Last functioning hospital in Northern Gaza is stormed by the IDF

[Whatsinanamehey]

If it wasn't already clear that Israel is carrying out ethnic cleansing in the north of Gaza, then this is the final straw.

IDF soldiers have posted countless videos mocking at the destruction they have caused in the north. The north of Gaza has suffered massacre after massacre at the hands of Israel and after repeatedly targeting the Kamal Adwan hospital, they have now forced them to evacuate after bombing and killing several medics.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx26v70n5z4o.amp

I agree with this up until your final sentence.
You can’t take all agency away from Hamas . They are responsible for what they do - not Israel

You kept repeating that you couldn't understand, I thought I would acknowledge it so maybe you would feel like you could stop. What did you want people to do with the fact that you can't understand the concepts being discussed? Why did you keep repeating it if you didn't want it acknowledged?

Why do you think it is not Israels fault that they don't allow enough aid to mitigate Hamas flow into Gaza? They say Hamas are already stealing aid so Hamas are fed already, what does it matter then if they let in enough aid trucks to feed everyone else? If babies were freezing to death and children were starving under your watch and you could stop it by just letting in more aid what would you do?

Hmm - you don’t address my points at all do you? Your deliberate rudeness means I will not take you or your posts seriously.

https://www.algemeiner.com/2024/09/26/palestinian-authority-says-hamas-is-stealing-aid-meant-for-gaza-civilians/

'82 trucks were collected by international organisations and there are currently 720 waiting for collection'

www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5ypjd7gepmo

Hamas are allowing food to be stolen and sold on the black market. The responsibility lies with them.

Last week, a group of 29 non-governmental organisations said in a report that the looting of aid convoys was “a consequence of Israel's targeting of the remaining police forces in Gaza, scarcity of essential goods, lack of routes and closure of most crossing points, and the subsequent desperation of the population amid these dire conditions”.

From your article. Responsibility lies with both but ultimately it's innocent civilians that suffer.

I agree responsibility lies with all those involved.

Of course, they are and I should have made this clearer.

Of course, it does but what do you think happens when food is deliberately kept scarce? Black market flourishes.
It happened in France, My parents grew up under German occupation. They experienced hunger whilst the Germans didn't.
Both Hamas and the Israeli government bear responsibility.

The armed groups haven’t been identified as Hamas. Even the IDF who has stood idly by and watched the armed groups kill convoy security and drivers while doing nothing to stop it have not even hinted that these gangs are Hamas.

What should be happening is the IDF should be providing armed escort for the convoys and protecting them from the lawless armed groups of starving desperate people.

It’s hard to believe the “armed groups “ are acting independently of Hamas and without their consent .
https://www.algemeiner.com/2024/09/26/palestinian-authority-says-hamas-is-stealing-aid-meant-for-gaza-civilians/

I do agree that the IDF should make greater efforts to ensure the right people get the aid

What is hard to believe is that the PA who isn’t anywhere near Gaza and can’t go into Gaza thinks they know better than the IDF who is in Gaza.

What we do know is that the PA hate Hamas. Hamas took Gaza from them, and did summary executions, torture and disappearing of the former PA officials in Gaza.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93qevdpzvqo

Amid severe food shortages in Gaza, increasingly violent thefts by criminal gangs are now the main obstacle to distributing supplies in the south, aid workers and locals say.
They allege that armed men operate within plain sight of the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) in a restricted zone by the border.

The BBC has learnt that Hamas - sensing an opportunity to regain its faltering control - has reactivated a special security force to combat theft and banditry.

A notorious Gazan criminal family then blocked the main Salah al-Din Road leading from Israel’s Kerem Shalom crossing point for two days last week.

“It is tactical, systematic, criminal looting,” says Georgios Petropoulos, head of the UN’s humanitarian office, Ocha, in Gaza.

He says this is leading to “ultra-violence” in all directions - “from the looters towards the truckers, from the IDF towards the police, and from the police towards the looters”.

There has been increased lawlessness in Gaza since Israel began targeting police officers early this year, citing their role in Hamas governance.

Thank you.
I do agree Israel bears considerable responsibility ( as does Hamas)

I was mainly responding to a pp who wrote “.There is no 'but Hamas 😭', Israel are occupying Gaza so the buck stops with them.” Which I thought ignored the role of Hamas

In this case, I feel it is both of them not really trying to stop criminal gangs because they are too busy fighting each other. IDF has the overall legal responsibility as the occupying power to get humanitarian aid to the civilians but their heavy handedness has created the climate in which this looting is flourishing. Hamas is either too weak to keep law and order in Gaza while fighting a war (most probable given how long and how few and how ill equipped they are), or they feel that Palestinians are a necessary sacrifice and fighting IDF takes priority.

However, I don’t know if you heard but several months ago the IDF military leaders did offer to escort aid all the way to the humanitarian depots but the Israeli civilian leadership rejected this obvious solution out of fear that Hamas would then attack the convoys because it’s an opportunity to kill Israeli soldiers.

Which Hamas probably would, let’s be honest.

So anyway, legal responsibility is always tempered by what is realistically possible in a circumstance and also intentions. So I am sure this will be for the ICJ to hash out once all the evidence is known.

Agreed. Thank you.

Thank you for taking the time to give such a measured and helpful post

From Reuters:
”The gangs are formed along tribal and family lines, and include some criminal elements freed from prisons in Gaza during the Israeli offensive, according to relief and transport workers in Gaza.
The U.N. and the United States have pressed Israel to restore commercial shipments, saying that flooding Gaza with food would drive down prices and discourage looters, but Israeli authorities have not agreed to do so.”
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/looting-cripples-food-supply-gaza-despite-israeli-pledge-tackle-gangs-sources-2024-12-24/

I know this thread is about the hospital, but as there was also discussion about the aid convoys, this is further news. This time not about armed gangs vs. Hamas taking over shipments but the IDF having opened fire on a UN World Food Programme’s convoy.

(Haaretz)

^GAZA: The UN World Food Program said that it "will continue to try and bring life-saving aid to populations facing extreme hunger and at risk of famine," a day after it reported that Israeli forces opened fire on its convoy in Gaza. The WFP urged "all parties to the conflict [to] uphold their obligations under international humanitarian law, specifically enabling the protection of the civilian population, and safe passage of humanitarian assistance."

• In response, the IDF said that "the incident was reviewed, operating procedures have been clarified, and findings from the inquiry will be analyzed."

The Times of Israel also reported on this on 6th.
www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/world-food-programme-accuses-israel-of-firing-on-aid-convoy-in-gaza-no-comment-from-idf/

About the hospital.

Haaretz

• The IDF said that its Kfir Brigade has concluded its operations in northern Gaza after 64 days. The statement added that the 162nd Division continues its activities in the area, stating that there is no intention to allow residents to return to their homes in northern Gaza until Israel's political leadership decides on the matter.

• Israeli authorities released a video from the interrogation of Hamas militant Anas Muhammad Faiz al-Sherif, who was recently arrested at the Kamal Adwan Hospital in northern Gaza. In the video, Al-Sherif describes how militants used the hospital as a strategic base, assuming it would not be directly targeted by the Israeli military.

I am surprised Anas Muhammad Faiz Al-Sherif said militants used the hospital as a strategic base”assuming it would not be directly targeted”. Experience of the last fifteen months in Gaza should have alerted them to the 99% likelihood it would be targeted because it would be considered to be a “Hamas command and control centre” as the IDF usually describes bombed former hospitals, school buildings or tent encampments as having been.

This is the IDF’s link to their video of the Hamas militant captured at the Kamal Adwan hospital, Anas Muhammad Faiz Al-Sherif.

”This is just one testimony from the over 240 terrorists that were apprehended.”

https://x.com/IDF/status/1876574079991296054?mx=2

The Times of Israel
(Headline)
“Hamas member tells IDF interrogators that gunmen operated in Kamal Adwan Hospitall”*
Operative says terrorists saw north Gaza hospital as 'safe shelter,' used it as armory; unclear whether statements were made under duress, and whether other detainees agree.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/hamas-member-tells-idf-interrogators-that-gunmen-operated-in-kamal-adwan-hospital/

He appears to have been tortured. Look at his hands. The accounts of torture (with video evidence of injuries of released detainees) say they avoid the face, and the baggy sweats they dress prisoners in hide the injuries and weight loss.

Testimony gained through torture is inadmissible because it’s understood people will agree to say whatever you want them to say.

Do we have to believe IDF?

Usual IDF approach. We've seen it so many times before.

When they show actual evidence I'll pay attention. I've seen enough cases of people admitting to all sorts because they've been beaten not to pay any heed to this one.

Also, why on earth would Hamas think the IDF wouldn't attack a hospital? That makes no sense. They've attacked most, if not all hospitals. Hospitals are targets for the IDF so not a good choice for those trying to avoid getting bombed or shot.

And surely if it was a Hamas command centre there'd be a load of evidence. This is all so ridiculous.