I want to give up!!

[wobblymum]

I can't get to grips with breastfeeding and I feel like just switching to formula now.

I was in hospital for 2 weeks because dd had bad jaundice and Strep B infection. She lost a fir bit of weight because of it and would sleep most of the time and wouldn't feed well at all. The midwives weren't much help and I left hospital no better off in breastfeeding than when she was first born. Now I've been home a week and I still can't breastfeed very well. DD hasn't put on any weight like she should have and the health visitor says shes quite worried. I'm trying to top her up with a bottle at night but that doesn't seem to be working too well but it's better than nothing. I can't express, it just never seems to work.

I'm having to force myself to eat and drink to help my milk supply because I just feel sick all the time. DD hardly ever wants to spend much time at the breast, so she can't possibly be getting loads of food. I try to keep putting her on every 3 hours, as suggested by the midwife, but she just wants to sleep and I never seem to be able to get time to rest or eat in between.

It's really getting me down and I just feel like bottle feeding would be the perfect solution but I want to breastfeed and I feel guilty just about the idea, because breast is best. Also I feel like I'll really regret it if I give up now but I don't feel like I can carry on - I just feel stuck in the middle.

Has anyone been through a similar situation? Please help, I just don't know what to do. I feel useless at getting the position and latching on right, even though I've had loads of advice and demonstrations and I feel like I'm not doing it long enough or often enough. I'm trying, but I just get so exhausted.

Wobblymum - the NCT breastfeeding helpline is 0870 444 8708. It's open 8am - 10pm and has trained breastfeeding counsellors operating it.
It's still early days yet - your supply will be a bit weird because you've been ill, but you'll be able to get on track very soon if you get some support.

My ds was really sleepy for about 3 weeks too (c-section baby). I had to keep waking him up for feeds too - topping and tailing/loads of extra nappy changes/tickling feet and blowing gently on his face to keep him awake. If your dd is sleepy for b/f, she'll probably still be sleepy during bottle feeds too.

Before you feed, make yourself a huge glass of water to drink while you feed.

There are loads of mumsnetters with a wealth of experience out there who can give loads more advice. But don't give up just yet. Keep posting. ((()))

I agree - phone the NCT helpline. They will try o help you over the phone and can try to find you a counsellor local to you who will be able to help you face to face. It's all free and you don't have to be a member of the NCT.

I struggled to feed DS1 at first but against all the midwives expectations, I managed it in the end and fed him (and later DS2) for over a year. Despite what the Experts say, breastfeeding doesn't come naturally to everyone, not everyone finds it easy and I'd bet that no one does it without any problems at all. Stick with it and it will get better.

If you really want to breastfeed then get in touch with a breastfeeding counsellor and get them to help. If you don't really want to do it then don't feel guilty (and I stress the word don't here). Mixed feeding can work really well too.

Hang in there! It does get better if you want to persevere.

Hugs.

I agree, it really sounds as though your baby is still sleepy from the jaundice, and as bobsmum said, she may be just as sleepy with bottles. I would really try and persist for a while, at least, if you can; it may suddenly get much better. The only other practical thing I can suggest you may already be doing- try to express first thing in the morning on one side while your baby feeds on the other. That was the only way I could express for a long time (bit fiddly though!). It might reassure you that you are producing milk, and who knows, the noise might keep your baby awake!
Chin up, it sounds as though you're doing really well, but phone that counsellor.

Agree with the other folks here - also, if your dd is sleeping a lot - she is likely getting enough food. My dd was always hungry, so crying a lot - constantly at the breast. It's important to feel confident that you are nourishing your baby, and as I'm sure they've told you if she is pooing and peeing regularly, you're doing fine.

Sorry in advance, this has turned out more waffly than I meant.

Yes, I've been there. You have my deepest sympathies. All I can say is go with what feels right to you. If you want to bf - keep going. It takes a while for bf to settle anyway and with jaundiced babies I think it takes longer. If you really don't (and it isn't just the exhaustion talking) bottle feed and don't feel guilty. And remember you can mix feeds - bf some and bottle others. It works for many of us.

I eventually did give up after awful thrush problems, regretted it dreadfully and restarted after a week. I mix fed for a couple of months but now DS is now nearly 7mo and completely bf. I'm hoping to feed until he's a year. This is simply to say - it can be horrible but it can also come right if you persevere.

Do talk to the bf counsellors - I have a couple of times with different problems and they've been great. Maybe you could get someone round to the house to sit with you for one or more feeds. Somehow advice and demonstrations, however good, aren't the same once you're at home on your own with your baby. I was only in for 5 days but felt very vulnerable and alone when I got home. It must be so much worse if you were in for 2 weeks.

When you go to feed give yourself time to get settled. Get your drink and a snack (cut meat is good if you're a meat eater, or how about milkshakes?) within reach and relax. Only then try to feed your dd.

Good luck - tell us how you get on

{{{}}}

Oh poor you wobblymum..sounds like you've had a tough time!! Two weeks in hospital - argh! My DD also had jaundice and was sometimes too sleepy to feed. One midwife's suggestion that was so helpful was to strip her off and feed her 'skin to skin'. Probably sounds silly but I would take off my shirt too and just feed her with all that skin contact. Seemed to encourage her to feed more. Might be worth a try.

Breastfeeding is certainly tough at the beginning but it really is worth persevering at for a few weeks. Having said that, if it honestly doesn't work for you don't feel a failure for moving onto formula. The most important thing is enjoying your new baby.

Sympathy wobblymum. It's awful when breastfeeding isn't going well, - I spent the first 12 weeks of dd1's life wanting to switch to the bottle, but we battled on and she thrived and eventually it became very straightforward, but not without a lot of tears at first.

To be honest, midwives aren't necessarily the best ones to go to for specialist advice on bf, and neither necessarily are health visitors. In fact sometimes your hear them saying such awful, unhelpful things, that it can be very demoralising. You should really try and see a specialist bf counsellor - your health visitor should be able to let you know if there is one attached to your local hospital. Otherwise you could try your local branch of the nct, or the la leche league. You should be able to search online for local contact info.

Obviously I don't know where you live, but if you are reasonably near to Oxford, they have an excellent breast feeding clinic in the John Radcliffe Hospital run by 2 leading breast-feeding experts who have published books and papers on the subject. They really know their stuff and will see anyone who wants to drop in - you don't need to have delivered in the hospital.

Don't worry if dd isn't feeding for hours at the breast. Sometimes they can get all they need after just 3 or 4 minutes. Try feeling your breast before and after you feed her - that will give you a better idea of how much she might have taken off in a feed, which could help to set your mind at ease.

Why are you feeling sick, by the way? Have you told your health visitor about that? If you are feeling unwell, be sure to get the help you need as well. I wouldn't force yourself to eat - just follow the demands of your appetite - that should be enough of a guide to guage your nutritional needs for producing milk.

Please don't feel guilty - you are trying your best, and it is exhausting and demoralising, but you are giving it your best shot and that is all you can do. If you don't manage to continue, then look on the positive side - she has already benefitted from 2 weeks of breast milk. You are doing well.

Just had another thought - might it be worth persuading another bf mum letting you have a good look at how her baby latches on when she feeds. Obviously have to be someone who would feel comfortable with this, and you would have to also. But sometimes it helps to watch how you're supposed to do it, rather than be told, or look at diagrams etc.

Look at the "I know breast feeding is the best but I really hate it thread" That was me ans believ e me my knockers looked like a horror film....

It sounds to me like you are just exhausted - poor you, I felt sick with my first - i used to put all my food on a side plate dso it didnt look too much - I think I had a case of the baby blues.

Please keep posting. Take a day at a time - isaid I would feed - my third - for "just a week " and here i am at 16!!

Dear Wobbly

I have recently had a jaundiced, sleepy baby too. Much of your tale could also be mine, he was never able to suck much but as everyone here says, he wasn't very good with the bottle either.

The answer for me was to mix feed as my supply was low too and now I am increasing my supply and cutting down on the mixing. It has taken a long time and you have to stop analysing and feeling guilty. Also, I don't remember when but the pain has long gone now and he's only a few weeks old. Whatever you decide, just keep your cool. Jaundiced babies take a long time to feed and I was fretting constantly... he now kicks and squirms around so much that it is causing other types of hassle with feeding.. chin up.

i second the John Radcliffe if you are anywhere near. They are brilliant, very patient and can sort out anything. Do phone them before going on 01865 221695. do call them even if you aren't near as thry may be able to help onj the phone and they have a long list of help at their fingertips. Also the Breastfeeding Network have lots of bf supporters and their number 0870 900 8787 will put you straight through to someone near you.

it will get better. you are in a bit of a cycle, the jaundice makes DD sleepy and needs flushing through by feeding. feeding will increase your supply but DD is sleepy. things will improve soon hang in there. I know mears suggests an over the counter drug that has an effect on increasing supply. Sorry can't remember name but it is on other threads.

Good luck

Hi wobblymum - I would like to echo what has been said before. Definately contact a B/F counsellor - your problems with feeding can be rectified but you need support to do it. I also agree that midwives and health visitors are not always the best people to do it. B/F counsellors are people who are dedicated to helping women overcome B/F difficulties and have also B/F themselves.
If you are feeding/expressing 3 hourly and do not think that you have enough milk then you might want to try Domperidone (motilium) that you can but over the counter. It is used for bloatedness (so may well help the sickness sensation you have) but a side effect is to boost milk production. You take 10mg 3 times a day for 10days.
If you want to top her up then I would suggest you do it during the day rather than at night. You will produce more milk if you feed during the night as it increases your prolactin levels. Sometimes babies feed better at night when it is quieter. Frequent feeds increase your milk supply more than actaul eating. Your body has laid down fat for the purpose of using it up making milk. Eat small snacks and have drinks nearby when feeding. You do not need to eat huge amounts at a time.
Can someone take the baby out for at least a couple of hours so that you can get some sleep? - tiredness can make you feel sick too. Having a break away from the baby will give you a chance to catch up on sleep or relax in some way. Your baby may well come back more eager to feed. Sorry this message is a bit garbled - just wanted to let you know there are different ways to manage the situation.
Please contact your local counsellor - you just need some help and support to gain confidence.

Thanks to everyone for all the support and advice - it helps just talking to people who have been through it and still managed. I'm trying to do combination feeding but she doesn't seem to like doing breast or bottle!! I've just tried to give her a bottle because she still seemed hungry after the breast and she only took an ounce and that was a struggle!!

I went to a breast feeding workshop last Thursday and the counsellor there was really helpful but it's still different when you go home.

The main problem is she doesn't seem interested in feeding but always seems fretful because she's hungry! I can't win!

Thanks to everyone's comments I feel a bit better now and I'm going to keep going as best as I can until Thursday when I go to the breastfeeding workshop again. She'll get weighed there and then if she's put on weight I'll carry on, if not I think I'll have to go more on to bottles.

I think most of what's stressing me is the fact that I always felt I wanted to breastfeed so now I feel depressed that I might have to stop. And naively I always thought that breastfeeding would be easy, that she'd just latch on straight away and that would be it.

I really, really admire everyone who's managed to breastfeed their babies and has been brave enough to stick with it through the problems, AND everyone who's tried, had problems and has been brave enough to switch to bottles because it's best for them.

Thanks for all the help and if I manage to get back on here soon, I'll keep posting.

wobblymum,

if your breastfeeding workshop is anything like the breastfeeding support group I went to, it is run by a midwife/ HV. You talk of a "counsellor", but you don't seem to have been given much support, one to one. Have you tried the NCT line, or the other numbers given below?

Another thought- your dd may not be fretful because she's still hungry after a feed- I think if she was she'd wolf down the formula. Maybe she just has colic or wants a cuddle? My dd spent the first three months of her life almost permanently attached to me, either breastfeeding, in a sling or snoozing on my chest. If I put her down, she screamed! She then "woke up" to the world and started to take an interest, and it was much easier to settle her. I'm not saying that this will last for long, just that there may be another reason why she's fretful.

wobblymum - I agree with Tissy. Workshops are great but you need one -to -one support from a counsellor. You are not bothering anyone - they would be delighted to get your call. I know people from the Breastfeeding Network and they are great support. Phone their number and they will give you the number of a person close to you
0870 900 8787. Wish I could pop round in cases like yours
You can breastfeed but you need some help to get on the right track. Call the number and let us know how you get on - not that I am pushy or anything

Tissy - she seems hungry because she roots at everything and keeps sucking on her hand but when I latch her on she sucks for a minute, then loses interest. Then if I put her down she roots again and cries.

Mears - I wish you could pop round too! I will ring the Breastfeeding Network but it feels like whatever support and advice I'm given - I just can't keep it up when I'm on my own and knackered. I feel like I can't even follow basic instructions!

wobblymum - babies love to suck - it's what they do and they find it so comforting. Your dd may not always be hungry just because she's rooting for it - she'll smell your milk and think " aaaah mummy - time for a snuggle".

My ds used me like chewing gum half the time and still does when he's really tired. For his bedtime milk, I still have to feed him stripped down to his nappy sometimes just to keep him awake enough - one suck and he's gone - he's 10 months!!!!!!!

It will get better - you've just had a really rocky start - just think of all the support you'll be able to give other mums when you come out the other side of this.

Hopefully a counsellor will be able to come round and help you. In the meantime, strip her clothes off and take her to bed with you (keep her nappy on) with you taking you clothes off as well. Periods of lying next to your skin can stimlate her interest. Don't worry if she doesn't feed- the point is for her to enjoy lying near the breast without being 'forced' to feed. After a while she may start rooting and fix herself. If she doesn't, the two of you should have a sleep together. The other thing to perhaps try today is to leave her longer than 3 hours. See how long she will actually sleep for. Waken her after 6 hours if she doesn't .
spontaneously wake. She may well be much more hungry and feed better. You must sleep when she sleeps. It will do neither her or you harm to have a stretch of no feeding for a few hours. When she wakens, definately try feeding her naked. You can put a blanket over her as long as it does not prevent the skin to skin contact. Does she have wet and dirty nappies? She may not gain weight by Thursday if she starts to improve over the next few days. If she has wet nappies and appears alert then she is getting enough milk.

I know it sounds like your baby isn't getting anything, but the opposite is true. If you keep the baby at your breast all the time she will wake up, have a sip, nod off, wake up again, have a sip, repeat, repeat, repeat. She will get nutrition into her that way, albeit slowly. Even if it means you don't get to do anything else. But taking care of a baby is a 28-hour a day job, so it's ok to sit on the sofa and just cuddle your baby most of the time.

Please ring the Breastfeeding Support Network. The gals there WANT you to call, they WANT to help. It makes them feel good. One time I rang up and the lady I spoke to sounded like she was on her deathbed with a bad cold. By the end of the conversation she was happy, giggling and so pleased that I rang.

wobbly - she might just be a very 'sucky' baby. If she's only taking an ounce, and that after a struggle it sounds like she isn't really hungry. Would you consider a dummy? It might take the edge off and let her settle - and you get some rest!

Wobblymum, you have had loads of good advice already and I apologise if someone has already said this but if your DD is falling asleep at the breast have you tried tickling her feet, behind her neck etc, I used to have to do this with both my DS1 and 2 to keep them going. Also found taking them off when they were asleep, winding them and trying the other side was often enough to get them going again.

All the best, it will get better.

wm I think you are great. Just wanted to tell you.

GOod luck WM! As said earlier, you do have loads of good advice on breastfeeding below. Please remember though that whatever happens (whether you start to mix with formula or move completely to bottle feeding), don't feel guilty! Breastfeeding is harder than most people ever anticipate, and if you can do it, then great. If not, then that's okay too. It doesn't mean you're a bad mum for stopping (or mixing). Good luck again!!

news wm?