Very worried about child with nanny - any advice? Long post!!

[Possiblyparanoid]

I'm in a really awkward situation. We have had our nanny almost a year and have 3 children, the eldest two are fine with the nanny but have said nanny has become quite strict. The youngest who is 2.5 has for the last couple of months become increasingly upset when the nanny comes. She will start crying when she hears the nanny's voice and has gone from clinging to us and crying, and most recently saying "no not (nannys name)" when nanny arrives to begging to go to bed, even twice has tearfully asked to put clothes on if the nanny has come whilst getting dressed, and once at a meal time had got down from the table but ran back to it and started eating when the nanny arrived.

My partner watched the nanny force food into her mouth last week until she was sick - but stupidly didnt say anything and this week when the nanny arrived I said that the baby really didnt seem to like them at the mo but didnt understand why - the nanny looked uncomfortable but offered no explanation. I have heard the nanny shouting at her on serveral occassions.

It has gotten to the point where we feel terrible leaving our daughter alone with the nanny particularly as the elder 2 are often not around.

The nanny is leaving us in 3 months but I dont think I can cope with seeing our little one so distressed during this time. She is normally so happy, playful & sociable and loves her other babysitter but is totally different when the nanny is here, she seems withdrawn.

My hubby & I have spent the last 2 months saying to each other not to jump to conclusions but something is seriously wrong here. Has anyone got any advice? I have to give one months notice to end contact but wouldn't even know what to say.

guess depend how it is worded in contract

if just says both will give 4 weeks notice, then not a problem as long as pay for 4 weeks,doesnt matter if you dont want the nanny to work the four weeks

does that make sense?

I don't get this.

Surely you have immediate dismissal for gross misconduct in the contract?

but cant be done for gross misconduct as DH was there and didnt say anything

if what he was was that wrongs (and agree it was) then DH SHOULD of said something at the time, but didnt, so if the beahaviour was THAT bad, he should of said something then - iyswim

But the gross misconduct section may not state: forcing a child to eat.
Therefore it would need to fall under some other catch-all - which could then be argued at a tribunal.

I don't see why he can't be sacked for force feeding just because the dad didn't say anything immediately. You needed time to talk it over and this is what you have decided.

I was giving a load of tosh when I was giving notice from a job during the notice period and I would have had more respect for the mother is she had been honest. (She found out I had been in care and gave me notice for it)

Just read thro the bestbear and link nannynick posted and it would appear to be dodgy ground to do dismissal without following disciplinary process, so pay in lieu of notice it has to be.

Wow I have just seen your OP. How different we are - I would have been hysterical and kicking his arse out of my front door, if my DD had witnessed someone force feeding my child until they were sick, well, I think he may be in Prison by now.
I think you are very a calm, measured person and in will probably go in your favour in this situation. But please to God be honest in your references for this man so he cannot go on to torture another child.

possibly trust me you don't have to follow a disciplinary process before a year because there's nothing he can do about it if you don't - he has no right to claim unfair dismissal this early on.

Just pay him his month's notice or however long the contract says and dismiss him immediately.

I know there are people talking about tribunals and gross misconduct or whatever, but you really don't need to worry about that at this stage, unless he's been with you 11.5 months or something.

yes does cover for gross misconduct and says employer is entitled to dismiss the nanny without notice or pay in lieu of notice, if the nanny has committed an act of gross misconduct - but as pointed out DH did not suspend him there and then etc. Mind you I suppose could be argued that DH is not his employer, I am.

Contract is only 3 pages long, in the termination paragraph it states either party must give one months calender notice in writing to terminate this agreement.

My gross misconduct is said to include: theft, drunkeness, illegal drug taking, use of physical punishment, child abuse.

Yikes something serious has just come to my attention from one of my older children, think I do need to get some legal advice, as still gross lisconduct too vague.

Works out as 7 months employment. do I need to pay holiday on the extra month tho?

I'm going to say it once more then leave the thread.

Just dismiss him. Pay him his notice. It doesn't matter whether it's gross misconduct or not, it doesn't matter if you follow a procedure or not.

He's only been there 7 months. He has no right to claim unfair dismissal if you don't follow a procedure or if he thinks you are not justified in dismissing him.

The end, I'm off, can't repeat myself any more.

If for some reason you don't think I know what I am talking about, feel free to check my profile and do a search against my name on Employment.

Or you could waste time and money taking legal advice which would be exactly the same.

Gross misconduct covers a lot of things and each and every individual possibility isn't listed.

I would ring him now, say you don't wish him to come back as he force fed your child and let him try and sue you for £.

If your nanny came via an agency etc is there a number to contact them did your older children tell you something even more worrying? you said gross misconduct too vague?

i think you should give the nanny notice, the reason being that your child is not happy and is infact in distress with him/her. Presumambly when you took a nanny you only planned on employing one with whom you and your children felt comfortable with. This is very reasonable. get rid quick, i feel soory for your lo.

barnstaple it can't be illegal to write the truth in a reference surely. i would do the same. this nanny sounds evil

refusing to give a reference would speak volumes did you take references when you employed nanny

ahha flowerybeanybag did not realise your occupation! Ok that's much more helpful knowing that on legal aspects. I'm sure you will see from the posts getting 2 different msgs and shame I cant save the £1500 I'm going to have to pay out.

yes apparently nanny bought tablets from chemist and gave them to oldest child and she has had them in a bag in her room and been taking them without my knowledge. I am horrified and livid, feel absolutely sick at the dangers that could have placed my children in.

Don't give notice. Don't be fluffy, or apologetic, or nice.

You are the employer. He made your child sick. Your child is frightened.

Dismiss, now. Get off the computer and do it. Now. Not tomorrow, or Monday. Seize the moment!

Yes I did takes references, nanny is approved etc.

Well that is very fortuitous I think.

Your discovery of this fact, is now the grounds you need for gross misconduct which means you can save your money!

Ring him up as soon as possible, ask him what he thought was going on - tell him that you have grounds to believe this is gross misconduct and will write to him formally before his next day at work.

What kind of tabs were they?

OMG it gets worse.

What tablets? WTf!

Get rid now and do not pay him any money. Quite frankly you are an idiot if you did. I would take my chances about him taking you to a tribunal.

screw him this is gross misconduct contact him, tell him services no longer required follow up with letter stating you have grounds to let him go on gross misconduct if he wants to argue small claims court likely to be less than pay off if he tried it on but doubt he would!!!!!!!

hear hear