Very worried about child with nanny - any advice? Long post!!

[Possiblyparanoid]

I'm in a really awkward situation. We have had our nanny almost a year and have 3 children, the eldest two are fine with the nanny but have said nanny has become quite strict. The youngest who is 2.5 has for the last couple of months become increasingly upset when the nanny comes. She will start crying when she hears the nanny's voice and has gone from clinging to us and crying, and most recently saying "no not (nannys name)" when nanny arrives to begging to go to bed, even twice has tearfully asked to put clothes on if the nanny has come whilst getting dressed, and once at a meal time had got down from the table but ran back to it and started eating when the nanny arrived.

My partner watched the nanny force food into her mouth last week until she was sick - but stupidly didnt say anything and this week when the nanny arrived I said that the baby really didnt seem to like them at the mo but didnt understand why - the nanny looked uncomfortable but offered no explanation. I have heard the nanny shouting at her on serveral occassions.

It has gotten to the point where we feel terrible leaving our daughter alone with the nanny particularly as the elder 2 are often not around.

The nanny is leaving us in 3 months but I dont think I can cope with seeing our little one so distressed during this time. She is normally so happy, playful & sociable and loves her other babysitter but is totally different when the nanny is here, she seems withdrawn.

My hubby & I have spent the last 2 months saying to each other not to jump to conclusions but something is seriously wrong here. Has anyone got any advice? I have to give one months notice to end contact but wouldn't even know what to say.

Bink - I am very suspicious too!

i had an aupair, my first, wheen i had a 1yo and a baby. i was sahm but she kind of played mothers help... and extra pair of hands.
she started out well, was v nice etc.
but as time went on she got less and less interested in the dc (or less good at feigning interest) and more and more selfish/bullying towards me more than the dc.
she started doing things like going to run their bath earlier and earlier to get them out the way and her 'off duty'... i would go up with the dc to do the bathing and there would be 2 inches of barely lukewarm water coz she couldnt be arsed to wait for it to run properly. there are other things but not really relevent to this.
because of the way it started gradually it was a while before i even realised she was being out of order.
so i understand how this could have come about gradually.
BUT this situation has now gotten WAY out of hand, and you need to get this guy out of your children's lives IMMEDIATELY. imo.

I'd ask to talk

I'd say "Please can you explain why my child is exhibiting such fear of you? Run me through your daily routine. We are extremely concerned"

I'd also consider installing some form of nanny cam / get a friend to spy / come home unexpectedly for a couple of days

Sad thing is I think things can get this bad without a parent doing anything. I've seen parents walk out of a room when a nanny is bellowing at their children.

bink i think im with you.......the first sight of someone forcefeeding my dc would be bye bye

Oh ok, I'd only skimmed, you're right Bink.

Stop feeding the troll people. Bet OP comes and gets all offended now. Would be typical.

I think you are right. Just reread the op. None would leave their kids with this person.

Not commenting on the original issue but if you are considering installing a nanny cam you MUST tell your nanny and anyone else who may reasonably be filmed. It's illegal to do it behind their back.

Possiblyparanoid - where in the world are you? Could help to know, for employment legislation purposes. You posted at 3am, so you may not be in the UK (unless you are a bad sleeper).
You are the boss, so what you says goes. Can you not tell your nanny to chill out a bit and not to enforce rules. You should be the one determining the rules, not the nanny. Certainly if nanny has views on certain things, that can be discussed and you could come to an agreement - so for example, if a child gets down from the dinner table, their dinner time is over. The impression I am getting is that your nanny is firmer than you are, at enforcing rules, which is all well and good, as long as you agree with those rules.
Force feeding a child to the point they are sick is unnecessary. Children eat what they want, when they want. Force feeding won't help to get them to eat better. There is a difference between a child spitting something out and being sick... when trying new food, children will often spit it out. Does your partner feel that it was force feeding, or just trying to get the child to taste something, which resulted in the child spitting it out?
The nanny should have offered an explanation as to what was occurring - if they had been asked. Were they actually asked?
Sounds like there are issues between nanny and your DD, that needs to be sorted out quickly... either by finding alternative childcare (daycare perhaps) or by having a good chat with the nanny making it clear that you are not happy with their conduct (make it a formal warning). Under most contracts you can terminate by paying in lieu of notice. While you may not like the idea of paying someone to leave... it can be the easy way out. To dismiss someone you will need to go through disciplinary process, and have sufficient evidence.

If this is real. Feel sick for your poor dd. If she is that frightened and this behaviour is out of character for her why aren't you doing something about it. even if its difficult isn't her welfare more important?

sack him. Yes it may make life difficult till you get sorted, but small sacriface for your dc. They have to come first

Bink - I thought the OP was curious but I couldn't think why someone would post a story like this if it were untrue.

What are your suspicions?

I read the OP this morning, and had the same reservations as Bink.

OMG - reading the op just makes me want to cry.

Why the fuck have you still got this person looking after your children. you say it has been happeneing for over 2 months. You let your youngest stay in a situation you are not happy with

I cant believe your dh didnt say anything about the nanny force feeding your child - that behaviour is so unappropiate and personally think should have been sacked that moment at the very least given a formal warning.

How could you possibly think of leaving your children with this horrible man for ANOTHER 3 months

Can you ask your older children what your nanny is like to your youngest?

Dismiss NOW pay notice if you have to, and get a temp nanny in or take time off work for a week and sort out your childcare situation.

Your youngest is trying their best to tell you that the situation is not right!!

me too, i find it hard to believe a parent would watch a paid childcarer force feed their child until they vmonited and not fire them on the spot, never mind keep them on for another 5 months.

I read the whole thread and kept thinking that I must be a horribly suspicious person because until post no. 26 everyone seemed to take it at face value. I almost typed what Bink typed word for word. It was the clothes part of it that alerted me too.

Thank you to all that have left constructive advice in your replies. I work nights hence just returning back to the board now. No I specifically didn't want to mention nanny's sex hence referring to him as "nanny" in OP as I felt that was irrelevent.

As I mentioned this has gradually gotten worse over recent weeks so even 3 weeks ago she was just clingy and crying - obviously that was concerning but on talking to elder 2 children it really did seem that the nanny was just a bit firmer about things that us.

WRT the sick incident I have only just found this out when discussing the situation with my hubby yesterday.

And yes the reason I have posted is because I cant bear to see her apparent unhapiness continue, and am trying to get some ideas on what I can do but need to find the most reasonable way out of my contract without any legal repurcussions.

Surely the fact that your 21/2 year old was forcefed till she was sick is enough reason for you to sack him on the spot? Sorry but I really dont get how you can go to work knowing this is how your babies are being treated.
I wonder what your kids would want you to do? Will they thank you for being oh so careful about the legal ramifications?

Bink, I am saddened by your message. I have been a regular user of mumsnet for 3.5 yrs but chose to use another id for anononymity as many people on here know me.

I do not feel that I am being passive but I am not a hot head either and I feel that the nanny must be given a fair chance. This is my first nanny so perhaps I am a little naiive in these things but I also felt that legally as an employer I have to be careful.

Would you suggest I should have spoken to him about her asking to put her clothes on? I suspect it's because maybe he has told her off before for taking something off - but then I don't know.

The point is that now knowing about the sick incident, and trying to speak to the nanny about it this week with no revelation of info and DD increasingly distressed I am trying to find a way to end his contract immediately and find an alternative - I don't think this is being passive.

I thought you said in an earlier post your partner was in the room when the force feeding happened?
Surely it's very simple what you do. You tell him that you are both unhappy and concerned about the welfare of your children under his care and he is sacked.
In the meantime you manage by taking holiday, unpaid leave from work between you to arrange alternative childcare.

Forcefeeding children is "unreasonable behaviour" and in certain circumstances a child protection/abuse issue. Surely you can dismiss someone on the spot for that?

So have you decided that you will end his contract, as soon as possible?

If so, then perhaps the easy way is to pay it off - giving a months notice, with pay in lieu of notice. You could say that you have rethought your childcare needs, and have decided that you no longer require a nanny.

Where are you located, England, Scotland, Wales, NI, elsewhere?

Fire him!

Even without the force-feeding episode, just the kids' fear of him should set alarm bells ringing. You don't know what is going on when you are not there.

This nanny forcefed your child in front of your partner. What would he do when you're not there?

That's a fair point hercules but I did not witness it myself and having learned about the incident a week later I was not sure how to handle it. On my hubby telling me about it yesterday morn I did think about giving a verbal warning but then began to think that I didn't actually want this childcare to continue.

Yes did think about a nannycam but am aware you must not do without ppl's knowledge.

Nannynick, I'm just outside London. And yes I think this about the nanny being stricter with routines than us - I am most certainly not suggesting anything else but felt it relevant to mention the things that my daughter had said and done on nanny's arrival for work.