to feel really sad about what this young mum said?

[CathyBurns]

I don't know this girl well, just know her through someone else - but she's young (late teens) and pg with first baby

she said to her friend "Ugh, no, I won't be breastfeeding, XXX (partner) hates it, he says it's gross and like an animal"

who are these people who think like this? Where has it come from?

That is a sad thing to say. BF'ing isn't animal like it is the best thing you can do for a baby. Kreecher must report that she failed miserably and does feel a bit of a failure.
I'd hate to be in a situation where my dh/dp didn't support whatever decision I made.

I know someone who has said the same thing, but she's older. It is a shame if that's the view people have...

Too many young men see a women's breasts as theirs to play with, and not for feeding babies.

There was a very interesting programme on a few months ago where a row of breasts were shown to teenage boys and without fail they all "preferred" the fake ones.

They thought the "slightly saggy because they had breast fed two children" breasts were and I quote "disgusting".

I feel for this young girl, it is very sad.

at reality's SIL.

sorry, I didn't mention her name because I'm ageist - it just seemed more worrying to me that someone so young would have such a negative view of bf. I'm not sure why.

Sadly, it's not rare.

Many people, male and female hold these views. It comes from the sexualisation of womens bodies in priority over its nurturing capabilities. It comes from he 'male gaze'. It was exacerbated by the invention of formula feeds and further still by a lack of education. It's pants.

It is animalistic, breastmilk is species specific, we are animals, there's nowt wrong with that.

AArrgh, age not name

Sadly, it's not rare.

Many people, male and female hold these views. It comes from the sexualisation of womens bodies in priority over its nurturing capabilities. It comes from he 'male gaze'. It was exacerbated by the invention of formula feeds and further still by a lack of education. It's pants.

It is animalistic, breastmilk is species specific, we are animals, there's nowt wrong with that.

oops, my netbook obviously feels strongly about this too

My step mother (aged 32) said exactly the same thing when she had my half sister in the 1970s. She never for one second considered breastfeeding her children.

Yes I agree it is like an animal - for me that's one of the things I liked, that it was so instinctive and natural.

But I have encountered this "ugh"/"gross" view as well. It is interesting where it comes from as obviously it's not very good for us as a species that this view has come about.

Sex is very "animal" too but the same people don't have a problem with that. I think there should be a lot more done to explore and counter all this stuff. Not just "breast is best" but looking at where this comes from. I mean I'm sure someone somewhere is studying it, but we don't hear about it generally.

(Just one of the many vitally important sexual politics issues newspapers like the Guardian's family section could be covering instead of "blah blah I found a pic of my old dad in the attic" )

It is sad to hear attitudes like that. A number of girls I went to school with had children in their late teens or early twenties and none of them bf. Of course, they could've tried and failed, but I remember some of them talking about buying bottles whilst still pg so I think it was more to do with the fact that my hometown, which is generally quite deprived, is not the sort of place where mums sit in trendy cafes bfing. Especially not young fashionable mums. TBH, I wouldn't feel comfortable bfing in town if I went back there. This is a place where I got laughed at by a gang of teens for reading a book on the bus .

I would feel much more comfortable bfing in London where I now live. I think some areas have more of a bfing culture than others.

marineiguanna, i am guessing the guardian family demographic isn't really the target for this sort of campaign.

this is why i get pissed off when there are threads on here complaining about breastfeeding campaigns. the message does need to get out there.

Yep, unfortunately it is all too common.

I konw a lot of women my Mum's age who feel this way (including my MIL) and that attitude has become more and more prevelant with the ridiculous fetishisation of breasts.

I have to say that as a very young woman I may have siad the same, sadly, because I grew up with that attitude.

I think things are changing very, very slowly, but it will take a good few generations of women being helped to bf, rather than just told to, for it to become the norm that it should be.

I struggled and failed to bf ds and much of that was due to being hidden away as memebers of the family didn't want to see it, as well as the complete lack of help.

marineiguanna - I agree with nickytwotimes in that Guardian readers probably don't need to be preached to wrt bf. It's women who read tabloids and are confronted with images of page 3 girls and celebrities with perfectly round fake breasts who are probably likely to be put off bf.

Some teen mums (myself included) I know bf, but most don't. Am old acquaintance keeps telling me on facebook I should stop (her DD is 6 months), its really winding me up.

If people for whatever reason are not able to breastfeed, then fine, be their reason physical, medical, physiological, psychological, whatever, but I really do think its a shame if people don't try to do it, and with opinions like this floating around - and being, as other posters have stated, sadly common - it is not going to encourage people to give it a shot.

Would be tempted to ask her if liked sex doggy style at all, and if so she should ban it.

duh! . . . "if he liked"

I don't think it should just be in the guardian, and I didn't mean at all that the guardian should have preachy articles telling people to bf - what I would like to see is intelligent scientific articles that explore these attitudes and look at how they came about.

(I also think there should also be a lot more sensible, open and factual discussion of things like DV, housework and childcare division, workplace prejudice etc etc. Although papers will do "human interest" stories about one person's experience, they are reluctant to get the facts about the big picture out and apply feminist arguments to them.)

I had Ds1 at 18 and BF him for 5 months, I also BF Dd1,dd2 and Ds2. I didn't intent to BF Ds1, but the MW I had with me after my CS was very supportive of BF and she encouraged me to try. Am so glad I did it. But I do remember having to go to the spare room when at PILs to BF Ds1, with the others I grew some balls and fed them wherever.

Its sad when people just see them as a sex object rather than what they are intented for.

yes someone said to me while she was pg "oh i will not breastfeed, i am not a cow"

in the full knowledge that i was bfing ds who was a few weeks old! but i think she is protesting too much iykwim, no point in me compounding her ishooos. she has also talked about her breasts being for her husband. and how formula milk is just the same as human milk with the implication that a bfer is martyring themselves on purpose.

maybe she's just young and she might change her views on BF when she finds out a bit more about it

I read the Guardian, don't feel that my boobs are exclusively for my DH's pleasure, bf DD for 5 mths but it was still the period of my adult life where I felt least womanly. Bizarre given that it is probably one of the most womanly things you can be doing, but I did feel I'd been reduced to little more than a milk dispenser. My postnatal class had a sizeable number of women who had had various problems with bf (only 1 had been determined to ff from the outset) and were not feeling great about themselves and their negative feelings were only reinforced by the hv's view that they weren't trying hard enough.

I think the breast is best brigade often shoots itself in the foot by promoting the view that it is easy, painfree, you can always produce sufficient milk and that it is a wonderful experience when women through no fault of their own can struggle with some or all of it and then end up feeling that they've failed. If women got a more realistic picture of bf we'd have fewer women feeling bad about themselves and more likely to give it another try with subsequent DCs.