Have the events of the last couple of days changed your mind on the Israel/Gaza crisis?

[BaMamma]

Not only, but including, the macabre theatre with the coffins of the Bibas babies, Oded Lifshitz, and, as we now know, a currently anonymous Palestinian woman.

The locked coffins with no keys.

The antisemitic poster of Netanyahu as a blood sucking vampire.

The celebrations in Gaza, happy, joyful people surrounding those coffins., children dancing, parents smiling.

The 'mix-up' over Shiri Bibas body.

The discovery that the babies were murdered, not killed in an airstrike.

Does any of that change your mind about the rightness of your position on Israel and Palestine/Gaza?

Now that I’ve answered yours.

Where do you believe Palestinians should live ….geographically that is and under what Governing body
I include in that those in the West Bank

Do you agree or disagree that Netanyahus Government as currently stands is far right

Hamas have said they will stand down as a Governing body and allow the election of another if Israel agree to stop the war

Hamas will not stop the war.

Hence October 7th.

And if you believe Hamas will allow an election - a group who torture toddlers and encourage their own children to martyr for the cause - then honestly, you must have been born yesterday.

I think Palestinians should be relocated to other Muslim countries.

And I disagree.

Why do people keep going on about Netanyahu? He didn't kidnap, torture and murder innocent civilians. Hamas, Hamas-affiliated groups, and a fair few Gazan civilians did. They took pleasure in it as well. The only people to blame for Gaza are the ones that carried out the many depraved and brutal massacres on October 7. Why should Israel have to negotiate for her people back? Why isn't pressure put on Hamas to return them?

There's not been much from the Palestinian diaspora condemning any of this, nor demanding the hostages are returned. If anything I think the marches around the world have supported Hamas in their terror aims. Instead of the world howling for the hostages to be returned (which would be the quickest way to end the majority of bloodshed), Israel is told to basically 'get over it'.

Agree completely.

Picking a fight and losing is not the same as being attacked.

A poll by PCPSR released in September shows 39% in Gaza supported the attacks by Hamas into Israel in October 2023 that triggered the conflict, 32 percentage points lower than six months earlier.

So over 70% of Palestinians approved of the mass murder of civilians initially - are these people who want to live in peace and just want an end to the fighting?

Netanyahu is the head of the Israeli government and as such - presumably had majority support for his subsequent actions? I agree it’s simplistic to just blame Netanyahu. I should also acknowledge that there were MPs who did call for a ceasefire earlier and that there was no continued advantage in pounding Gaza.

”Gaza” didn’t take the hostages- it was Hamas. That’s a tired trope to blame all of Palestinians.

The marches did call for a ceasefire - which would have resulted in the hostages being released? I do agree with you though- more could and should have been said about the release of hostages, but ultimately it was in the hands of Hamas and Israeli government.

Isn’t it obvious why people keep talking about Netanyahu
If you look at the links you’ll see

You could even check out his maps of Gaza presented at the UN general council meeting in the September BEFORE the October attack.
Take a look

because he’s replaced Gaza with Israel!! He’s completely wiped them off the map in his Grand Plan!

You’re picking stuff up out of context from that article.

I personally find thjs more interesting ; more hopeful. People’s opinion can change. Especially when they don’t think the other side is motivated by hate.

both Israelis and Palestinians attributed their own side’s attacks to “ingroup love” (concern and protection for their people) more than to “outgroup hate” (a desire to harm the other side). However, both groups believed that the other side was motivated more by hatred.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/feb/21/people-gaza-future-hamas-poll

Netan actively support Hamas for political aims, admitted he did everything he could to derail the Oslo accords and has supported violent settlers so even before his response to 7/10 he’s certainly not blameless in the current situation.

How on earth is that out of context? What context changes what I put?

(Quote fail)

So you support the ethnic cleansing of approximately 5 million people? And (minor point) you do realise that not all Palestinians are Muslim?

Unless he was also walking through southern Israel torturing, murdering and hostage taking, then no, it isn't obvious. Nothing justifies the horrible events of that day and to blame him for it all is ridiculous. The ones that did it are responsible.

@Polka83, I said Gazans as the video of Shani Louk's broken body being paraded through Gaza features many civilians cheering and spitting on her corpse. Hamas themselves, also blamed some of the more atrocious actions on Gazan civilians who followed them through the multiple breaches in Israel's defences.

Your link also shows that 90% of Gaza’s did not believe the atrocities happened as depicted that day.

So they don’t think there was mass murder of civilians at all.

Anyway, if they were all a bunch of hateful lunatics, I don’t think forcibly moving people is right. I don’t think it should be on the table to discuss at all.

So you disagree with the removal of German territories post WW1?

Errr that’s a nice bit of paraphrasing on your part. It says they don’t believe Hamas did everything shown in the videos. Not that they don’t believe there was mass murder.

The majority of those protesting for ceasefire and for the human rights of Palestinian civilians do not display such extreme or hateful ideology. Ordinary Jewish people and prominent people in the Jewish community have called out the Israeli government actions in Gaza. The majority of protesters are ordinary people who just want an end to violence and are sick to their stomachs of seeing images of mangled children or starving civilians in bomb sites and tents.

Of course, as with any situation like this, there are people who manipulate it to espouse their own hateful ideology. But they are in the minority and it’s the job of people protesting for the right reasons to call it out. Just look at what happened with the riots in summer.

All children’s lives matter, whether they are Israeli or Palestinian and everyone has a moral duty to stand up to protect the lives of children, which has been my sole motivation in speaking out.

i think maybe you are trying to make it sound like Palestinians would stand for nothing less. That is not the case. And regardless of that - people can and do can their mind. In fact it’s quite a hopeful article. Too hopeful maybe as the leaders at the table are not the right ones unfortunately.

But the real challenge is finding leaders on both sides who can not only represent their people’s political interests, but also bridge the psychological divide that obstructs lasting peace.

Those were very different circumstances, but seeing as most historians agree it was one of the main reasons for the rise of Hitler and WW2 I wouldn’t think this a particularly compelling example for how such actions can bring about peace.

So, let's say Trump's plan goes ahead.
The 2 million Gazans are relocated to Egypt, Jordan, Saudi, Syria, Lebanon, etc.
Gaza is given to US by Netanyahu (I really do not think this feasible! Netanyahu handing in Gaza to US! Lol)

So, do you think, for a moment, that this solution will bring peace? Safety to Israel?

Because, as far as I remember, this ends with Israel being bombed from more locations. Extrapolating from the other times this has been attempted. It has not led to peace, but further mess, bringing down other countries too. It is just more of the same. But in larger scale.

Regarding Germany after WW2, it was split in the middle, yes. So families were separated. And heavily supervised military for years and years. But the civilians were not forcibly displaced! They stayed in their homes and lands. It was the unfortunate ones that were in other countries who had issues being displaced from said countries and many had problens returning to Germany. A very large number of them indeed.
I think, the equivalent would be Israel expelling the Palestinians or arabs living in Israel into Gaza. Not the removal of Gazans to other States, by force.

Here you go
The close up image was in the Jerusalem post and many other news papers at the time as they were, quite rightly, disgusted
The close up is from 22nd September 2023……..two weeks before the October 7th attack

Well said 👏👏
call it out
speak up
use our democratic right to protest

There is no doubt that here in the UK we are allowed to protest against our government's actions. Israelis also have the right to protest (and they often do). Shame that Gazans aren't allowed to protest against Hamas.

I think they’re probably too involved trying to source food, water, medical care, their loved ones under rubble and a roof over their head at the moment!
However
They certainly tried to protest against Israel for many years prior to October 7th.
And look what happened to them !

I hope folks appreciate that forcible displacement of a population is a crime against humanity, and this is supported by a poster here who openly says that they think the Palestinians in both Gaza and the West Bank (ie a population of 5 million) should be relocated to Muslim countries. I haven't seen anyone on this thread saying that "Israel should pack up and go" or that Israelis should be forcibly removed, despite past posters' allegations to the contrary - yet it is apparently ok to say this about Palestinians?? I feel like there are some posters with quite extreme views posting on here concertedly, because I haven't encountered anyone in real life (in the UK at least) who feels this way, Jewish or Israeli or not!