In memory of my beloved Fraser and all our children.Little buds sown on earth to bloom in heaven

[frasersmummy]

A new haven for us all to say exactly what is in our heart or on our minds knowing that everyone understands and wont judge

Just wondering how you're doing now PPM?

Actually, I think you do have a legal entitlement to punch anyone whose being particularly annoying... but think of your blood pressure... and all that bad karma xx

Home again and can't wait to get to my bed... just want today to end. Am very tired and crabbit! I didn't even get into the playground at pickup time, I hung back and waited til the bell rang, Ds1 spotted me and ran straight out. Feeling slightly less anxious than earlier and have managed to hold things together for ds1. dh picked a shit day to work late grrrr!

shabs - good to hear you're safe and sound, enjoy the hols and make the most of that lovely greek sunshine and ouzo - yamas!

Ugh - I feel sick with nerves about tomorrow, even though I know feeling like this isn't going to change anything, I can't seem to pull myself together tonight.

I know and am grateful for having time on my side, but what if something is terribly wrong with me?? I know there is no point playing the what if game. But its all so huge - what they say tomorrow will have such a huge impact on our future plans...

I agree Sassy - the irony. I've looked at those who would be higher risk of stillbirth, and unsurprisingly I don't fit into any of those caterogies being only 25. I've never smoked, I'm not overweight, I wasn't drinking, or anything else I shouldn't have been, I'm not over 35, I'm not this, that or the other, - I don't fit - so why did this happen to us?? It just doesn't make any sense... :(

I hope you find some peace with the idea of TTC again or not.

Getting more and more, I suppose angry is the only word, with the idea of Saturday. It's 2 months since Belle was born - they would have to be getting married on the 21st wouldn't they. I'm going to find it very tough, the date, the other children in the family and all the family photos without my baby. :( How am I going to fit in a visit to her garden on her 2 month day with a wedding all day? Is the 21st of the month always, always going to be hard?? or just in this year of firsts?

PPM - your posts today have made me wish I could just come and hold you. x x x I have no words but send lots of love and wish you much strength...

Caz - it's hard isn't it, now I've gone past malachy's due date I think about how he is missing from everything we do. I know it was only yesterday but as I was so big in the pregnancy I always thought he'd show a week or 2 before.

I guess you have to think positively about having time on your side. My consultant told me I would be under her care next time if I wished rather than gp and midwife ( yes please) she said that I was young . When I pulled a face ( I'm 31) age said that the average age of her patients is 39 so that made me feel a bit more optimistic! I guess if you're in a low risk category you don't expect to have a stillbirth but I think we demonstrate it doesn't work like that.

I hope Saturday gies well, it willbe tough I'm sure but I hope you have a jive day.

Caz - it's hard isn't it, now I've gone past malachy's due date I think about how he is missing from everything we do. I know it was only yesterday but as I was so big in the pregnancy I always thought he'd show a week or 2 before.

I guess you have to think positively about having time on your side. When My consultant told me I would be under her care next time if I wished rather than gp and midwife ( yes please) she said that I was young . When I pulled a face ( I'm 31) she said that the average age of her patients is 39 so that made me feel a bit more optimistic! I guess if you're in a low risk category you don't expect to have a stillbirth but I think we demonstrate it doesn't work like that.

I hope Saturday gies well, it will be tough at times I'm sure but I hope you have a nice day.

Ppm - sending you love, you've had a tough day x

Caz - Your Belle was born the day before Griffin, just, he was born at 2am on the 22nd. I'm really getting distressed at my post pregnancy body too. I put on a bunch of grief weight as well. The doctor today told me I could do swimming, pilates and yoga but to avoid high impact things such as aerobics classes.

Try not to get yourself all worked up about not getting to Belle's garden if you can't make it on Saturday. You won't be neglecting her or her memory. You could always take some time out from the celebrations with DH to allow yourself to remember her without people trying to cheer you up or other misplaced niceness.

It must be tough to have such a happy family occasion at this time but you will get through it.

PPM - I hope the days get easier for you.

Sassy - I think you are being perfectly rational. Pessimistic but rational. You have to consider how you would feel about these things (I mean the constant fear of bad things happening rather than the actual bad things) in order to make the right decision for you.

We've had the TTC chat and are both eager to have another child soon but equally terrified. I have a feeling that my fear will get greater if I wait for too long so it's a tough one.

ppm.. I think you are right about facebook. Your friends wouldnt come to visit and bring pictures of gregor's friends all set for nursery so they will understand that you dont want to see them online

good luck for tomorrow cazem...

There were blood clots on my placenta.. though this wasnt our cause but just to be sure I was prescribed junior aspirin for the duration of my second pregnancy so this is definetly a possibility

Minione it must be really scary not to have any reason for what happened to Malachy At least we got a reason Fraser died.. well we dont know why he stopped growing but at least we knew if it happened again they could prevent death

ppm hope you get some sleep before you have to do it all again tomorrow [sigh] its draining I know

waves to everyone else inc shabster who is probs greek dancing

Morning... Still got the wobbles and a touch of anxiety but I know it WILL pass... Can't b like this all day!! Xx

Hahaha I'm not losing the plot.... Much!! I tried to post the post above this am from my iPod and it didn't work.... Technology heh!! Off to bed am exhausted thank u all for being here xx

ppm are you ok??

have you been asleep and think its morning

please dont set off for school its still Wed night!!!

Looks like we are all having a mad wobbly day today...

Lets hope tomorrow is better.

Caz I'll be thinking of you. I know it will be difficult, but hopefully there will only be reassuring news.

FM - it's upsetting more than scary, he was growing normally and moving normally in all the scans. Everything was generally as it should be but there were these ' soft markers ' ( which is why they suspected downs). However no syndrome was identified from the amnio so still no definite answers. The consultant seemed to think it was reassuring as it is less likely to happen again but with little knowledge of my dad's side and the revelation of his son dying from cot death it is scary as I'm worried there could be something genetic.

If you don't mind me asking what caused Fraser's death? There is still no reason as to why I had so much fluid - I was huge.

Lunatic Y'see, this is why we need an "A, B and ttC" thread. I think you said once, you feel like the Bad Fairy at the party, and I have obviously come as the Wicked Witch of the West

Even silly old me thinks it is very unlikely that you will die. But I understand exactly how desperately you need to survive for DD1, and that you nearly did die before, so it is not an unreasonable fear. Being pg with Catherine was such a joy - everyone was so down on us, because we were planning a homebirth - but I was always completely positive, and never had any doubts that I wouldn't have a perfect healthy baby... I miss that pg person - I wish I could have her and her baby again

You are doing so well Lunatic - I know Daisy's remember day is approaching fast, but you are doing ok. You will get through this xx

Just thought Id pop in to see how you all are as Shabs isnt here, I am no replacement for her, she is an amazing woman and a very special friend to me, we both lost our Matthews. I read your posts and feel the rswness of your pain, I was the same 16yrs ago, time does smooth the rough edges, but its always there, the longing, the missing, but life does go on and I know many of you won`t feel that is possible, I didnt for a very long time. I wish you all find some peace in your hearts, never stop saying their names and know that they were yours and so can never be truly gone. xx

Hello triplets How's your DH doing?

Hi SS, thank you for asking, he has had chemo today, postponed last week as his white cell count was too low. The big scary ct scan is next Mon, already my stomach is in knots, then he has one more chemo to go on the 8th Sept. If the scan is good he will have liver surgery, lung surgery before Christmas. It just seems to on on for ever, he is so brave.xx

sassy sorry you are in such turmoil about whether to try for a baby. Although we had Richard for 34 years then lost him, and went through the worrying teenage years with both our sons (and believe me there were some very hairy moments, mostly with our elder son), I wouldn't have missed any of it. It can be a complete nightmare but we got through it. I would do it all again in spite of what has happened now. Hope this makes sense.

triplets Good luck for Monday. This is such an awful time for you, hope you have some support. Our closest friend is having treatment for myeloma at the moment and I know how hard it is for him and his family.He is doing OK at the moment xx

Morning ladies xx

Thanks Lavandes that makes a lot of sense - how are you doing now the grandchildren are away?

triplets This must be so difficult for your family. I think your DCs must be old enough to be taking it all in. I hope that Monday will bring good news - the wait must be agonising - much love to you xx

Morning

sassy grandchildren are still here we are taking them to longleat tomorrow then staying in a hotel(they are very excited) taking them home on Saturday. It has been lovely, bittersweet at times but children seem to deal with things so differently, they do not seem ready to talk in depth yet we are not pushing them just wait until they are ready. Take care xx

Glad things seem a bit more manageable today PPM

Lavandes enjoy the rest of your week xx

Time is going so slowly today - the last hour in particular has dragged. We leave in 10 minutes for our appointment... panic panic panic. DH aint great either - he was supposed to be working the morning today, but his boss sent him home after an hour.

Hello everyone. I've been lurking and not posting lately - not able to frame the words anyhow.

As always, there's so much in this thread that resonates for me. Sometimes it's just too sore to reply, but I read and think of you all and share in your lows and highs and inbetweens.

MIL lost her firstborn son at a few days old. When dd died it raised up a lot of things for her and FIL, and in the end I think that it's been good for them to talk about him more, forty years on from his birth. The way things were handled back then was brutal and it breaks my heart that they were kept away from him and have nothing physical by which to remember him. Talking about that helped us appreciate more the efforts of the hospital to look after us with care and empathy.

My mum of course lost a daughter too, when my sister died. She and I don't talk about our feelings much though as there's far too much rawness around it all. I think we're working towards it though, and we're definitely getting along better at the moment. Helping her deal with the treatments for her cancer is bringing us closer and I have discovered in myself some compassion that I never knew was there.

Sassy so much of what you are feeling about going forward to have another pregnancy echoes my own feelings. The fears, the risk analysis. I'm eternally grateful that I wasn't faced with having to choose whether to have another or not, since dd2 was well on her way at that point. The time before she was born was a sort of accelerated trip through the worry and fear zone. I veered wildly between terror that she would die and hating her for being on her way at all.

I notice that dh and I never talk about what she will do as she grows up - a tacit agreement not to tempt fate by assuming she'll make it that far! We're all so aware of the precariousness of life. BUT, we are joyful with her, and as time goes along that gets less complex. It does feel that we have been sent back to Go to try again, but things are as they are and we're not fighting against it so much now. It's OK to go on ahead and love and cherish dd2 and have hopes and dreams for her. There's no doubt at all that she is instumental in bringing us back to feeling joy and living rich lives.