Just sick

[ideaspls]

Am still in disbelief five weeks later that this was allowed to happen.

how did the world just sit and watch as this was allowed to happen?

now disease will ravage the rest of the displaced population 😞

The Israeli government should be ashamed…

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/nov/28/deaths-from-disease-in-gaza-could-outstrip-deaths-from-war-un-says

Well, it would be a stretch to call Gaza a liberal democracy since Hamas like to murder their political opponents. Also since they suspended elections.

But that doesn’t mean they weren’t elected.

And, war or not- Israeli border controls or not- I’d rather live in Israel, with its liberal democratic institutions, respect for the rule of law, free press and judiciary, than in Gaza where political opponents are murdered and civilian infrastructure is used to hide military infrastructure and aid money is pillaged to let those political leaders live like kings in foreign lands.

Stoma, I saw someone on Twitter about 3 weeks ago say that that the Israelis need to move on!

In fact in some ways it’s even worse- Bomber Harris made the point that the Nazi’s at least were naive- they entered the war under the delusion that they could bomb others and no one would bomb them back.

Hamas are banking on it.

Moronic comment 🤦‍♀️

No actual response from you to this @Stomacharmeleon .

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2022/02/israels-system-of-apartheid/

Just putting this Amnesty report here for everyone suggesting this all started on 7th October.

And no I do not condone what hamas did. It was abhorrent.

I honestly can’t believe people on here. The same ignorant nasty people banging on about how Palestinians have brought it onto themselves or try and deflect and come up with silly arguments

both sides of the military have done terrible things, innocents are caught up in the crossfire. And yet you will not find anyone condoning the 7th October.

why are you all so evil to condone the massacre of Palestinians? Goes to show you have no humanity

@Tigerteal well not quite everything eh. They manage to misappropriate funds and smuggle millions of pounds of rockets in. And race horses and luxury items.

Oh you mean the infrastructure because they destroyed it all when Israel left? The water plants. The pipes that were ripped up.

Hamas that pays people to commit acts of terrorism. That's 'pays to slay'. That has billions in aid but let's (some) of its children live in abject poverty. Those that don't have 'jobs' to do.

And lots of its people are complicit yes. A vast proportion want them in government and they were definitely baying mobs around the hostages. Normal people who went through the wire, spitting on dead girls.

So we mean never again.

To be fair most people would probably rather live in Israel seeing as Israel has made life unbearable and unliveable in Palestine.

@Tigerteal yes that's why they did it 'the shit they pull'. What an academic and well thought out argument.

@Stomacharmeleon so you basically agree Israel are occupying illegally.

read your sentence again love. They manage to misappropriate funds and smuggle millions of pounds of rockets in.

smuggle into where? Their own country or do you mean smuggle in because israel denies them basic everything and yet israel needs the help of big brother America to fund its illegal war.

if Palestine wants to spend their ENTIRE budget on luxury items then GOOD FOR THEM.

that is what a democracy is but Israel does and will not allow it bcos it’s an illegal occupation that practices apartheid. Disgusting

Never again. Unless you are Palestinian.

Are you calling mumsnetters evil because they don't share your opinion?

How rude

if Palestine wants to spend their ENTIRE budget on luxury items then GOOD FOR THEM.

It’s not, though, is it? It may be good for the Hamas kingpins who live in luxury and spend money building tunnels and on rockets to fire into Israel day in and day out, but for the ordinary people in Gaza I would imagine it’s not as good as stuff like, you know, food and infrastructure.

You may not like what Israel is doing but that doesn’t mean that Israel is not a democracy. It is, just as plenty of other countries who do things we might not like are democracies. Declaring war on Iraq was a low point for the UK for example and some would argue that was illegal but it doesn’t change the nature of the system of government.

@Tigerteal - agree. There is an absolute refusal to see brutal occupation, apartheid, taking hundreds of children as "prisoners" (read - hostages) annually plus the torture that goes with it, control over food, water and even rainfalll, regular organ and skin theft, by the brutal Israeli govt on here. What happened on Oct 7th was a horror, what happened since 1948 and 1967 an abomination for mankind.

People refuse to see beyond their blinkers because it challenges their status quo, it forces them to face reality which they don't want to confront and forces them to see the demonised as actually human with rights the same as theirs.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/mar/30/israel-hasnt-been-a-democracy-for-a-long-time-now-israelis-need-to-face-this-fact

Israel is not a democracy.

How do people who say Israel is a democracy etc explain why Israel has so, so many children in jail, majority of whom have never been tried for crimes and who face torture in prison? I'm genuinely curious how you justify this.

Or even

How is it justified that Israel controls whether Gazans can collect rain water

Or have the control to shut on and off power, food, water, etc?

Really, genuinely curious how you justify these. None of these are related to Hamas or terror.

Imagine if Israel had let billions in foreign aid flow into Gaza, and committed to supplying basic civilian infrastructure and allowing Gazans work visas to travel into Israel to work.

oh wait, they did that already.

it isn’t Israel who has made Gaza unliveable. It’s Hamas. Imagine living without fresh running water, and then a pipe gets laid in your town, and then a week later people who wouldn’t blink twice at murdering you come along and rip up those pipes. Problem is not just that they’ve made it unliveable, but that they are determined to ensure it remains unliveable because they want to kill Jews.

Yep. I’d DEFINITELY prefer to live in Israel. Even after being spat on while in Jerusalem. Frankly I’d even prefer Jordan. Maybe not after the Arab Spring because that made a lot of these countries way more dangerous, but when I went to Jordan in 2009, it was fine. As my friend said: “don’t fuck about, don’t find out.” I was able to spend two weeks there, walked around town. I kept my head covered, I didn’t draw attention to myself, but it was fine. I sure as hell wouldn’t go to Gaza.