Thank you to Ireland, Norway and Spain

[Scirocco]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-69047220

At a time when justice, empathy and integrity seem to be in short supply, a little light in the darkness.

Link to the BBC Live page covering statements announcing that the countries will recognise a Palestinian state on 28th May.

Isn't the idea that if Palestine is a state then the government of Palestine ie the PA would represent Palestine in talks? Ultimately though it should be up to Palestinians who represents them, people wouldn’t take kindly to others dictating who can represent Israel in talks , Palestinians should have the same autonomy in talks as Israel. The whole idea is that the two states are equal and are treated the same.

I'm pretty sure the Irish government thinks the British government are a bunch of spoofers but they still deal with them, they still sit down and talk with them. They don't get to dictate, well actually I will only deal with you if you have a different government.

I think it is going to be a long road to get people to accept that Palestinians should have this autonomy and freedom, even if they vote in governments others don't agree with etc. We need to move away from the idea that Israel gets to dictate what Palestinians do and how they do it. Israelis have autonomy, they get to vote in whoever they please, even if the rest of the world thinks they who they chose is ridiculous(to put it lightly) and even if it is detrimental to Palestinians. Palestinians are equal to Israelis. They should get choices too.

@EasternStandard

"I do think that a two state solution should be aimed for and at some point should be doable I’m just not sure how Hamas part is resolved?"

The two state solution is the preferred outcome of nearly all countries and most people. The problem is that the two most important participants namely Hamas and the Israeli Govt both reject a two state solution.

Also it is entirely possible that even if you removed the Netanyahu Govt and Hamas that the next people in charge would also reject a two state solution.

The two state solution is the preferred outcome of nearly all countries and most people.
The problem is that the two most important participants namely Hamas and the Israeli Govt both reject a two state solution.

Exactly.

Everyone is banging on about a "two-state" solution as if it's the answer to a maiden's prayer.
Not so.

Exactly. It looks like a puzzle to me and I’m yet to see a comment on how it will be done

Maybe an Israeli election at some point might shift things, but what else?

Not much enthusiasm for it here -

https://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Why-the-two-state-solution-hasnt-worked-and-cant-493572

Well MN agreed and deleted @Liv999 's inflammatory post.

I'm well aware this is an English website, what does that have to do with anything? I'm entitled to my opinion am I not?I've heard plenty of British people on here calling it worse than that so I'm not alone there, the paper is printed in Britain is it not? I was hardly going to call it French was I? Also I've never been to a march but I know for a fact the marches that take place in Dublin are peaceful

You might not have meant offence but it IS offensive to put someone’s nationality in front of an insult ( eg Irish rag, Jewish rag, Palestinian rag - all could be viewed as offensive)

@Liv999 Dublin marches are peaceful?

Not according to this:

https://www.newstalk.com/news/two-arrested-following-pro-palestine-protests-in-dublin-1643466

Obviously No offence intended

Two arrested?😂 You're always going to get one or two aren't you, but yes the Dublin protests are in general very peaceful and well organised

No it's not.

It's a thread on Mumsnet where debates are encouraged with differing views.

The thread title suggests thanks should go to three countries but everybody is allowed to debate what they think and whether these countries should be thanked.

Mumsnet isn't an exclusive echo chamber private members' only club you know.

Yes and I'm giving you my view but you don't seem very happy about it🤣

I'm fine with your view - it's just that you seem to be telling people who don't agree with you to go away.

Probably folks are too busy protesting about the influx of refugees to get worked up about a war 3,600 miles away ?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/here-s-why-ireland-is-at-boiling-point-over-mass-immigration/ar-BB1mfHlq?ocid=BingNewsSerp

Or maybe we just know how to protest peacefully 😁

I was simply pointing out that it may not be the thread for them, I've been on plenty of threads where I disagree but can't be arsed replying

Like this ? OK.

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I am sure Israelis don’t want to continue living under the iron dome. There is no other solution to longer term peace than a 2 state solution.

Didn’t we get close to this prior to the murder of Rabin by a Jewish fanatic. His successor was Netanyahu, the leader of the opposition who led a demonstration which was a mock funeral procession for Rabin featuring a fake black coffin.

Rabin was considered a traitor for considering a 2ss that meant working towards Palestinian demands.

Recognising a Palestinian state may be symbolic (but bizarrely upsetting to some who argue both that it’s meaningless / no difference to the status quo given UN vote and yet also deeply offensive?).

However it gives hope to Palestinians to think beyond Hamas speaking out for them, and it also gives a message that a solution needs to be found- and this is also for Israeli as well as Palestinians ears. Both sides are going to make concessions.

Doesn’t mean it’s going to be easy after 7/10 and what the IDF is inflicting in Gaza. The idea of using brute force will eliminate Hamas is laughable and sad in its futility given loss of innocent lives.

Recognition of Palestine as a state is the start of a long journey that makes clear what the end goal needs to be.

This happened last November, this was not a march, and nothing to do with Pro Palestine marches whatsoever?

Why are you posting this? It was a terrible day in Dublin where children coming out of a creche were attacked and stabbed by an attacker. Rumours went out about the nationality of the attacker and it led to horrific riots on the streets of Dublin. They were brought under control and arrests made. We have not had violent riots in our streets before and they were unanimously condemned. They have nothing to do with this conflict so I don't know what point you are trying to make here or what you are trying to say.

@Polka83 Didn’t we get close to this prior to the murder of Rabin by a Jewish fanatic?

Yes, that was 1995 before Hamas came on the scene.

More info here - a long read but it sets out the background of the "cold war"

https://www.stimson.org/2023/what-drives-israel-iran-hostility-how-might-it-be-resolved/

It was in response to someone who said that Irish people "knew how to protest peacefully."

We do, fact. This was nothing to do with Palestintinan marches but nice try on trying to derail the thread