TTC 10 months + Part 17.

[MuddyWellyNelly]

For all the lovely 10+ers, and anyone else lurking, who has been trying for long enough to start worrying. This is a great place to rest until the elusive BFP shows up.

Marking my space on the new thread.

To many BFPs, easy, who am I kidding bearable paths there and lots of friendship or depending on diffed/PUPO/cycling status.

I am keeping everything crossed for your pair of fighters, joy!!

Thinking of everyone on here, it's been a tough week pretty much all round.

Sickness is a common side effect of too many biscuits in my life, so I am not making much of it. And I am not menkulling. I don't have the time or the energy!

Thanks Nelly. How long do you think this thread will keep ticking over for? It started in March 2011 and I am sure most of us have now been trying for over 3 years now.

Thanks Buzz, cos and nelly. I feel quite calm now after today's proceedings.

Cos - can't believe you do those injections yourself. I salute you.

Lemon - good on you having no time to mental.

joy I'm pleased to hear that you had ET but sorry they were pessimistic about the odds. I will have everything crossed for you and hope the next week passes quickly. It must be so frustrating to go from all those lovely embies to not having anything for the freezer. When I found out how many eggs I had during the first ivf cycle, I really did expect something to be left to freeze. I think different clinics have different opinions re whether embryos do better in the womble or not. There is just so much about this that they don't seem to know. I'll be thinking of you over the next week lovely.

lemons feelin sick and craving biscuits you say? Hmmm... Anyway hope you are starting to feel better!

pout and mrsd I totally agree about failed cycles feeling like a bereavement. Except I think it's harder in some ways, as you can't tell everyone what you're going through and even if you do, they don't understand.

cos when is your scan??

rum enjoy those wines and so sorry about the delays.

Gotta dash x

joy you can inject into certain parts of your arse yourself but I imagine it is easier to have someone o it for you

Gin - was littleGin a top grade blasto in the end? Thanks for your lovely words.

Buzz - the nurses have drawn all over my lower back where I must and mustn't inject. I have no problem injecting anything but these needles are big and scare me. I use to ice the area last time and they said that is an absolute no no as gestone is an oil and needs warmth. It took 4/5 months to heal the lumps and pain in my back but I was doing it every night for 7 weeks.

Thanks for the new home nelly. May this one be full of bfps. I've been on here since thread 1, I feel like the straggler at the back.

Joy, you are pupo. What do they really know about embryo quality anyway? What is this injection you have to do? Why is its position so important?

I might have to join. 10 months ttc number 2 and bfn today :( . It only took 1 month to conceive DS so I feel a bit all at sea here.

Thanks for the new thread nelly. I have never been brave enough to start one . Hope you're doing okay? Any exciting hobble related news to report?

joy I am sorry that things weren't more positive today, but there are two embies on board and all of us cheering them on xx I wish that I knew what to say to make you feel better . Good luck with the scary injection.

mrsd I think this cycle will feel completely different for you once you get going properly. And shame on your miserable colleague. Some people have no sense. I am used to children pointing things out to me (spotty skin, grey hair, etc) but not adults ffs.

rabbit how are you feeling today? Have been thinking of you. Was debating ordering some fancy fleecy fabric to back a quilt for a friend but worried that I won't be able to sew without it stretching too much. Oh we'll, will never know if I don't try.

Welcome pottering and I hope your stay is short (for all the right reasons).

joy so sorry you're feeling so sad and it sounds like you've been treated very shabbily by the clinic. I will be keeping everything crossed for your embies. I can understand the urge to protect yourself emotionally from hope, so I am doing some full-on hoping for you. Could your mum help with the injections? Seems a bit unfair that you aren't allowed to ice the skin, even though the needle is going in deep (ie below the skin).

nelly hope all's well with your hobbles and that you're keeping warm up north and having a mild autumn. It looks so beautiful where you live.

lemon a soup-making husband is a winner! Sorry you're still feeling crap.

mrsd glad the woman apologised, so she jolly well should!

madness fleecy fabric sounds lovely. Your friend is lucky to have you as a champion quilter!

cos you're a legend for doing bum injections. I only had to do one like that and like joy the needle terrified me. MrC did it and we were both a bit freaked out by it.

Waves to gin and welcome to pottering.

joy I had a few gestone vials and just jabbed my arse, I have not heard of doing it in your back, it took a long time for the swelling to go down, the needles have to be thick due to it being an oil, I found the pink needles were good for drawing up the oil, then I injected with a green needle, I have some spare I can send you

pottering welcome :)

mad as long as you pin it all in place usually with safety pins it should be ok, it sounds very cosy

So much to catch up on!

cos I'm so glad you got your 3+ wks digi. When is your scan?

rabbit So sorry that the IVF appointment was so crap after all your apprehension about going. Big paw squeeze.

joy willing on your two little joylets. Sorry you feel so down about things. Ttc is hard enough as it is without adding the stresses of paying for stuff in to the mix. Really hope one of these little miracles happen for you.

den more delays are so crap. All there seems to be is waiting. Waiting for appointments. Waiting for cycles to start/stop. Waiting for results. Having a cow bag point out a distinguished and yet remarkably small number of grey hairs does not help. I'm glad she apologised.

lemon fingers crossed for you. Not wanting to dampen any secret menkalling but there is a bug going round. Starts with snottyness and sore throat, has waves of nausea and ends with a cough that won't budge. This bugger tricked me this month and I know how each boob twinge and stomach churn messes with your head. How many days till test day now?

Welcome pottering. Hope your stay is short and sweet

afm - AF is over so it's back on the horse (so to speak). I have lost faith now. Last cycle we took a holiday around ov time had a lovely relaxing break. I've not had coffee or alcohol for two months now. I felt happier and healthier tan I have for ages and when the sore boobs and strong nausea kicked in I really thought we'd done it and felt like this one might survive. So when AF arrived bang on time (very unusual) it felt like the end. With MrC not wanting IVF I have no choice but to just keep shagging but it seems so pointless. It's raining here and I love to go to sleep listening to the rain so I'll sign off now.

Good night you lovely brave ladies.

That sounds like my bug, Coco! Oh well Af to arrive Sat, and trying not to hope!

Welcome pottering!

Thinking of you joy and keeping everything crossed!

Waves to the others!

Joy -posted last night on old thread - didnt want you to think I had forgotten about you. X

Saturday is an eternity away! Hope rl keeps you super busy and the time flies by for you x

Feeble limping rabbit post. It might be long, I need an outlet

Joy, I feel sad for you that things have unfolded in the way that they have. I say this because I think the clinic have not treated you in a way that has instilled confidence which for the money you have parted with, they should have. However, there is no way of knowing how your embies will settle in and I have as much faith in this working for you as I always do (and that is a lot).

Lemon - sickness sounds highly promising to me I hope this is the one.

Thank you to everyone who has been very kind to me. I can only describe the past few days akin to a very sudden bereavement of a close relative I had in my late twenties. Whilst the signposts had been there that ovarian reserve was going to be an issue, I had hoped against hope that it wouldn't be as bad as this. I will never forget the sight of my black hole ovary with it's two lonely pinpricks of light, it looked like a dying universe. I am not sure the scanners words of 'there really isn't anything going on in there' will fade away that fast either. There was a big fat corpus luteum in there that was apparently very healthy and so the inner mysteries of why I ovulate, make loads of ewcm and yet my eggs just can't do it is still not entirely clear to me. I guess they are just poor quality.

I am currently struggling with three main issues.

1. Ivf ahead. There seems little to be gained from this as my chances of getting to egg collection are slim. I wish I had been taking dhea now but I guess it is too late. I'm going to do it but I feel like I'm going for a sail in the ocean in a leaking little dinghy.

2. Donor eggs. I know I can my head around this. I am more scared that i have a lining/implantation issue and that it won't work.

3)The menopause. I'm imagining I am going to go through this a lot earlier than my mums 55. I spoke to my mum and there is no one in our family on her side going back to her grandparents who had this happen and a full history of babies arriving in people's 40s. My Dad's mum had a baby at 44 and I know his Gran had children quite late as she had loads. So, I am an anomaly in the family. I asked the consultant if my ed had caused this and he said no. I can't help but think that severe lack of nutrients from 16-26 is somehow a factor here but I guess I will never know.

What makes me angry in all of this is that I am doing all I can already, with the exception of dhea. I take all the right supplements, I cook everything (no exceptions) from scratch, all organic and a lot of it grown by myself, low diary, low gluten, juices, 2 litres of water, fortnightly acupuncture, yoga 4 times a week, no caffeine at all (not one cup since ttc! ), no smoking, early nights and 8 or less units of alcohol a week. I have been drunk once in three years and that was an accident! I'm even a good weight at the moment. There is no where left to go and the results of pouring so much into healthy eating and living is two pathetic follicles. Even angrier is that I wasted a year of this on a wild goose chase and in all that scanning not one bastard thought to say well we can't see that pesky fibroid but your ovaries look pretty knackered love. I estimate I have spent a solid 4 hours with a dildocam up me, with at one point FOUR scanners in there including a specialist Fertility scanner that came over from Liverpool WTF!? The only way they ever found out I have a left ovary was at my lap. I am convinced that this scanner wasn't really sure where it was so I can only hope it has an egg and was just hiding.

Sorry for the essay. I hope one day this all feels OK and I can be at peace with it.

I have halted the thread with misery! Anyone there?

Hey rabbit, I'm just back from work. I wish I could wrap my arms around you right now. This isn't about anything you have or haven't done, it's one of those unexplainable shitty things. You only have to look at the jeremykyleites to see that fertility isn't based on doing the right things. I'm a bit confused about what was found though. Did they not think you ovulate? Or is it that your egg reserve is low?

rabbit you haven't killed the thread, I think I have a bottleof DHEA unopened so not contaminated with my grubby little fingers, its either 25mgs or 50mgs. I don't believe your ED has affected it, knewa lady with an ED didn't have periods years but now has 2 kids.

I've said before that I think you should go ahead with IVF, its on the NHS so not your hard earned cash you are experimenting with well some of it is, if you only got 2-3 eggs, you only need one. You would also get an idea of how your body would react to the stimming drugs, you could always up the dose if you needed to next time, there is also the option of natural/modified IVF.

I also find people in the industry are more pessimistic than optimistic, I still remember the look on 'dr doom and glooms' face when I started to cry,he really did look surprised that I was upset by my results

This is also just a snap shot of one day in one cycle of your life. I do hope in time you will feel less upset by it and think of it as a step closer, you have answers, not one you wanted as to why things haven't happened. As for implantation that is something that cannot be answered right now, again if you IVF with the NHS, you will be able to look at different options if you needed to try again.

I think you have an opportunity to try with your own eggs so you should, you want to know you at least tried, it will also help you move onto DE if you needed them.

You still have options and chances, its not the journey you planned into motherhood, but for me it was the destination not how I traveled there

If you have some eggs left, even if only a small number, ivf will let you get them and fertilise them so will give you the best chance because it gets round all the other obstacles. I don't think you can tell quality from a scan. I'm very confused as to why no other dr has mentioned it, are you absolutely sure that this latest result is accurate? Could it have been a bad time of the month?

rabbit I am pretty sure there is a lady on another thread who went for IVF, it wa cancelled due to poor response, she went to Zita West gotanother opinion, she tried SO with DHEA and has fallen pregnant, I'm not saying that is the miracle cure but that could be another option

Oh Rabbit I feel everything you are going through. I don't know if it helps but I've had all the same feelings. Why me? Which of my seemingly good life choices led to this? What else can I do? Why is the first time I have found out? What did I do wrong? I'm a year on from you so I can say you won't ever forget this. But it will become manageable. It's important to know you didn't do anything. This is just shitty and unfair. Every so often I reel at the thought of how I became this person. This isn't the path I envisaged in my life. But here we are. And I'm coping. But I sobbed and sobbed after my AMH so allow yourself the grief before you pull yourself back up and fight on.

Some practicalities: this doesn't mean no eggs. I got 3 the first time. And even last cycle my one egg equalled a CP. Not quite enough but close. So you aren't out of the game. As for the ED, I didn't have one and my ovaries are bollixed too. This is not your fault. 3rd, the menopause is not about to hit. My consultant was at pains to point out that low AMH didn't mean there was nothing left. Next, doing all those things were good for your long term health and were not just for TTC. Try to think of them as happy lifestyle choices. (Except the caffeine. That would drive me mad . No idea how you've done that). So they weren't sacrifices. Eating healthily, drinking loads of water and limiting alcohol sounds pretty clever to me. Please don't punish yourself for them. You've also filled your life with hobbies that you love, have a wonderful husband and are gorgeous to boot. You are facing this ordeal with strength and dignity and you will come through the other side. We're all here for you.

Right bossing over. This page has been open for ages so will post now then update everything I've missed. Big furry hugs xxx

Thanks both. I haven't been able to face going into work today and have been quietly working from home. Den I do ovulate and apparently had a good ovulation this month but egg reserve is very diminished. Quite how this equates to failure to conceive isn't clear but the correlation is quite established I think. I guess if your body can choose which egg becomes dominant from 20, that is far better than having to pick from two?

Buzzy I think I might be too late for dhea this month but not sure if I should crack on with it or not. It's an option for further down the road. You are right that I need to try and see what happens. The consultant said that my fsh and age made it possible that we might get an egg or two so I will have to hope he's right.

I've felt so shockingly lonely today.

That's a good point buzzy makes about letting the NHS pay for the ivf. I know you have to invest in it emotionally but I really think you should give it a shot.

We are born with our eggs so if you have a low number that's nothing to do with anything that's happened in your teenage/adult years. And even though you might not have another relative with the same issue that doesn't mean you can say it's not genetic. Genes are funny things What do your hormones level look like? Did they test your estrogen level.

Thanks so much nelly. It does feel as if life turned a different direction on Monday - I will never forget that day. My whole I don't know if I want ivf was really I don't want to know that about myself I think. And now I do know. And I can never unknow it

I haven't had estrogen tested. The clinic aren't measuring my amh as they know it will be rock bottom. It really was a delight of an appointment! From now on though I am sure that all tests will reveal unpleasantries!