AIBU to tell my best friend that I can’t financially level things up between our kids?

[stingyorfair]

Sorry for the length, but I don’t want to drip-feed. Names changed but I’ve added names for clarity.

I’m an only child from a wealthy family. I met my best friend Laura at university, and she later introduced me to her brother Sam. Sam and I eventually got together and married. I’m European, they’re British, if that’s relevant.

Laura has an 8yo DD. Her DD’s dad isn’t involved, but Laura has a lucrative job and family childcare support, so they’re not struggling financially.

Sam and I have 3 DC, aged 10, 8 and 6. The cousins are extremely close and have grown up together. Laura and I are still best friends, spend lots of time together and holiday together a lot: sometimes just Laura, me and the kids, sometimes with Sam too. Sam jokes that he’s a third wheel, and theres an element of truth to it!

I have significantly more money than Laura or Sam. Sam earns more than Laura, and Sam and I keep our finances separate. I’m not getting into the reasons for that (mainly asset protection from my side in case of divorce) - it works for us.

On holidays, I often pay for luxuries for my children that wouldn’t necessarily be affordable or reasonable on Sam’s salary alone: private swimming lessons every day, watersports, tennis coaching, boat trips, horse riding etc.

On holiday if I was doing something with my children, I’d often pay for my niece too. She’s my niece, I love her, and I didn’t want her to be the “poor cousin” watching everyone else have fun. I’ve also paid for Laura, me and the kids to go to Disney or bought expensive kids’ event tickets without expecting anything back. My thinking was largely that my kids have more fun with their cousin, I enjoy Laura’s company, and everyone has a great time, so why not?

But this has now spread beyond holidays. My eldest is 10 and I’m paying for tutoring for the 11+ because she wants to try for two particular schools. I’m also considering buying her a horse because she’s serious about riding, as is my niece.

Laura has now started making comments about her DD missing out and, from what I can tell, thinks I should be doing equivalent things for her DD so the cousins don’t have such a disparity.

The latest issue is private school. Because I’m considering private school for my eldest, there seems to be an expectation that I should at least contribute towards something equivalent for my niece.

This is where I’m struggling. I’m happy to treat my niece sometimes, but I don’t think I’m responsible for replicating every financial advantage I give my own children for another child. If I pay for my daughter’s tutoring, that doesn’t mean I should pay for my niece’s. If I send my daughter to private school, I don’t think I should fund or part-fund my niece’s education too, even if I can afford it.

AIBU to have a proper conversation with Laura and draw that line before this becomes an expectation? I really don’t want this to damage what is otherwise an incredibly close friendship. It’s hard to pretend that I don’t get the hints because Laura knows me enough to know that I will get them.

I also don’t really want to go through Sam. Laura and I have a relationship in our own right, so I’d much rather speak to her directly. But I do wonder whether part of the expectation comes from the fact that we’re family through Sam - so is this actually something Sam should be involved in, rather than it being between Laura and me?

You need to speak to Sam about this I’d say.

Laura is pushing the boundaries here.

With this update. NO you definitely DO NOT help. Sorry to say it but she would be using you.

I also think your lives are completely enmeshed, in a bad way, and I couldn’t live like that. I’d be happy seeing my friend/sister in law with my kids/her kid and doing special things like days out but not even holidays.

So no there is no pony and there is no private school that is up to her parent/s not anyone else.

what does she ever pay for for you or her nieces and nephews? It’s not about who has the most money you should both pay for little treats.

As I said, ignore, don’t engage. Play dumb, nod and smile.
Your children are unlikely to be equal until well into adulthood, barring any unexpected turn of events (good or bad).

How long and to what extent are you prepared to try and level things out for her?
I would be hugely put off this so-called friendship - where gleeful acceptance of your generosity has now switched to expectation and resentment if you don’t cough up.

This sounds to me like you are being taken for a ride.

Jeez. If SIL wants a tutor or a posher school for her one daughter, then I suggest she gets a better job. After all, she’s already said she only needs a bit more for it to be possible, so it’s likely within reach. And it’s up to her to provide those fundamentals for her own child. I gather horses are money pits, so that’s probably something she leaves for DD to aspire to as an adult and it will help fuel her ambition to do well in life and work towards her goals. Having a massive ticket item like a horse or an entire fucking education handed to you as a consequence of hints dropped to a wealthy aunt, however… terrible lesson for kids!

its a nice thing you’ve done, treating your niece on holidays or whatever, but that absolutely doesn’t leave you on the hook for these huge commitments. Just practice your look of cloudy confusion- think of Rachel in Friends- shading into scepticism that your friend is even saying this out loud.

I agree with this.
I think Laura has already cross a line.
The only way the relationship can not be damaged at this stage is if Laura shuts up with her financial expectations-but then equally you know she will be simply internalising her jealousy.
I don’t know how you can save it if I’m honest. If you can afford to pay and you end up doing so where does it end? And you will rightly feel resentful and used because Laura wants to take money off your kids to give to her child.
If you don’t pay you will feel scrutinised for everything you buy your own children -and possibly yourself - and who knows how long Laura will be able to hold in her jealousy ?
I think you are between a rock and a hard place and I do not envy you one little bit.
I haven’t got a magic answer - but I would say do not give in to her ‘hints’.
We have no way of knowing of what will happen in Europe over the next 20-30 years and your kids might need every penny of YOUR FAMILY money.
I would still pay for treats but that’s it - and if there were snide comments they would stop too. Remember, your children come before Laura and her child.

I think Laura is being a CF. You've previously paid for her holidays and days out and now she expects you to keep paying out. You need to be quite blunt with her and say you've been happy to treat her and her DD to holidays etc as it's been beneficial to you and your kids but you will not be funding her DDs private education or buying her a horse.

Thing is when doing both of those things, buying a horse and private schooling it's not a one off payment and you're done as like in a holiday.

Having a horse has many on going costs, not a particularly cheap hobby, can you afford to continue with those on going costs for two children?

Same with private schooling, can you afford to put your niece through years of private schooling?

I always say being in a position of having good financial security can change at any time.

Finances are a different sort of topic. If the more subtle approach doesn’t work then it’s perfectly OK for Sam to pull his sister to one side and tell her not to abuse your generosity as unreasonable expectations risk spoiling what have been a joyful and uncomplicated arrangement.

I can’t remember if you mentioned the ages of all 4 kids, but in time they will become increasingly absorbed in their own social lives and interests. You will likely be busy taking your 3 to different things and the cousin friendship may become more holidays and half terms.

@stingyorfair

Personally I think it depends how rich you are. I'm not the slightest bit materialistic but if I had more than enough money to contribute to the cousin's private schooling without it affecting your own children (e.g. university fees, house deposit etc...) then I'd just pay that. Its only money and if you had that much where it wouldn't make much difference I'd just pay.

Not the horse though. That's a huge time commitment.

You have to draw the line somewhere.

It really depends how wealthy you are. If it’s at the level I suspect, then you should pay for your DN’s education, in my view.

She’s a CF

yes, it would be lovely if niece could do the same things but not a huge cost to yourself

Laura is becoming entitled and blurring the boundaries of family and friendship which is unacceptable.

You say she has a lucrative job so she needs to strive towards an even more lucrative job if she wants her DD to have a horse and go to a private school etc. It is bang out of order to drop hints that you could/should pay for these privileges - it is on her as a parent to provide these (or a grandparent if they feel so inclined to- not an aunt by marriage).

I would ignore/play dumb/deflect conversation if she drops anymore hints, and if she outright asks say no, you can’t afford to - blame a downturn in investments, access to family funds, whatever. Your responsibility lies in looking after your own DC and you never know what the future might hold financially.

My DH’s DSis and her DH are very wealthy (as in multi-millionaire) and our DN’s live a life of immense privilege and opportunity, which we could never dream of replicating for our DC. However, we would never think that they should pay for private school for our DC, or expensive hobbies like having a horse. To do so makes you a CF!

I agree that it does depend a bit on your level of wealth. If you have multiple millions then you could consider setting up a trust for your neice which Laura can choose how to spend - on tutoring, horses, schools etc and then you can stop buying treats. It then takes it out of your hands and you don’t have to keep making decisions.

My note of caution about this is whether Laura may end up having more kids in which case the expectations will grow.

If you don’t want to do this and you decide to talk to her, I would start by asking her what she is hoping for or expecting. It would be tricky if you opened with “I can tell you are hoping for x but I don’t feel comfortable paying for it” if she then says “I’m not at all”. I think your assumptions about what she wants (even if accurate) could end up being the bit that damages the friendship. It would be better to start with “I don’t know if you meant anything by x comment or not but I thought it was worth having a conversation to understand what your thoughts are. Do you have further hopes/expectations about how I might help out with DN financially”? Let her talk and hear her and then you can respond. But it will be hard not to end up with some residual tension I think. But maybe this can’t be helped. Neither of you has deliberately created the situation but it is where you are now so may be hard to avoid. Not talking may also cause resentment. You know your friend best as to whether direct or indirect would be best here. But take the time to listen - that would be my advice.

Hmm tbh do you think that conversation would go down well with Laura?

I do wonder if she would get super offended and pretend that she wasn't hinting at all.

Depending on your level of wealth - could you comfortably afford school fee's for neice without any impact on your finances? Then I would consider offering to sponsor through school but make it very very clear this is the only financial help. Even get a legal document drawn up.

On side note. How does keeping finances separate prevent your husband from claiming half in a divorce?

It just seems a bit unsharing and not a partnership. Joint money access, what's mine is yours etc. Just my opinion though.

If she truly thinks that you should fund a luxury lifestyle for her DD then she is being a CF.

Cut your cloth according to your income and that means a cat instead of a horse, and a state/grammar school instead of private school. She might have a lucrative job but she needs to do even better if she wants these optional luxuries for her DD.

It sounds like you have been generous to date with paying for very nice holidays and activities, but private school and a horse? Absolutely not.

Laura is dropping heavy hints because she knows what she expects is outrageous so she is unlikely to be upfront and if you do have a conversation about the hints she will make out she was only joking. Next time she hints I would tell her how lucky she is having only one child to pay out for as your three children stretches your finances to breaking point.

It never ceases to amaze me how easily gratitude becomes expectation and then entitlement. Laura seems to have reached the expectation stage, so I think a gentle conversation would be appropriate before a sense of entitlement is reached. It will be awkward for you both.

I disagree. I think the expectation and entitlement shown by the SIL, having benefited from OP’s generosity and love is very telling. SIL doesn’t seem to respect OP and perhaps sees her now as a cash cow for fancy holidays and extravagance. Maybe open your eyes @stingyorfair ?

SIL and family are not destitute in anyway - they want a horse and private school. Just no.
I am sure if they ever genuinely needed anything OP would be the first to help.

This is important - if OP dies tomorrow all her assets would likely go into trust for her children (ie not the husband) so the funds would stop and sister would have to remove her child from school. (Assumption based on finances being kept separate and assets likely not in the UK, so I am gathering that the set-up is that the wealth stays within the bio fam and in Europe).

This is a really interesting idea, and may well have been in your thoughts anyway, as you sound a generous family focused person. I decided a few years ago to give to charities whilst alive and then leave my estate to DC in its entirety. This might not be the most tax efficient but simplicity was preferable. So a ring fenced living legacy to DN might be the solution.

"It’s hard to pretend that I don’t get the hints because Laura knows me enough to know that I will get them." If that's the case she also knows you well enough to know that you are deliberately not getting the hints. If she wants something she can ask, you can say no, the friendship can survive both those things if it is a true friendship.

It’s really kind & generous for the activities on holidays/days out etc because like you say it gives the children company & you.

but its not for you to pay for your best friends standard of living

re the horse, could the niece be allowed to ride it in return for doing some mucking out/grooming chores? I think that would be fair and the extent of how far you would go as it’a likely in a yard you would get people offering that in exchange for being able to ride

Sharing that you are thinking of buying a horse is unnecessary. Wait until you actually have the horse.

Oh my dd got a horse for her b’day etc..

Oh dd got into xyz school.

You don’t have to share every waking thought about what your DD is getting or doing. It will help Laura to do what she wants for her own child, not what she thinks her dd must get too, to keep up - as she simply can’t afford it.