How did you get to your current position on the crisis in the Middle East?

[BaMamma]

Following a poster's comment about her views on Israel/Palestine changing after October 7th, I wonder if other posters' views have changed or if they've been constant since first learning of this issue?

For my part I've always been left leaning and tended to accept the narrative around in the 80s and 90s about how terrible Israel was and awfully they treated the Palestinians, I recall the phrase 'the prisoners have become the prison guards' being bandied about quite a bit. I'll admit I didn't think about it too deeply, even though I had visited Israel as a kid and loved it.
I was at a friend of a friend's house when the Ramallah incident was playing out on the TV screens, he had 24-hour news on and that's all it seemed to be showing. I was appalled at the violence, but he was chuckling, supporting the barbarians tearing those men apart, raising bloodied hands to the crowds.
So, I started reading and kept on reading and thinking and came to an understanding of Israel as the only democracy in the Middle East and the only home for Jews in the world, surrounded by Muslim neighbors. I began to see the conflict in world history terms rather than just Palestine vs Israel and saw the necessity of a Jewish state.

Pretty similar to you but my epiphany was 7th October. Now proud Zionist, activist, marcher and speak out whenever I can.

And in turn the obliteration of the rights Palestinian people to live in their own land?

It's a simple question; can't you answer it? Do you not know how you came by your beliefs?

Wut? Can't you answer the question?

I think people need to state their position. What’s your actual position here ? What do you think should happen ? What are you marching for?

I’m just generally against ethnic cleansing. I think that we could do with a voice for peace in the room. At the moment nobody is talking words of peace. Hamas, Trump and Netanyahu are all immoral and nobody is acting in the best interest of the people. Hoping that something turns around and there can be justice for Palestine and security for Israel.

I am a Zionist, I believe in a homeland for the Jewish people, in the place where they originated and have always lived.

I am not a supporter of Netanyahu. I think Israelis have been pushed to the right by the aggression of their neighbors, and the strain of living under constant rocket fire.

If Israel were any other country people would march against the administration of that country, not for the dissolution of that country. I live in America, I love America; it doesn't mean I support Trump.

Came by my position watching thousands March and cry for Gaza every week and not take a single step for anyone suffering anywhere else in the world. My position is that the world is fundamentally anti Semitic and Israel is a vital place for Jewish people to flee to safety.

That still doesn’t explain your position on the current crisis. What do you think should happen?

I think Israel has a right to exist too? So do most of the western world. It tells us nothing about your position on Gaza now.

Maybe you should have glance more closely as I've been posting since last summer at least. I did change my name recently I was Oodiks, then BaMammaWASOodiks, and now BaMamma, so you can check my history.

I'm certainly not a bot, thank you very much!

LOL - I wish I got paid for this!

No, they don't. People say 'Zionist' like it's a dirty word or conflate it with Nazism as in 'Zionazi', I don't think those people think Israel should exist.

Isn't there plenty of other threads to do that one? I quite like the idea of this as the op posted. Fascinating to hear.

One of my parents is a Holocaust survivor who escaped post-war Communism, escaped from the British who tried to send them back into the cesspit of anti-semitism and put them back in a camp, in their determination to get to Eretz Yisrael. They (plural they, all their fellow Jewish travelers) believed that they could build a safe homeland for Jews. Where all Jews, religious or secular, could live in peace and safety. Could live in peace alongside their non-Jewish neighbours, on land legitimately purchased from absentee landlords who did not give a dam about the inhospitable swamps and sand dunes they sold.

That is where my current position comes from.

In my wider family we have a huge range of political opinions across the spectrum. And every single member of my family is disgusted by Netanyahu.

Interesting question OP. I have to say that I was always left-learning and believed in 'peace'. It was a very uninformed position. The more I have read and understood about the history, the more hopeless I have felt that there can ever be a resolution. I am a Zionist because I believe Jews, like everyone else, have a right to self-determination. I also think supporting the destruction of Israel is essentially a racist position.

The more I have understood about the conflict, the more I see that we in the west interpret everything through our own cultural lens. But actually the Middle East is completely different. Even Israel, as a fairly westernised country, is culturally very different. In Palestine there is a huge amount of tribalism and religious dogmatism and I think that makes it difficult for outsiders to really comprehend what is going on there.

I am strongly pro Palestinian but that doesn't mean I am indifferent to the suffering of Israelis and In particular of the poor hostages.

I have links to the area and I know Palestinian families who have had their lives wrecked, family members killed, homes and land treated abhorrently by settlers and the Israeli government. I am in awe at their defiance to stay, despite how they are really treated as second class citizens in the occupied territories living in apartheid conditions.
The current war has had a deep impact on my life. I sometimes feel scared to post on this board because of what response I might recieve and I feel I need to protect myself so I will probably dash after this message! I just try and make whatever difference I can in real life.

Most people in the UK think Israel has a right to exist actually. but they also generally think it went too far in the war. And of course that Palestine has a right to exist too.

https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/50641-israel-and-gaza-one-year-on

Please can you do it on another thread? It's really interesting to hear about people without the back and forth and arguing.

I'm not asking what most people think; I'm asking what you think and how you got there. I'd be interested to know.

Thanks for posting @Coldlemonade 🙏🏻

I have learnt so much reading posts on here , from both sides of the field, with close links to the conflict or living in it.

Again, "Maybe you should have glance more closely as I've been posting since last summer at least. I did change my name recently I was Oodiks, then BaMammaWASOodiks, and now BaMamma, so you can check my history.
I'm certainly not a bot, thank you very much!
LOL - I wish I got paid for this!"

@dairydebris point me towards the thread on this board with no back and forth arguments and I’ll be there 👀

I was hoping this could be it? Just saying your view and how you got there? Like people are doing?

She asked people for a position. That wasn’t really a position - as most people think Israel has a right to exist. I’m genuinely baffled as to what you stand for saying that? How would you like the conflict to be resolved?

Like the poster above is saying that she used to believe in peace but has seen the light now and thinks that Israel needs to exist:

I genuinely want to know what people mean by that? There isn’t a government with influence at the negotiating table who is talking about it not existing.