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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Did you know about this other attempted beheading?

242 replies

Whiski · Today 09:56

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr7pg7nk53go

First I ever heard of it was yesterday.

People act like it’s only non white people that do this.

A police mugshot of Alina Burns, wearing a black hooded jacket and a grey T-shirt. She has blue eyes and her blonde hair is closely shaven. She is standing against a light grey background, looking ahead with a blank expression.

Father of jailed neo-Nazi teenager says 'everyone failed her'

Alina Burns, 19, was jailed in May for attempting to behead a barber.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cr7pg7nk53go

OP posts:
ThreadGuardDog · Today 18:35

likelysuspect · Today 18:31

Yes as I say she probably was too ill for school. That doesnt mean if she commits a crime she should be hospitalised rather than imprisoned!!! Why would it?

And although this is theoretical, I cannot tell you how many families say they are failed by services but dont engage in what is required or the young person/child doesnt engage with sessions or medication and so services close to them as there isnt anything they can do.

That is most definitely not my experience in over twenty years of disability support.

Persephonia1966 · Today 18:36

ThreadGuardDog · Today 18:34

Tbph I don't give two shits how autistic or anorexic she is. She tried to murder a random person on the street. Prison is the right place for her..

Do you not understand that this is part of the problem ? People with MH conditions, and that includes those with Autism because there is very often an associated MH problem or learning disability, disproportionately end up in the justice system because these conditions go unsupported until they end up committing a crime and go to prison instead of accessing the help they need.

There are also people with severe mental health conditions who are in prison because the state of MH services is so inadequate that there is simply nowhere else for them to go. Better and more accessible MH services would mean earlier intervention and proper support, and many of these people would get the help they need instead of ending up behind bars.

Agree 100% with this!

EasternStandard · Today 18:37

likelysuspect · Today 18:31

Yes as I say she probably was too ill for school. That doesnt mean if she commits a crime she should be hospitalised rather than imprisoned!!! Why would it?

And although this is theoretical, I cannot tell you how many families say they are failed by services but dont engage in what is required or the young person/child doesnt engage with sessions or medication and so services close to them as there isnt anything they can do.

You may be right. I don’t a strong view on prison v hospital.

I was just reading the Belfast victim is in a coma, this article doesn’t say much about physical outcome for victim.

Persephonia1966 · Today 18:38

(except for prison). I think so long as someone is mentally culpable then autism etc can't be used to escape prison for very violent crimes. That will lead to a backlash down the line. They still deserve help though.

likelysuspect · Today 18:38

ThreadGuardDog · Today 18:21

Based on professional experience l don’t think Autism is used as an ‘excuse’. But my judgement may be coloured by the fact that most of the families l supported were dealing with adult children with Autism and severe associated mental health problems, which is not uncommon. Some families had to have safe rooms to barricade themselves in when they became violent - many had grown significantly bigger and stronger than their parents and inflicted significant injury.

While l don’t know anything about this girl, l believe her father was dealing with her and said they were both let down by services, and l can well believe this to be the case given the appalling provision of MH services in the UK.

I thought I read her dad said she was no trouble - wtte - and this behaviour came out of the blue, so this isnt a young person the family struggled with in terms of their own safety. I suspect her ASD caused her to be very quickly transfixed, obsessed and hyperfocused and she was driven to take this unusual behaviour to cause harm.

Given she started to make the odd comment about Reform, she had right wing beliefs to start with, but either read or heard about things that pushed those to the extreme right and to cause her to want to harm people.

likelysuspect · Today 18:42

EasternStandard · Today 18:37

You may be right. I don’t a strong view on prison v hospital.

I was just reading the Belfast victim is in a coma, this article doesn’t say much about physical outcome for victim.

I think in this case he wasnt overtly harmed or injured, I cant remember where I read it but he took the axe from her I think.

Very frightening though and if she had managed to swing it in the wrong way (or right way) he would be toast

And the man in the Belfast attack has already lost his eye. I dont think its a given that he will survive.

ChoosingMyOwnRandomUsername · Today 18:45

ThreadGuardDog · Today 18:34

Tbph I don't give two shits how autistic or anorexic she is. She tried to murder a random person on the street. Prison is the right place for her..

Do you not understand that this is part of the problem ? People with MH conditions, and that includes those with Autism because there is very often an associated MH problem or learning disability, disproportionately end up in the justice system because these conditions go unsupported until they end up committing a crime and go to prison instead of accessing the help they need.

There are also people with severe mental health conditions who are in prison because the state of MH services is so inadequate that there is simply nowhere else for them to go. Better and more accessible MH services would mean earlier intervention and proper support, and many of these people would get the help they need instead of ending up behind bars.

Boohoo. I'm sick to the tits of hearing about criminals' poor mental health and fucking autism.

I seriously don't care. Whatever the original cause of your MH issues and despite how you struggled for x years with undiagnosed whatever...try and kill someone and a line is crossed. Prison is the best place and society is safer for it.

BIossomtoes · Today 18:45

likelysuspect · Today 18:42

I think in this case he wasnt overtly harmed or injured, I cant remember where I read it but he took the axe from her I think.

Very frightening though and if she had managed to swing it in the wrong way (or right way) he would be toast

And the man in the Belfast attack has already lost his eye. I dont think its a given that he will survive.

He was injured.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crmpejxlm7do?app-referrer=webview

Alina Burns is a young woman with a shaved head. The image is a police mugshot.

Neo-Nazi teenager jailed for attempting to murder man with an axe

A 19-year-old approached the victim from behind and swung an axe at his neck.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crmpejxlm7do?app-referrer=webview

honeycombine · Today 18:46

Several things can be true at once:

  • Despicable far right thugs and agitators spoiling for a fight and driven by racism start fighting and setting fire to things. Far right political parties like to exploit and encourage division and racism and spread misinformation and hate. True and awful.
  • Asylum seekers especially men who are here without families are men, so more of a threat than women, quite possibly traumatised, and without the family support networks that mean a UK citizen having a psychotic break, say, has slightly more chance of being stopped before behaving violently. Easy to see how statistically this could genuinely make asylum seekers more of a risk to other people even while the majority are harmless and ordinary like most of us.
  • People are naturally more frightened when relative strangers to their community commit violent acts than when people who have been in the community a long time do. It's about being afraid of what you can't predict or control, it's a fear that can come not just from what you think about a person but also from what you fear they may think about you. A feeling of safety comes partly from feeling that you're living among people who see you as part of their community, not just the other way round, and that feeling can be very threatened by events like this when the perpetrator may be different in multiple ways of which race is only one. Even if ultimately the cause is a mental health breakdown, the fear produced is still going to be greater for people who are relative strangers.

Basically not everything depends on people being wound up by far right thugs, not all feelings of fear and anger about events like this depend on racism, and so the solutions can't just be about calling out racism.

TequillaSunset · Today 18:47

LuckyHazelFox · Today 18:21

Hallelujah for common sense.

Do you think this justifies the violence towards non- white people?

likelysuspect · Today 18:54

I didnt see what his injuries were. I also didnt see that she was also carrying darts and a scapel. And that she had been in touch with various far right groups and told some bloke to kill jews and Muslims.

Spent the day watching SS marches prior to the attack.

God knows why people are banging on about anorexia!!!

Chocolatefreak · Today 18:58

Ponoka7 · Today 17:59

Yet we are not allowed to declare that Islam has caused any of the multiple attacks. There's hundreds stopped, one fairly recent, by a Father coming out from visiting his Wife and Newborn seeing a man suspiciously hanging around the maternity wing. We aren't allowed to say that a common theme is women and children being targeted. Part of the issue is the blame always follows one path, but apparently there's lots of factors at play, when it's from a man from certain communities.

When attacks are by Islamist extremists, they are labelled as such. e.g. the Manchester Stadium bombing, the Manchester synagogue attacks.

When they are attacks by disturbed, but not radicalised individuals, they are not labelled 'terrorist' attacks, e.g. the tragic Southport attack by Axel Rudakubana.

Do you see the difference?

Violent crime is analysed for its motivation, which is why when the father of this girl noted she was coming out with violent Reform ideology we now know that she was being radicalised into committing a hate crime.

Clavinova · Today 19:27

Chocolatefreak · Today 18:58

When attacks are by Islamist extremists, they are labelled as such. e.g. the Manchester Stadium bombing, the Manchester synagogue attacks.

When they are attacks by disturbed, but not radicalised individuals, they are not labelled 'terrorist' attacks, e.g. the tragic Southport attack by Axel Rudakubana.

Do you see the difference?

Violent crime is analysed for its motivation, which is why when the father of this girl noted she was coming out with violent Reform ideology we now know that she was being radicalised into committing a hate crime.

Edited

the father of this girl noted she was coming out with violent Reform ideology

What violent things did she say to the father?

DoraSpenlow · Today 19:45

Backedoffhackedoff · Today 16:04

So the disabled Welsh woman with 4 kids stays homeless whilst people with less need than her are housed?

I'm sorry, but it depends where 'the Welsh woman' has come from. If she has been living in the housing association 's area for some time then yes, her need is greatest. But if she has been moved in from the other side of the country then I feel it is the responsibility of that local authority to ensure she is adequately housed. Not take a chance of a home away from someone who has lived in the area all their lives.

Anyway, we digress from the original topic.

moodbored · Today 19:46

YABU OP because this was reported on the BBC on the 26th September 2025 and on the 15th May (you just have to scroll to the bottom of the BBC page you posted to see that).

YABVU to think that just because you didn't hear about something, that it must mean it wasn't reported.

likelysuspect · Today 19:55

Clavinova · Today 19:27

the father of this girl noted she was coming out with violent Reform ideology

What violent things did she say to the father?

He didnt say that, he said she just mentioned a few things in line with Reform. He said she wasnt violent as far as I remember reading it.

tinytemper66 · Today 20:04

Male violence is primarily a scourge.

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