Flying high enjoying their wings, Remembering our precious much loved children...

[CazandBelle]

For my beautiful Anabelle Violet. Born an angel.

Mummy and Daddy miss and love you so much. Always. xxx

The wine is going down very well thanks PPM had a nice chilled day lunch with mum ds has been most places today all without me. Ex annoyed me a little bit but im not getting hung up on that

Morning girls xx

morning ladies xx

morning all.

ppm spot on response in my opinion! lol

shelley glad you had a good birthday!

shab - hugs for you. The twins birthday must be so hugely painful for you. What a constant reminder celebrating Danny without Gareth. I admire how you have survived all these years, I really do. I just cannot imagine how its ever going to be easier.

We are not doing christmas cards this year, I couldn't face not writing Belle's name. But we've had a little think and realise that we cannot avoid them for the rest of our lives - for cards, birthday, christmas and the like we are going to buy an angel stamp from Hobbycraft (when I find one pretty enough) and a pink ink pad, and we'll stamp an angel under our names. I will feel I have included her then.

Doesn't look like we're going to get many this year anyway. Only had 2 - usually have far more by now. I don't want any, the 2 with a wonderful christmas written inside has wound me up (close family friend and Jons grandparents) but at the same time I'm feeling a bit put out that no-one can be bothered at all. Obviously don't know waht to say so their best policy is to send nothing. How hard is it for people to write something along the lines of thinking of you at Belle's 1st christmas?

I could so go back to sleep, but need to get ready for counselling soon. Today we're going to go through the angry letter she asked me to write. I chose to write it to the man I now consider my ex-FIL. Part of me wishes I could actually send it, but I know that wouldn't be productive. Plus I think our absense and silence is much more powerful there.

Caz I'm with you on the Christmas cards. It's baffling isn't it? I've had about 4 now which just say "Hope you have a wonderful Christmas" or words to that effect, and it just makes me spit and boil. Something like "thinking of you this Christmas" would be easy to write and so much easier to read. My grandad wrote something much more considered, and I wonder if it was the experience of losing his beloved wife 3 years ago in the run up to Christmas that made him realise how important it is to think, and to acknowledge that Christmastime can be far from wonderful?

My grandma wrote "We hope you get your heart's desire in 2011". I was touched that she had thought to write something that acknowledged our year and understood what she meant about wishing we are able to have a healthy baby soon, but I did just cry when I read it. All I could think was I can't have/will never have my heart's desire because what I want above all else is my little Bobbie safe and well and with us. I find it hard when it's brought home to me that other people consider that we failed in our attempt to have a baby and are trying again in order to get one. It's not that simple. We have lost a unique and loved daughter who no other baby can replace. We are having another child yes, but she is always missing.

The loss of a baby in this way seems particularly lonely as no one else ever met her and it seems like no one else is grieving. Our parents and grandparents never mention her (my mum asks how I'm feeling, but no one ever mentions our daughter or says her name), they have never asked where she is buried/if we would take them there or anything. I want to scream that she is their (great) granddaughter! Sometimes it feels like she only mattered to us.

It has been very hard Caz - even now I have those 'I cant do this anymore' moments. I really promise you that it will change and the edges of your grief will soften.

I love the idea of the angel stamp - thats wonderful. I have very close friends in the USA. They have four grown up children and about 20 grandchildren About 35 years ago they had Siamese twin boys. They were joined from the chest to the top of their legs. They only lived a couple of hours Even now when they send me a Christmas card, the greeting always ends with 'Jason and Jared.' They have been to hell and back over the years. Financially bankrupt a few times, a lot of ill health etc etc.....whenever I think 'its not fair' my dear friends words echo in my head....

'No its not fair but its all we've got.'

You are also right to not send your angry letter. Your 'revenge' will be to hold your head up high and 'get on' with making your lives as happy and healthy as possible. That would also be an amazing tribute to your darling little girl xxxxxx

Argh I am trying to write my Christmas cards (only 5 of them!) and I already want to scream and throw the whole fucking lot in the bin. I want to write "Hope you can have a nice Christmas, ours will be bloody awful, thanks" but that somehow seems wrong and rude.

Bollocks. What can I write??

I am actually really enraged.

When Richard died we said that we would continue to do all the things we had before, we thought that would keep us sane. Unfortunately that is not the case with Christmas cards. I 'bit the bullet' wrote and sent them just put best wishes from us. But all the ones sent to us say happy christmas etc I just want to throw the whole f**ng lot in the bin aswell. But in a couple of weeks all this pressure will be over. xx

Sending love to you and yours shabs xx

split huge hugs. Don't write anything at all. you don't have to send even these 5 cards. dont do it yourself lovely.

if people cannot understand why you cannot send greeting this year then sod them. x x x

Ooooohhhhh christmas cards - for those of you who were around here last year you will remember my torment everytime the postie came from mid nov til end dec... I was filled with dread and used to leave the cards in piles in the kitchen for days before i opened them - I too was dumbfounded how folks who i considered lifelong friends could write me a card and pretend that gregor didn't exist... especially since the last time they had seen me was at his funeral. I also remember receiving a couple of cards from more distant friends who didn't know he had died and my dh had to call them and tell them our sad news....

So what has changed in a year in my world.... This year I am sending no cards at all, i have donated to charity instead. Anyone who has issue with this clearly doesn't know me too well or probably won't be considered friends in the future ;I have sat down with DS1 (who's 6) and helped him write his cards out for his wee friends as i think its important he still does this.. if he wants to send some to family then that's cool too. Cards dropping through the letterbox this year are not bothering me in the slightest. To many people sending cards is an automated tradition and most people wouldn't give a second thought to christmas being difficult for bereaved parents... sad but true but for those of you enduring their first christmas without their children i want to give you hope that next year some of the stuff that's really upsetting you this year won't be as bad next year - if you're anything like me then you'll probably have dumped a few 'friends' by this time next year

Caz - I hope the counselling today went ok? I agree with shabs - holding your head high and living your life the way your wee angel would be proud is the best legacy to her, if folk are not helping then you can choose to be with the folk that are helping x

sending love to you all xxxx

Hi, just popping in to say hello. Have a terrible cold and have been off work, high temperture, sore throat etc. Another one not sending cards and we're not putting the tree up either. This time last year I had just found out I was pregnant with Malachy, this CHristmas isn't what I imagined. If I think about it for too long I want to scream and cry.

Shelley glad you had a nice birthday x

Ilike A little boy, I'm so happy for you x

Dh's best friend's father died on Monday, he had dementia although he was relatively young (mid sixties I think). I just want this year to be over

Morning girls xx

Morning all. Ive been a bit up and down in the run up to Jacks birthday. I know he's been around me this week. The other day i went into the kitchen to make tea. I put the radio on and it was playing. Later on when i put a music channel on on the tv it was playing! I am going to try my hardest to keep it all together!!

Well done Lottie - the music thing is very significant isin't it? He is, quite simply, letting you know 'Hiya Mummy, Im always around. I am just a whisper away.'

Take care sweetheart xx

Well done, Lottie - I have had just a complete meltdown. We received a card from an old friend of DH's, she had written how she felt really bad that we'd had a baby nad hadn't got in touch and had sent it to DH, me and 'a pink little bundle whose name I'm ashamed to say I don't know!' She had seen photos of me pregnant on DH's facebook but had not heard anymore . Its upset me so much, she didn't know and I'm not upset with her but just that we'll never have cards with Malchy's name on and that its just so bloody unfair.

On a more positive note and have received a letter from the recurrent miscarriage clinic to have blood tests.

Hope everyone is ok x

Oh mini that must've been so hard. This month is just getting worse and worse all around really isn't it.

Personally I'm finding it more difficult by the day. I feel really run down and have just got in from a long day at work. It was a nice day, we took my class to winter wonderland and on the ice, but I'm home now and feeling teary again.

mini you poor love, what a horrible shock that must have been to read. And your poor friend when she realises too.

Thanks ppm your "next" Christmas perspective is actually quite comforting.

Well I had weird job news today. Our department restructure plan has been announced and I am one of 4 who have to apply for 2 jobs, so 50:50 I will be redundant. Applications in by end Jan, would be leaving by June/July if I am unsuccessful. Actually being made redundant then could be perfect if this pregnancy sticks, but there's many many bridges to cross before them. And in the meantime it's just really stressful.

mini it is so distressing when something like that happens.

Hope everyone finds some peace soon xx

Ladies, can I just intrude for a moment to give you a heads up? Because i subscribe to glamour magazine I get it a bit early every month and the January issue's just arrived. Although it doesn't say so on the front cover, there's an article on the magazine by a lady whose daughter was stillborn. It's a very well written article, but you'd have no indication if you picked it off the shelves for a bit of escapism and I didn't want you not to know first, if you get me.

So sorry for intruding on your thread and if this was unwanted / interfearing I can only apologise.

Pottering x

Thanks pottering you're very kind and thoughtful to drop in to say that x

Thanks Ladies, DH read it when he got in and I could see his eyes filling up

Spilt - more added stress then, just what you need!

Thanks Pottering, is very kind of you to think of us all and our feelings.

split I'm so sorry to hear about your job. The last thing you need is more stress. Thinking of you.

Still no sign of AF here which I think is a huge part of the not coping at the moment. I hate that my body is not working properly again, letting us down again.

Split - I am a massive, firm believer in 'what will be will be.' Weird stuff happens...then a few months down the line you think to yourself...if that hadn't happened 'this' would never have happened.

I wish you all some peace and comfort tonight and in the run up to Christmas. Its a very difficult time of the year. xxxx

Ladies, Im struggling......... Its so bloody unfair, I should have my Jack with me next week, He and Wilf should be there blowing out candles together!! I want both my boys.............