How the hell did the Israeli's mange to cause the exploding pagers?

[mids2019]

Just this is really ...how did they do it? Was this the secret service on steroids?

Thanks for this

@HelenHen

"Who is killing as many people as possible in the middle east? Should we compare figures?"

Is your metric of who are the good guys and who are the bad guys based on which side is killing the most people?

Good guys and bad guys? It's not a Hollywood western.

But yes, sometimes it's just that simple. Of course most of the time it's not. However my post was in response to another.

Howdull · 17/09/2024 21:51
Does anyone else find it funny that most men will have kept these pagers in their trouser pocket?

WTF is wrong with you?

Rather, they'll feel the wrath of the Almighty.

I think that is blasphemous.

If one person kills another it is wrong to imply the killing is at the hands of the Almighty ( or Allah depending on who is doing the naming).

If Hezbollah get attacked by Israel, then it will be at the hands of Israel’s wrath and vice versa. - not the Almighty’s.

Well, I don´t want to be advocate for the devil, but if you own a hezbollah pager, yep, the chances you are involved are pretty high. I doubt very much they hand them out to any Tom, Dick or Harry walking down the street. They got them specifically to avoid the use of mobile phones that the Israelis could easily trace.

They got them specifically to avoid the use of mobile phones that the Israelis could easily trace.

A quick derail- the evident total lack of privacy of mobile phones is something I had ever been so aware of before.

Ditto the fact that devices could be booby trapped with explosives by batches of thousands at a time. This is an unsafe world.

Tbf this is unprecendented. This kind of supply chain interception hasn't been done before

I ponder this question a lot: if my neighbouring country (which is funded by a nefarious regime and stolen charitable funds) was bombing my country because not only does it want my land it has sworn to destroy all my people forever - and then start taking over the rest of the world - and I had to do/have the following to be safe(er), what is my next move?

• Install an air defence system to ward off constant rocket attacks (the only country to need such a thing)
• Build properties with safe rooms as shelter from those constant attacks
• Have national service to ensure there is sufficient support and fighting people to ward off attacks (on at the moment, 7 fronts)
• Enter into negotiations several times to concede land via a two state solution but be knocked back on all occasions because the only solution seen by the other side is the destruction of my country
• Enter into negotiations with a terrorist organisation to release innocent hostages and be blamed by loud voices for the negotiation breakdown and it's all my fault, even though the other side are making unreasonable demands that threaten my country's security and survival
• Even though i don't have to because my country's borders have been drawn, I purchase about 10% of my land from individuals so they can't doubt it's my land (but they still are fighting me and want it back)
• Target the terrorist infrastructure their leaders built under schools, homes, mosques, hospitals, etc. to prevent its use as a base for more terrorist activity in the future (but warn civilians to move out of the way first, which allows the terrorists to move too)
• Directly target terrorists through their communication channels to identify them (including Iran's ambassador, local MPs, etc.), slow down their plans, and take some of their fighting men out of circulation for a while, with very little collateral damage
• Assassinate key players in the equivalent of a 9/11 style terrorist attack where innocents were massacred, just like the US did with Osama bin Laden, again with little collateral damage.

There are probably some other things too but you get the gist....

But seriously, what should I do?

I'm surrounded by many enemies who support each other and have louder voices (due to numbers) in the UN, for example, and so those voices against me are amplified. Shall I just roll over and die? Shall I just troop off to the gas chamber and press the proverbial 'on' switch now to make it easier for everyone?

No. My country fights because its very survival is at stake. We have the right to defend ourselves. That is war - as awful, inhumane, and awful as it is. Sitting in Western homes looking across the Med with a Western world view without (or with certainly very little) experience/understanding of warfare, history, politics, etc. - and too much social media consumption where people can have a view (with very little experience/understanding of warfare, history, politics, etc.) is naive and useless.

Israel is fighting terrorists. Many posters here seem to forget that - or even have a sneaking regard for them. So there seems to be the expectation that if Israel has to fight, the only way forward is for it to be 'clean' to be acceptable. Well terrorist don't fight clean. They are the very definition of dirty. They would have got dirty when they stole billions in aid to build their terror tunnels instead of helping their populations. Fighting clean kills you.

It's terrible that innocents die. Please don't assume that by using the term 'collateral damage' that I'm blase about the death and suffering of innocents. I'm not. It's horrific. However, I truly think some of the posters here would only be happy and cease their criticism of Israel if it ceased to exist (and it does have the right to exist).

What would you do? (And remember, it can't just be Israel in isolation. Iran is in play and Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, etc. all have agency too.)

We've all seen your definition of the Troubles so it seems clear that you are on the side of the occupier, but for most people on the island, Ireland refers to the island, not to the 26 county state. So helping Ireland includes helping the north of Ireland. People who were being brutalised by the British army for many years. You left that part out of your definition.

Totally.

So you know exactly how that pager got into this little girls hands? No, but you're jumping to make excuses for her death?

I think the question should be directed at the hezbollah father? He might have given to his child or maybe she picked it up if he left it somewhere. The father is a hezbollah terrorist organisation member. Ask him and other terrorists?

Good question

A good question. I hope many people will ponder it honestly and in good faith.

I can very well imagine how it got into her hands. When I receive a whatsapp my phone beeps, my daughter hears it and picks it up to bring it to me...
And I am not jumping or making excuses for anyone´s death. I am commenting on her father´s involvement and expressing surprise that someone could think that someone can own a Hezbollah device and not be part of Hezbollah.

It's been asked many times... as has the reverse question. It is Palestine whose survival is at stake currently. So what would you do if you were asked to leave your house to go to a 'safe zone' and then the same people attacked this safe zone killing your friends and family... but you do not have the same military capability of this neighbouring country? Then this country says its OK that they killed your family because they're probably terrorists anyway... oh but the children were innocent? No, because their terrorist parents put them in that situation so it's OK.

What would you do?

You literally just made up a story there... and an excuse for Israel killing this little girl. There is no excuse. None! You cannot justify the death of innocent people, ever! I would never have done that, and can't even imagine thinking it's OK to even say those words.

These poor kids have no chance 😭

I agree, it is a good question.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a reasonable answer to it.
What people usually say is what Israel shouldn’t be doing, but not what they should/ could do.

Leave the poor kid alone. I am not justifying anything, log on to someone else and invent some other story.

You first please for @BeretInParis question

for most people on the island, Ireland refers to the island, not to the 26 county state

That's not actually true though I suspect some in NI would like it to be.
'Ireland' refers to both the island and the state. The state is also often known as the Republic of Ireland but its official name is Ireland. If asked where they're from, many or most people from the Republic say they're from Ireland, meaning the state. They refer to Northern Ireland as Northern Ireland. Ireland meaning the state is an extremely common usage - more common than ROI in my own experience.

However, pp spoke of 'Irish people' rather than 'Ireland' in the post you quoted - and of course there are Irish as well as British people in NI - so your point is right but for the wrong reason.

Sorry to add to the derailment.

WW2 was a conventional war fought between states. Israel is a state, Hezbollah is a declared terrorist organisation.
I am not going though how WW2 was won as this is far more complex than you make it out. I just would like to point out that my family, on both sides, suffered under the German occupation and that it was part of my country school curriculum to study WW1 and WW2 in depths. I know what I am talking about because I grew up hearing stories of the occupation and liberation directly from those who lived it; there are reminders of it in every village/towns/cities in my country too.
What criteria do you use to decide if a war is necessary and just?
Enlighten me, please.
The constant digs at Judaism by people who clearly know very little about Judaism have been noted.
Conflating Judaism and what the Israeli government is doing ( as you appear to do) is wrong. I suggest you read this article because it explains why, exactly, it is dangerous to do so.
Finally, I was a RE teacher for 20 years so I do know about Judaism as much as I know about Christianity. Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism and Buddhism. I am not an expert but consider myself educated in the subject.
Please, take note of whatever you want ( this has a nasty undertone to it, by the way). What are you going to do with your notes?
On Antisemitism, Anti-Zionism and Dangerous Conflations - JVP (jewishvoiceforpeace.org)

And you know that the father was Hezbollah how?

I have just seen a recent report out of London that has updated the 24 deaths figure to

• 11 Hezbollah
• 12 civilians
• 1 unknown

In the absence of confirmation, the odds would indicate the girl’s family are at least equally likely to not be Hezbollah.

The total number of deaths may change if some of the thousands injured later succumb to their injuries.

👏👏