevents people from obtaining food, or uses hunger as a weapon, it would constitute a violation of international law and could lead to prosecution for war crimes.

For those who said the rapes on 7/10 didn't happen, you disgust me.

Imagine how many people would have still been alive had Hamas not done 7/10.

7/10 was despicable.

Gaza is happening now. People are starving to death now. Genocide is happening now and that became an even clearer goal today.

That's why people discuss Gaza. People were sickened by 7/10. They are also sickened by what's happening right now, on a far bigger scale, in Gaza.

Any right minded person doesn't want to see any of this happening.

Personally I've never been in charge of planning a war in a very densely populated area, against an enemy that doesn't wear uniforms, that hides amongst civilians, and who gives not one shiny shit how many people die. Have you? So no, I wouldn't presume to tell the IDF how to go about making their war. Perhaps if you do have this knowledge you could share it widely and many lives could be saved?

I think you're persistently misrepresenting what Israel is trying to do. They are not 'making a point'. They are not 'punishing' Hamas. They are trying to destroy them. They are trying to kill as many of them as possible so that they can't plan and execute another 7/10. Whether you or I think they've gone too far or not, they are going to carry on regardless.

So, given all these unfortunate facts on the ground... if we all want the war to stop, why not expect Hamas to stop it? Return the hostages. End the bombing. Abbas is ready to take over. Gazans are protesting for it. What's the downside to Hamas surrendering? It might even cause a breakdown of the extremist coalition currently in power in Israel. Why for THE LOVE OF GOD DO PEOPLE ON HERE KEEP INSISTING ISRAEL CEASEFIRE INSTEAD OF HAMAS SURRENDERING?

Enough mumsnet for me today.

Please answer this- why have the idf been targeting paramedics and aid workers?

Good.

There's only so much i can stomach on this subject.

They are trying to kill as many of them as possible so that they can't plan and execute another 7/10. @dairydebris

So Dairy, why don't they use nuclear weapons, then they could certainly eliminate Hamas ?
In your opinion, are they just doing it the kind way ?