Terrible but not surprised - Jewish community under threat

[mids2019]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx0331xxd7xo

It appears Jews are not safe in the UK at all.

Can we seriously look at the impact of anti semitism now?

I genuinely want to know, did Hamas have an alternative to the action they took on 7th?

Shameless

Comedycook

I think I phrased it wrong. I meant they surely did have an alternative other that undertaking that atrocity.

I meant, surely they could have sought a political solution.

I feel that however this war ends the anti semitism is now embedded (or the increased anti semitism) and there is a real fear that Jews are going to the continued targets of radical pro Palestinian sympathisers.

One thing unconcerned me was that a plot to use automated weapons to mass laughter Jews in the UK was buried in the UK section of the Guardian while an artist drawing cartoons in Gaza was in the front section. I would think a UK newspaper should push up foiled terrorist plots on home soil up the page personally! It is this relative indifference to anti semtism because it is as seen as collateral damage to the Gaza narrative that troubles me.

It is the poisonous idea that somehow British Jews are somehow complicit in the IDF response that may cause perturbed radical minds to think all Jews are legitimate targets in global intafada.

Oh right, I see...it seemed like you were insinuating that they had no other choice but to carry out the attack.

Globalise the intifada, right?

Sorry, I think you have misunderstood my post? It isn’t instructions on how to avoid being a victim. It was an observation as to how people of minority religious groups react to try and protect themselves from unfair persecution in times like this and societies like the U.K.

btw, I am Jewish myself, you can search my post history if you don’t recall that about me.

Indeed, just doing what they've been saying for months that they'll do.

Israel isn’t safer than the U.K. and your kids would have to do their National service in the IDF, which given the current conflict will not likely be a peaceful tour of duty. I would think carefully before going to Israel permanently.

No, they aren't at risk because of those other "bad" jews who support Israel. They are at risk because loads of people hate Jews and use any excuse to try and harm them. Simple as that. Do you not see how disgusting your post is? I highly doubt you blame Muslims who don't denounce islamist terrorism for incidents of Islamophobia. Talk about victim blaming. The blame lies solely with the perpetrators.

That’s my home community they were targeting, I know exactly where they would be targeting; it’s a very visible religious Jewish community. I grew up there, DH and I went to school there, our kids did primary school there , and almost all of DHs family and my friends and colleagues and former neighbors live there.

This terrifies me. I know from talking to my friends and family how much antisemitism has gone up (and how little they report it, by the way, because they are so fucking resigned to it) but this is a whole new level. Frankly, reading this, I want to tell the lot of them to up sticks and make Aliya, and I know many of them have had some very serious conversations about whether they have a future in the UK. For some of them, this will cement it further.

The moment UK Jews are blamed and targeted (for planned mass murder) because of Israeli actions, and then someone has the chutzpah to says crap like well, Jews haven’t condemned actions in Gaza enough - no! Enough! You’ve crossed the line big time, and joined a tradition spanning thousands of years with yet again, the perfect excuse or reason why it’s ok/morally right/understandable why someone would want to kill Jews.

STOP BLAMING ISRAEL AND JEWS FOR ANTISEMITES ACTIONS!!!

my grandpa told me three years ago before he died that the writing was on the wall in the UK, he saw antisemitism rising, and he began to make plans and get his affairs in order, to move to Israel. That was far less than what is happening now. He’d be screaming to get out now

I don't think they misunderstood your post at all. It looks to me like they understood perfectly.

You being Jewish is irrelevant - what you're saying is that Jews and other minorities need to try harder to please others in order to not be targets. To say and do the "right" things. But that responsibility shouldn't be on us, it should be on the bigots. They need to do better, not us.

The vast majority of Jews are "zionists" btw, in that they support the right of Israel to exist. So in reality, if you're going to separate Jews into "good" and "bad", most are bad by your reckoning and therefore deserve to be eliminated? Convenient excuse for the anti semites to practice their Jew hatred isn't it?

Comedycook

Oh right, I see...it seemed like you were insinuating that they had no other choice but to carry out the attack.

Far from it.

I'll never get an answer to it though. Neither will I get an answer to why pro palestians don't march against Hamas (with banners) but for peace in Palestine.

My post wasn't directed at you

edited

@Cherryon so sorry...I just looked back and saw I had quoted your post. I didn't actually mean to...I thought I'd quoted someone else. Apologies

@Cherryon I meant to quote this gem of a post rather than yours!

You are simply another person who has misunderstood my post. As you are not me, you have no idea as to my intentions or what I meant by my post.

I was not saying that Jews and others need to try harder in order to not be targets. I was not even implying it. That is twisting both what I said and my intent.

As I wrote, it was an observational comment on changes in behaviour that tend to happen in this sort of circumstance and have again happened in the context of the current Gaza war.

It was not advice, or telling anyone to do any behaviour of any sort or saying anything to avoid being a victim. Nothing in my post even hints at that.

NO I AM NOT!

please stop

@Humdingerydoo I wrote a long message but it got deleted somehow before I posted it. In short ofcourse it's not on to expect or demand that Jewish people need to condemn the actions of the Israeli government to be the 'right sort of Jewish people'. I doubt it would make a dot of a difference to the attackers anyway.
I do think you asking people to say this makes the response seem as not genuine though. I'm not good at articulating myself but it could come across as I only said it because it was expected of me rather than my actual thoughts.

@EllaDisenchanted gosh Ella how scary. Yes I remember those threads very well. That article was frightening but even more so knowing it could have affected somebody I had interacted with even if only online.
I'm so sorry for what you and your community are going through and I really do hope things improve. Nobody should be in a position where they have to hide their identity to feel safe.

I was brought up ready to flee, as my grandparents and their grandparents did. I am the descendant of the ones who survived because they fled. We are always vigilant and asking ourselves, “where could we go?” Yet so many people want to casually give away our right to a homeland. To me it is clearer than ever why Israel needs to exist and why it can never rely on allies. They will not be there when our backs are against the wall.

Thank you for apologising,

Terror attacks are scary but still extremely rare. Jews and Muslims both experience racism to varying levels.

I don’t see protesting about Gaza as related though. That’s about the political government of Israel, not British Jewish people who may or may not support the Israeli government’s decisions (I’m ethnically & recognisably Jewish and don’t).

Thank you @Parkingt111 I edited my comment as I’m not sure she would want to be identifiable right now :(