Shall I pay my DM?

[skyfly]

Hi all, I feel confused and need a sounding board. My mom offered to help with after school care for our two DC (8 and 5) from September. She will be collecting them from school 3 days per week and stay until 6.30-7pm. I was so pleased when she offered as it would reduce financial burden on our family. However, she since asked me to be paid as per babysitter rate. She said that this is going to be work for her, we are likely to expect her to babysit occasionally on weekends or be late at work. I don’t mind helping her out financially and had previously helped her quite a lot, esp during Covid, and got back to work with 4 months old baby to be able to help paying her mortgage

But I feel differently this time, I feel hurt and I cannot explain why. I just feel that I already put so much help out there but now we’ve been looking to cut costs so I assumed that offer of help was to alleviate financial pressure on our family. She also told me that she doesn’t not feel grateful for my financial help to date as I do not treat her like nice daughter. I grew up with my own grandma and was extremely close to her so I feel hurt that my mom considers being with her grandchildren as a work. Am I being too sensitive though?

My mother was my childminder when I went back to work full time. I gave her money for food. As the result of spending 18 months being looked after by her, my daughter had an incredible relationship with her grandmother. You might want to factor the benefit to your children of spending quality time with their grandmother into your decision making.

Depends on the grandmother though. This one tells OP She isn't a nice daughter after the daughter has paid £3k of her mortgage for her. I wouldn't want such a toxic person around my kids filling their heads with all sorts of nonsense like this.

Were you definitely paying for her mortgage?

Rather than for example paying towards the house ie bills, food etc?

Either way, if she wanted paying she should have said in the first place that she'd look after them for a price.

If you're paying you may as well look at other options. If it's going to cause confrontation you can easily say 'if I'm paying the advantages of choosing this one is this that and the other'.

Being paid for set and regular hours makes your Mum a childminder. She's straying into a bit of a grey area for needing to be registered/pay tax.
Is your Mum struggling for money?
I can see why you're a bit taken aback having assumed she was offering a favour and actually she wants to be paid.
She sounds as if she's expecting you to be more generous towards her than perhaps you can afford either. Parents shouldn't really expect their kids to subsidise them, but it happens a lot.

I can't see my mum or my MIL ever charging us for childcare. However, 3 afternoons a week is a big commitment on her part and more than just occasional babysitting.
To be honest, if my mum did this I'd probably offer a nominal sum a week to cover the costs of food etc. I think I'd also treat her sometimes to show my appreciation.
However, your mum has already received thousands from you so that does change things.
Honestly, I don't think this arrangement will work. Your mum sounds ungrateful and you will be resentful. I'd rather go with a professional childminder.
Being an armchair psychologist here - do you think you've given her so much money in an effort to buy her love? I just thought that after you said you grew up with a grandparent rather than with your mother.

You are right, I grew up trying to win her love and I still do now with trying to raise my children with their grandmother present in life. I should have long gave up as she often turns nasty on me and no matter how hard I try, she would never be grateful. She wished for her kids to have a different life but we took our own decisions that she never approved or accepted. Btw my elder brother has never helped her financially, despite not having kids on his own. And her response is always: “oh he does so much more for me than you”. Hard to accept but i think she never truly loved me

That’s a very good point. I don’t see an issue with paying gp’s something for regular childcare, depending on everyone’s circumstances, but this, combined with it being ok for op to financially help her mother with no return is awful.
I’d be looking for better childcare and cutting contact down a fair bit.

If it was interfering with her ability to take up other paid employment then I could understand it but clearly if you decide not to use her she's not going to go off and seek paid babysitting work elsewhere.

I think the whole thing sounds like a recipe for disaster and if you are going to have to pay anyway then you should look for someone else.

Yes I paid for her mortgage payments for 18 months. Also, I’ve been helping with small lump sums to cover food/bills.

She doesn't sound like someone you can rely on, the silver lining here might be that this upfront CF behaviour is going to save you the world of pain you'd have later on from using someone like her as regular childcare. Id be telling here you're going to use a childcare service where you have back-up in the case of sickness and can get the 20% tax free childcare reductions. I couldn't imagine doing this to my children, but it's evn worse that she's previously accepted financial help from you that she waited till you're accepted her offer of childcare to say she wanted paying once you accepted. She's being a shit mum with all this, but the least she could have done was be upfront from the start l on the money.

@skyfly

My response here, considering youve been paying her mortgage for a while plus other costs, would be either:

1. she provide childcare for the 3 times a week as agreed IN RETURN FOR your financial help continuing

2. you stop your financial contributions and pay her to provide childcare at the going rate (I wouldn't do this personally)

3. you find someone else to provide the childcare you need (and maybe also stop the financial help, given she isn't grateful for it)

I suspect this issue is both the most recent of a very long list of 'minor' niggles and perhaps also a final straw.
The negative/distant parenting from your Mum, plus the golden child (your brother) and the scapegoat child (you) is a classic toxic combination.
I'd suggest you have more to unpick here.

Sounds like you need to find alternative arrangements. It's probably not a good environment for your children to inhabit anyway. Obviously you won't be able to help out with your additional expenses.

OP I'm so sorry. Your DM is awful. She has abused your kindness in the past and whilst I agree with other posters about a nominal amount being reasonable, she just sounds like an absolute sponger. I'm glad for you that you've got a heads up on her behaviour now, before she was able to hurt you further. I don't think I'd personally want someone like that having care of my child.

It's my pleasure to have my grandchildren and I wouldn't dream of asking to be paid.
My daughter and SIL treat us to meals and holidays as a thank you, but it's absolutely not necessary or expected.

I wonder if there was more to her relationship with your grandma. Perhaps your grandma had a resentment to your mum over having to look after kids (she wouldn't show you that obviously) and your mum not contributing

I think if you want your mum to have a relationship with the kids ask her to do it one day, a day that you can easily cover if she isn't well, and then sort something for the other 2

My mam and dad looked after most of my 3 kids at some point. I'm the youngest of 5. They did it for all their grandkids. My youngest 2 did have childminders also but my parents helped out on a set day or 2 with the oldest and then mam herself helped with my other 2 as dad passed in 2000. Sometimes I'd come home from work and mam had cleaned my house and done the washing. She said it kept her young and busy. She was early 60s at this point. I always helped her with other stuff like taking her on days out and little caravan breaks and taking her shopping. I just don't understand your mothers mentality at all.

As a single parent, the bulk of my wages was paid to childminders for before, after and school holiday care.

When my DGD was born, I condensed my 5 working days into 4 so I could help my DS and DIL out when she went back to work otherwise she would have been working for nothing. I've had DGD every Friday since her being 9 months old. I wouldn't dream of saying I expect to be paid for it.

My second DGD is due in September and again when my other DIL returns to work, I'll also have the new baby on the Friday.

Dump your mother! From every aspect of your life. She's a leech. She will never change.

Go online and search for either a registered childminder or a local babysitting service. Or are there neighbours kids you could trust and who would value some extra spends?

9 times out of 10 the first post nails it but this one is way wide of the mark. So far away it seems to be answering another question, in my opinion.

Why would you @skyfly think that you shouldn't pay your mother for looking after her grandchildren for the duration that she is?
I am guessing that she is still young enough to be doing activities with them, right? If your mother wasn't going to be looking after your children, you would have to pay full market rate for childcare. She is looking for babysitting rates (which I believe are already reduced to what you could end up paying).
She has given you her expectations - by saying it will be work to her and you generally pay people for doing work for you.
I think you are being sensitive and if you don't want to pay her, you'll end up paying elsewhere. The question now should be do I want to pay my mother, the child(ren)s grandmother to look after my child(ren) or do I pay someone else, who will start off being a stranger to them and they'll be in with a bunch of other kids too.
The key bit, however is tucked away in your final bit of your opening post where you've said that you've helped her with her financial issues, so much so that you went back to work when one of your kids was 4 months old (thereby not taking additional maternity leave) and she says that you don't treat her in the way a nice daughter would. That would make me want to take as much maternity leave this time that I could and to not have her involved in anyway, even as a last ditch babysitter for emergencies, with the care of these kids. She doesn't sound like the right influence to be around your kids.

I went part time when my first grandchild was born so that I could look after them 1 day a week. I still continue to do so 5 years later. My DD doesn’t give me any money, and in fact it costs ME money - petrol, trips to swimming, lunch out etc. I would t have it any other way.
Your mum is not a very nice person I’m afraid.

I'd be looking for alternative care and claiming the 20%tax back through .gov.
More reliable and no one can make you feel guilty about it either.
Her loss if you ask me.

Your mother sounds like a classic narcissist, I would cut ties and save your children from the same abusive relationship you're experiencing.

You sound nice.
Your mother unfortunately does not.
Friends are the family that we choose - please go low contact with your mum and use the time you have saved to have lovely people in your life. You and your children deserve that.

I would rather use childcare than pay your mum who thinks you aren't nice to her and asks to be paid when she has had a lot of money from you already. Paid childcare will be more reliable for sickness/holidays too. To reduce the financial burdon on yourself do not pay anything else for your mum.

Your mother really does not sound nice and really not the sort of person who should look after your children. She doesn’t seem to like you and will be poising your children’s minds against you. Go with another plan. Are there cultural reasons why you are subsidising your mother? You are under financial pressure yourself so STOP giving her money, groceries etc. My mother always preferred by brother so now I just leave them to it. I am a grandparent that does childcare 2 days a week. I would not dream of taking money for it. It is a huge pleasure to see them.