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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To Wonder what this woman is thinking??

225 replies

TheLadyEvenstar · 22/07/2009 08:32

right before i go any further please read this bit first.
I do NOT have a problem with mix race relationships but i do think this WOMAN takes it to the limit.

she has

dd1 white english
ds1 white irish
dd2 white irish
dd3 white irish
dd4 half turkish
dd5 half indian
ds2 half indian
dd6 white english
ds3 half somalian

is now pg again has 5 grand children all of which are living in her home. she has never worked and always seems to find non working husbands/partners. They have 2 houses knocked into one, and its all paid for by council!

sorry just having a moan

OP posts:
TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 01:46

hmmm i am well aware of what racist means, my son has been victim of racism for the last 3 years or more

OP posts:
PrincessToadstool · 23/07/2009 08:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

flaminhell · 23/07/2009 08:20

I have read the posts tbh lost track of who said what due to the quick responces, but I dont believe the op to be racist, I have met racists and this isnt it.

But I think the point of why mention race, is purely a fact of being the area we speak on, this is a web forum, people like to be graphic in their explanations, and I would hazard a guess, that on first hearing the story had she not mentioned race, the majority of you would have imagined a line of white children!

Just a thought!

JodieO · 23/07/2009 09:06

You should start a thread complaining about the racists that abuse her and her children, rather than blaming her for daring to have children with more than 1 father. You said before it wouldn't be so bad if it was 3 children with 2 fathers why would that make it "better"?

stuffitlllama · 23/07/2009 09:16

What a crazy way to live. Races of children don't matter a bit, but what a crazy way to live.

However, we do need more children in the West to support us when we are all old gimmers. So we might all be grateful one day.

Best not to let it bother you. If you've said what you think (and she's still talking to you!) then there's no point canvassing opinion. Unless you really are worried you might be wrong about it.

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 09:24

Jodie, because the children would not have seen a string of men in and out of their home or their mothers lives, thats all really.

I think as many have said it is time to let this die away now. I do think that this woman needs to think what impression she is giving her children but that is my opinion and I am on about the amount of men she has had in and out of her life.

OP posts:
NotPlayingAnyMore · 23/07/2009 09:26

"hmmm i am well aware of what racist means, my son has been victim of racism for the last 3 years or more"

Just because it's a different example doesn't mean it's not racist.

If you could truly empathize with what racism is, then after this woman has had to contend with this:

"She has had graffiti sprayed outside her home, has names called at her as she walks along the street, if anything it is sad. Especially as there are always children with her."

  • you would not be sticking the knife in with this -

"i do think this WOMAN takes it to the limit"
"I do feel very sorry for the children involved there are 5 different cultures in one household"
"I do not think it is fair on the children involved to have an indian, turkish, somalian sibling and the children are the ones who suffer at school."
"I am NOT talking about multi racial relationships in general this is not ONE or TWO relationships it is many"
"the race of the father who tried to snatch his dd was the reason he was taking her to his home country"
"I personally think she is opening her children to racism"

  • oh, not unless you were a MASSIVE hypocrite, of course.

It's quite difficult to backtrack when what you've written remains. Someone would probably even hand you a a shovel to dig your way out of the hole you've dug yourself if a) you deserved it or b) they you'd know what to do with it, but you clearly wouldn't.

Mumcentreplus · 23/07/2009 09:26

She's not a card carrying racist more of a I know exactly how many black / people of colour I know kind of racist..[winks]..but I agreeit a sad life

NotPlayingAnyMore · 23/07/2009 09:28

"I think as many have said it is time to let this die away now."

I don't see anyone else saying that. Ashamed, are you? You should be.

Morloth · 23/07/2009 10:13

TheLadyEvenstar "Look it is no different to opening your child to a road accident if you let them play near the road, or an ice skating accident if they are ice skating.....sadly these things happen. But we do our best as parents to avoid them."

Being born mixed race is not the same thing as being in an accident. It isn't a bad thing in any way shape or form.

You can't just turn AIBU threads off when they don't go the way you want, I would have thought you would have realised that.

I think you really do need to have a think about how you feel about different races. You might not be the yelling on the street corner type of racist but you certainly have views that mean that you judge people differently because of their race. Which I am afraid means that you are a racist. You might not mean to be, but you are.

I have a great friend who is South African, she is a racist and tries very hard not to be. She has been taught her entire life that the races should be kept separate so she has a fight going on in her own head constantly to get past that ingrained attitude. But she had to become aware of it before she could acknowledge that it was there.

It is a shit idea to have a bunch of kids you can't provide for, it is a shit idea to have a constant parade of different men through your house and in front of your children, but the colour of those men is not the shit part.

ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight · 23/07/2009 10:13

FFS

children can't be british if they wear muslim headscarves - really?
this man wanted to snatch his daughter because of his race - no, it was because of his culture/family background. Being black/asian/whatever does not make you a twat - upbringing can though.
women shouldn't have children with different men in case the children get bullied. This is worse if the children look visibly different as racists might bully them - no, children should be armed against racists with confidence and self belief. Children should not be punished for the choices of their parents' and they certainly should not be punished because other people are small minded.

You do not believe you are racist. You probably aren't really- but what you find upsetting is mostly the fact that she has hundreds of children without thought to the future or consequences, she seems to be picking crap men and her poor children are suffering as a consequence. That is all fair enough. However, their ethnic background is irrelevant. You should never have mentioned it, as by making it an issue you make yourself look racist. I can't make it any simpler than that - if you take anything from this thread try to imagine why you have been perceived in this way, and think about how your comments have come across to people.

Rindercella · 23/07/2009 10:30

TLE, I cannot believe that you have managed to dig yourself an even bigger hole. But you have.

"Look it is no different to opening your child to a road accident if you let them play near the road, or an ice skating accident if they are ice skating.....sadly these things happen. But we do our best as parents to avoid them."

Many years ago I was a member of a youth organisation called PHAB (physically handicapped & able bodied). It was great - we all used to meet once a week and go for day trips etc. I vividly remember one person outside of this group describing one of the children as being unfortunate enough to have "a double disability" - because as well as having a physical condition, he was also black. How fucking sad that he should be viewed like that. What is even sadded is that 30 odd years later these attitudes still continue.

A child's race is not a fucking accident. if you cannot understand that this sentiment is both extremely offensive and racist, then there is probably not much hope in any of us on here educating you.

Acinonyx · 23/07/2009 10:39

Crikey

What is the tipping point then, when a mixed race household has too many ethnicities in it?

This women appears to have a rather casual attitude to procreation - but at least she's not racist.....

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:43

You know it is sad when you cannot express your feelings on a woman/mans behaviour without being branded a racist.

I have not said I know exactly how man black people I know but living in Peckham SE London I am pretty sure it is a lot. I have nothing to be ashamed of, you see it as racist i don't. I fail to see how mentioning the races of the children is racist....if i were to come on here and say I have 3 cousins who are half indian (which i do) 1 who is half russian (i do) 3 half chec (again I do) would this be racist????

If i had come on here and said "I f*cking hate black, indian, albanian, muslim, chinese, irish, scottish, polish, turkish people" (or any race for that matter) And this woman has had more men than hot dinners her kids are all foreign etc ten yes i could be classed as racist.
As it stands, I was factual about this womans relationships with men, she is not bothered who the man is as long as she has one iyswim? and as a result she has a multi racial family. It is awful to hear the things the local families say to and about her, I am not one of these people. If i have a concern I do tell her, and we have had many chats over the years where she has told me what has gone on and I have given her advice, offered help etc. The last time i saw her previous to this time, she was staying single and focusing on giving her children a better life, she had said she had realised that her life choices were and would affect her children and yet when i saw her the other day she had slipped back into her old ways of life, of putting a man before her childrens needs, wants, safety etc, like it or not this is how it is..hardly racist just knowing this woman personally and having tried to help many times it becomes annoying to see nothing changes.

I should not have mentioned the races of the children or their fathers, but then I would not have been giving all the facts and we all know that if you don't then you are branded a troll or a liar so i tried to be open and upfront. - the result I am branded a racist, when in actual fact all I have done over the years until moving away is try to help this woman, I have helped with the children took her daughter in when she feared for her safety being in her own home due to the threats of abduction from the childs father, who had said it was his culture for the first born daughter to be raised by his mother, whether this is true or not I do not know.

I wish she could find someone who really cared for her,her children and her well being. She looked dreadfully tired and worn out. She was moaning about the grandchildren and how she couldn't understand why her dd's had had babies so young and why only one of them (the eldest with 2 children) actually wanted to work.....I just said to her " sadly kids learn by example and anything we as adults do in our life maps their way of life for them. She agreed and said maybe i should have had less time at home and worked.

Now regardless of how i worded it the situation is the same this woman moves from man to man having children, not being able to financially support them, and then moaning when her daughters follow in her footsteps. If i had not have mentioned the races of the children opinions would have been different, as i have seen on here before.

OP posts:
Morloth · 23/07/2009 10:48

TheLadyEvenstar "If i had not have mentioned the races of the children opinions would have been different, as i have seen on here before."

This is correct, because her actions are a bit stupid and not great for her kids.

But you did mention race when it wasn't relevant.

You do understand that racism isn't always about hating people of different colours, don't you? You don't have to hate someone to think of them differently.

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:48

FGS I never said having a child of mix race was an accident, I said THAT SHE WAS OPENING HER CHILDREN TO RACISM FROM THE SMALL MINDED PEOPLE OF THE WORLD. WHICH IS NO DIFFERENT TO OPENING YOUR CHILD TO AN ACCIDENT BY LETTING THEM PLAY ON THE ROAD.

OP posts:
filchthemildmanneredjanitor · 23/07/2009 10:50

i am just that you think it's ok to say to this woman that her kids are feckless because they have learnt from her example.

how did she not slap you?

you are being incredibly judgemental and i think you need to sort out your wn back garden before you start worrying about the state of other people's lawns

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:51

and for the record I am educated thanks. However I live in the real world, seeing and hearing the comments made to children of ALL races and cultures. white, black, asian, i have heard the children crying seen the affects. but this does not make me uneducated or racist.

OP posts:
Rindercella · 23/07/2009 10:54

"I said THAT SHE WAS OPENING HER CHILDREN TO RACISM FROM THE SMALL MINDED PEOPLE OF THE WORLD. WHICH IS NO DIFFERENT TO OPENING YOUR CHILD TO AN ACCIDENT BY LETTING THEM PLAY ON THE ROAD."

If you think that is true, and you obviously do, then you most definitely do need educating.

Morloth · 23/07/2009 10:54

But ALL of the fault lies with the people making those comments, all of it. None of it belongs on a mother who has children of mixed race or the children themselves.

It is like putting the blame on a woman who is raped because she was wearing a short skirt. NONE of the blame lies with her, it is ALL with the rapist.

To use your analogy about the accident, it would be the same as letting your children play in your garden and for a drunken driver to come crashing through your fence.

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:55

Morloth, she is different from me and from many i know. Most people aspire to do better for their children than they had for example. she has never appeared to care about this.

Filch,

I said i believe children learn from example and what we as adults do map their lives. i did not say her kids were feckless and it was her fault, they were not the words i used. I just gave her my opinion.
And yes I have issues within my family i have never denied that, and i am trying to sort them out, but that has nothing to do with this thread.

OP posts:
Morloth · 23/07/2009 10:57

But the children being mixed race is not something that would affect aspirations either way.

TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:58

ok so opening your child to an accident is different how?

they are both things that could affect their future lives, both can or could have a lasting effect, and not always but sometimes both could be avoided.

Sadly we do not live in a perfect world if only we did......

but then i would not want to, perfection is over rated.

This is a free country, we should be able to state facts without being branded racist for doing so. Yes i do think she takes the whole relationship/having dc thing a bit too far as she cannot financially provide for the ones she has yet wants more.

OP posts:
TheLadyEvenstar · 23/07/2009 10:58

Morloth, no it doesn't HER lack of encouragment does on the other hand.

OP posts:
filchthemildmanneredjanitor · 23/07/2009 11:00

i know you didn't use the word feckless but that is exactly what you were implying and that is exactly how she would have heard it.