In memory of my beloved Fraser and all our children.Little buds sown on earth to bloom in heaven

[frasersmummy]

A new haven for us all to say exactly what is in our heart or on our minds knowing that everyone understands and wont judge

Zeno It's good to know you lurk, but exceptionally nice to hear from you. Often wonder how are you are getting on.

I think we are actually both doing early days stuff - when my bf died, it took me a good year to get over the worst, but longer than that to reallign my life, for the fear to subside and to become 'me' again. I think it became less difficult as time passsed, so after 2 years I was mostly healed - but it was only just a year or so before Catherine died (over 5 years from his death) that I had just started to feel "as good as it was going to get" better.

As far as I can think it through, I think the risk are huge, but that, despite the heart-wrenching pain - it is probably worth taking the risk. Losing a child who was a person in their own right, but more than that, who was the person who filled your life is just beyond horrible -but the pain, logically, has to be equal to the love they brought. I think PPM said it most eloquently - my child existed, and s/he was worth the pain I feel now.

We do seem both to have been thrust into thinking about babies very quickly - you because you were about to have one, me because I'm so bloody old - but even without those pressures, it does seem lots of mums consider ttc soon after their children die - the desire to create new life is, I suppose, strong.

PPM Thinking about you today - how are you?

Caz How did your appointment go?

Evening ladies...

Our results do not tell us anything. I'm not sure how I feel about it - feeling very low tonight.

No reason was found for Belle's death from blood or placenta. There was some slight infection markers - but likely that these could of developed after her death and consultant didn't seem to think it the cause of. There was no chromosome abnomalities identified.

The only useful result really was me not being immune to Rubella dispite me having the MMR as a child. So I have to had the jab again now and not get pregnant for a month afterwards - as that jab will be very soon, there will be no fear of that. Me not being immune wasn't the cause either - just need to get dosed up to make sure I'm protected next time.

They now want to test my blood for clotting. So I'm having a blood test in another 4 weeks and then these will be repeated another 12 weeks after that in December. (these blood have to be done 12 and 24 weeks after birth). Depending on the results of these blood tests will determine if I need asprin next pregnancy.

Regarding next pregnancy the action plan will be to be seen every four weeks by the consultant from the moment I get a positive test. I will need blood tests, swabs, scans etc every four weeks as a minimum, more often if they deem necessary as we go along, as well as all the regular midwife appoinments you would normally have. So I suppose that level of monitoring should be reassuring.

I feel really low tonight, my perfect angel was taken from me, and no reason can be found. I know we didn't have a full PM - and I still don't regret that decision. The consultant said a reason still may not have been found if we had agreed to a full PM. I don't know if I'd have felt any better with a reason anyway, it won't change anything.

I just want her back.

Having no reason just makes me feel guilty I guess... did I miss something that I should've noticed? I should've kept her safe

Ohhh Caz I just want to hold you x From my experience we lived for five months expecting to never have a reason for gregor's death then very unexpectedly we got a reason - did it change anything for me? nope, cos it didn't bring my boy back, he was still gone, we still had to live with the loss.

I'm also feeling pretty low tonight. Went into talk to ds1's teacher at school pick up as he was anxious and sobbing this morning before going into school... once he was inside he was fine all day. Just can't be bothered talking to friends which isn't like me. got visitors coming (dh's aunt uncle and nan who has dementia) tomorrow and seriously can't be bothered - can't say no as none of the rest of his family have even been in touch with us much since gregor's funeral and i guess it'll be a distraction if nothing else.

oh Caz - I think a huge number of stillbirths can't be explained. It was not your fault, and you did nothing wrong. Today was always going to be stressful, and it is no wonder you feel low tonight. But it does sound like the news is reassuring - at least there is nothing that indicates a definite problem for a future pregnancy and the monitoring sounds reassuring too.

PPM Be gentle with yourself - any mum would be upset dropping a distressed child - and we are dealing with so much bloody more. Can DH deal with the visitors if necessary? At least DS was ok all day, and his teacher is being supportive.

oh caz there is just nothing I can say that will help... so here's a hhhhuuuuugg

Fraser suffered from inuterine growth retardation (IUGR) Bascially means he wasnt growing properly

They didnt pick it up from size of bump etc because he was doing what they call asymmetrical development. Means he was growing in length, developing his organs but not putting on weight.

At the 34 week scan the sonographer didnt get a measure round frasers tummy so they didnt pick up on it and he wasnt strong enough to make it

The sonographer claimed she did get the meausrement but she had a trainee with her and I clearly heard her say the baby was in the wrong position to get this measurement

If she had got it, I would have been induced early but she didnt and I wasnt and as a result Fraser is not here ... see what happens when someone doesnt do their job properly

My consultant said there were other indicators during my pregnancy.. each one nothing on its own, but put together it was obv something was wrong from the start

bitter ?? moi???

hey triplets.. you and your hubby are in our thoughts and prayers

Oh ladies (cwtches) everyone.

One thing i've learnt as i've walked along this path, is that sometimes it's not about the answers... it's about learning to live with the questions.

Evening ladies

Oh Caz, I'm sorry you've come away from your meeting feeling so low. You didn't do anything wrong, but I understand your feelings of guilt. I sometimes feel like I should of done more, perhaps should have probed my gp and midwife about my excess fluid, but I know deep down I couldn't have prevented Malachy's death. It's reassuring to know you'll be watched by the consultant closely, I felt comforted when I was told that as she has been brilliant. Keep strong, you're doing brilliantly x

Went into college today for the A level results, saw a few students who were obviously worried about whether they should say something or not. I held it together but was on the brink of tears when I spoke to one girl. She told me that she had cried when she found out, we'd talked a lot about the pregnancy as her older sister was pregnant at the same time. I'm going to go in for gcse results next week which will be more difficult as more students and a much busier day but will be another stepping stone before I return the following week. Which I'm dreading and I'm starting to wonder whether I'm doing the right thing.

Morning girls xx

(That's my impression of Shabs - hope she is having a lovely holiday - it's raining in Edinburgh today)

How is everyone doing today?

Kale Mera Girls - have escaped the heat and come into the bar Sending my love and hugs to all of you. I had awful nightmares last night - all involving road accidents....I suppose you can travel 2,500 miles away from home and be in the sunshine with good company, good food and plenty to drink but 'it' never goes away does it? Feel much brighter today but had a good nights sleep. Take care everybody xxxxxx

Morning...

Sassy lovely impression of Shabs!

Not sure how I'm doing yet today - not long got up. Was woken by a phonecall from the hospital telling me I could now ring my GPs and organise my Rubella jab as they had been made aware of the results.

Thought maybe it would be a good idea today to try and see the positives from our results yesterday - there was nothing to say that it will happen again and they will be watching me much more closely and baby next time. #Sigh# - Whatever they do next time, it still doesn't change that we lost our firstborn though does it... :(

I think I will be needing a few days to pull myself together by the looks, but I will.

Minione - I think you are being very brave by going into school on results days. Seeing as many faces as possible now can only make it easier for your return. You are being really strong and I hope returning to work goes smoothly for you. I'm going to aim for after half term. I need to give my 6 week notice when school restarts now in September, and then I'll try and keep popping in and plan to do two half days just before half term to get me ready for my return.

Today I'm going to pop and see my Grandma for an hour. Its her 81st birthday. Its also my parents 28th Wedding Anniversary today.

Well thats the first time I've ever been offered an appointment so swiftly! Just rang GPs, Rubella jab is now at 11.45 today.

Dee "learning to live with the questions" That is so apt. When we get an answer on something we just move on to another one and there's an unending procession of questions in the queue.

Sassy I was reflecting yesterday that we're now as far along from losing dd as we were from losing my sister at the time when dd died (am sure there ought to be a better way to explain that!) Anyway, I recognise this feeling of returning life and I like it. Let's hope we get a bit further along before the next major blow this time...

Caz we were monitored like a fury with dd2, even though there was no concern for her whatsoever. I found it very reassuring and was grateful to the medical people for being so generous with their care and attention. Like ppm we were eventually given a reason for dd's death, but it did not reduce the guilt that comes over us at times. It doesn't seem to matter how many times we're told there was nothing that could have prevented her death.

Hello lovely mums.........if I win the lottery tonight I am going to buy Shabs a villa in Faliraki, then I can go out with her and we can do our Shirley Valentine dream.........:o Hope you are all looking after yourselves, so good you all have this thread, there was nothing like this for me and Shabs in the early years, its so comforting. Love to you all xx

Hiya ladies x am pleased to report both me and ds1 have had a better day today... he went into school no problem this morning (thank goodness!) and i went for a long walk in the pouring rain - even forgot i had sandals on so needless to say i got very wet but i walked and cried and walked and cried and felt a lot better afterwards!! Am hoping that the last couple of days have just been a dip. You're right trips we are very lucky we have this thread, good luck with that lottery ticket!!

Caz - how have you been doing today? x

Morning girls xx

Hello all xx

Sorry I have not been around , I went to visit my dad for a week . It was lovely and the weather shone in Lancashire and the Lakes which is a miracle .

I hope everyone is doing ok , I will try and have a catch up now xxx

Hello girls. Took grandchildren home today. They had a great time and it was lovely to have them with us. I feel very weepy now. I kept looking at the younger one (Richard's biological son he is 9) and not so much seeing Richard but he is so like him in his ways, if you know what I mean, and thinking he will never see his dad again. I still can't really get my head round it. It has been 4 months but sometimes I am at square one. I feel selfish that I can't seem to be grateful for what I have. I miss Richard so much. The children seem fine I wish I could see it like they do.

I have been thinking of you all and I will light a candle tonight for all your precious children xx

Morning girls xx

Ahh.. I see Shabs is here impersonating herself today!

Hope you are having a good holiday Shabs
TW and Lavandes - glad you've had some good down time too...

Hope everyone is as well as they can be!

Good morning ladies.
Wishing everyone a peaceful day xx (except shabs who can have a wild day)

Have come in for a moan...

Was waiting at the bus stop as I had a mound of flowers and a wreath I'd made (as exhibited on FB last Friday )

A nice little old lady arrived, and commented on the lovely flowers. When I said I'd made it, she expressed surprise, because it was so professional

I told her it was for a grave, and how practical they were, and how I made them often and it saved me many pennies...

So this is a clue, isn't it: I AM IN MOURNING

That's nice, she said... People put such silly things on graves ......

You know that this is going to go badly, don't you?

And I went - like what?

And she said TOYS..

So I asked her, "How many of your children have died"

No balloons for guessing a big fat zero..

So I said...

WELL I GUESS YOU'RE NOT VERY WELL PLACED FOR COMMENTING ON WHAT OTHER PARENTS LEAVE ON THEIR CHILDREN'S GRAVE THEN, ARE YOU?

I have to say, I'm not a toy-leaver - but if it gives other people comfort, who the hell am I to judge? They can leave steak and kidney pie dinners and jigsaw puzzles for all I care..

The thing that really gets me is - it's a bloody graveyard - I can understand random people not liking Mobile Phone Masts on pretty hills or what not... but it's a graveyard to comfort the bereaved. How dare she have an opinion about grieving parents when she isn't one herself?

It made me quite cross - but I feel better now.

Morning ladies sorry i haven't been around lately been away visting the in laws, got ery brrody holding my baby neice. So strange saying that SIL told her older ones they were to call me auntie which i found out after if she asked me to have her 8mo so she could have a break passed her to me saying go to auntie shell. AWWW i havent been called that in so long.
We had the crash investigators come round yesterday to answer a few questions we had following reading the statements. It was a bit of a waste to be honest as they couldnt tell us anything. Very annoying though because if they'd checked db's flat like they said they were doing they would know that no alcohol was consumed there like was claimed. It made me very down for the rest of today and still am today. Can feel my depression getting worse again when i'd managed to improve it. Must be getting worse as i got more prizes for the charity event raffle and it didn't lift me up as it usually does. Only 2 months left till the night so hoping people turn up on the day.
Would anyone mind if i posted the FB group for it on here?

Will catch up with developments in a little while hope your all ok

Hi all...

How is everyone doing? Its been quiet in here the last few days.

I've continued to feel low and have been very teary for most of the weekend. I think its been a mix of the results which took a lot of building up to the wedding yesterday which also took a lot of building up to. I'm exhausted now and have spent all afternoon asleep.

Wedding went much better than the last one I attended, and although I had sad moments, I held it together much better for the most part once the day got going. I was awful before I got the ceremony though and it took me a while to settle down afterwards. Occasions seem to bring out the worst in me at the moment, I know not everything is about me, but yesterday morning I was getting myself in a state about having to put on a face and hold it together all day. Its all so exhausting.

DH also had many teary moments yesterday, watching our friends 14 month old play. Being reminded of everything we're going to be missing with Belle.

We were both very upset with it being the 21st again too yesterday anyway, nevermind everything else that was going on.

It'll be 9 weeks at 00:08 since she was born. How can it be 9 weeks already?

Sassy - good for you for putting the woman in her place.