To not believe no dad is better

[NotConvincedd]

I often hear people say "no dad is better than a crap dad", and I'm not sure I completely agree.
What strikes me is that a lot of the people who say this then go on to explain that their child has an amazing stepdad who's raised them as his own. But that's not really the same as having no father figure at all, is it?
To be clear, I'm not talking about abusive fathers in those situations, no contact is obviously the better option. I'm thinking more about fathers who are unreliable, inconsistent, or just a bit rubbish.
My thoughts are that for many children, some sort of relationship is better than none. It's often said children who grow up with absent fathers tend to have worse outcomes overall, and most children seem to want a relationship with their parent, even if that parent isn't perfect. Being rejected or feeling unwanted can be incredibly painful and I think a lot of people are dismissive of how hurtful this can be.
AIBU to think that "no dad is better than a crap dad" is often too simplistic?

How do you make plans though? Ex was meant to have DC every Saturday, pick up at 10am. So i couldnt book anything for a Saturday. If I did he would claim i was stopping him seeing them. He refused to take them to clubs/parties. Then if he didnt turn up it was too late to do whatever I had wanted to plan.

Your ex partner is the very definition of a deadbeat dad though. Inconsistent contact followed by 3 years of no contact at all, not contributing financially towards the costs of raising his children… what is he, if not a deadbeat dad?

My parents split when I was 6m and divorced when I was 2 years old.
DM never prevented him from seeing me, he just wasn’t interested.
he conveniently went “on the sick” from work so he wasn’t forced to pay CMS so she received nothing from him toward my upbringing, at all!
he chose to only visit me 3 times a year - my birthday, Christmas and Easter with £20 and a card. Every year until I was about 15.
he never wanted to spend time with me, when he visited he would spend about 5 mins trying to talk to me, I would go off and play with my toys and he’d choose to try to talk to my DM, even with her reminding him that he was there to see me and not her…

She didn’t have a partner I was aware of until I was 17, so no “amazing stepfather” to raise me as his own. It was all on my DM (and her parents who babysat me)

I had no “father figure” and probably would’ve been better off not having a relationship with my dad that was based around 3 visits a year when he never lived more than 45 mins drive from us and always knew where I lived.

The thought of not being good enough for my dad to want to spend actual time with me was harder to understand than if he just hadn’t bothered at all.

we lost touch around my late teens when I rang him to borrow £10 and he said “you only call when you want something” and I replied with “at least I call you”
we had zero contact until he had an accident and someone gave me his number. He called from his hospital bed to tell me of his injuries and that he would call me back the next day… it never happened.

I was 30 when my DM died and he didn’t come to the funeral (despite having attended my DGM’s funeral 6 years previous) and he died 2 years ago. I have since found out he told people he had been told he wouldn’t be welcome at DM’s funeral - odd since I had no way of contacting him and I’m an only child!

so in my case, no dad would’ve been a lot better than a crap dad.

Not read all the posts so apologies if it's been said, but a lot of people will have voted you unreasonable because of the title, thinking you're saying you believe no dad is better than a bad one.
Yes, people should know their dads, for medical reasons, and because girls who have a good relationship with their dad are more likely to have positive relationships themselves, and boys are less likely to be violent.
Obviously, as you say, if you have a violent man who has left his kids black and blue, he shouldn't be living with them, but they have the right to know who he is.
There have been too many cases of people finding they are related to their date (because of not knowing their dad) for comfort. This has had serious consequences for people.

I get where you are coming from, but it is so complicated. For example my DP ex would call him a crap dad even though he is an excellent dad. I'm sure some people say things like 'no dad, is better than a crap dad' because they struggle to separate their relationship with that person over the relationship that person has with their children.

Obviously some dads are just shit dads. If you are a really shit dad, that is causing emotional damage, I'd say it's better not to have them around. Whether people who have experienced this feel differently I can't say.

I think the title is clear that she is saying she doesn’t believe that no dad is better. It literally says ‘to not believe no dad is better’.

It’s ok quite a
lot of the votes agree with me, more than the comments so there is clearly people that do agree

Because I would tell him we had plans that day and he can rearrange if he wants 🤷‍♀️ it’s allowed if no court order

I’m wondering why you came to AIBU? It’s clear you are sure that you’re not.

Well I was hoping someone would actually say something convincing enough to change my mind but no

The fact you’re raising children to accept the bare minimum, which will lead them to engage in unhealthy relationships themselves throughout their lives, isn’t enough?

No you weren’t. You were hoping everyone would agree with you so you could justify your decision to yourself.

Yes its "allowed" but my ex then told anyone who would listen that I wasn't letting him see them. Including them. So if i made plans I got abuse and upset DC when they saw him again and he told them he wanted to see them but I hadn't let them. Lucky you if your ex never does/ did this.

No he didn’t, see thats the difference my ex is not a bad man

Wanting a father for my kids makes me a bad mum ok 👍

My dad was shit. He was a dad, but not a parent.... if that makes sense.
I was fed up with his nonsense so went low contact. He went mad... thought I was accusing him of being a pedo. I was not. He was just... shit.
I saw him a few times each year, and each time he would prove he was immature etc. I do think he was autistic (and I say that as my DP is autistic too).

I wanted to talk things through with him. So many times. He would only reach out to me when drunk. Ask me to call him, then turn his phone off the next day.

Then earlier this year, he went out for a walk and dropped down dead. Got found in a park... traumatised a lot of kids and it was the talk of the local FB page.

Not seeing his DC for 3 years or paying for them makes him pretty shit IMO. A different shit to my ex, but still shit

I disagree. He abandoned his kids.

So op what you're saying is that you can break your back slogging to meet all their needs, put food on the table and a roof over their heads, cover their clothing and trips and hobbies, birthdays, Christmas etc etc etc with whatever little is left over for luxuries and maybe if you're lucky some of your own money to actually be used on yourself. And he gets to swan in as he pleases like a fucking Disney dad and use that money that he OWES you and his children to basically splurge and buy their affection to make up for not being around consistently or paying for them on a steady basis?

Surely you can see how this undermines you as their mother and sole provider and can also create a really dangerous and destabilising precedent for their relationship with him and by extension with you?

I've seen so many families where that's happened and when the kids hit teen years they suddenly decided they wanted to go to dad because he bought whatever they wanted and spoilt them which was much more fun than mum who was doing her utmost to make ends meet on a shoestring.

That's super naieve op I'm sorry.

I don’t know any single mum who didn’t work really hard to facilitate a relationship between children and their dad. Unless there is abuse.
I think you’re speaking to the wrong crowd here

But it’s not going to change thats the point so why get mad about it? They aren’t going to go live with him he has never even had them overnight, if they did they would soon run back when they realise he doesn’t even have beds for them.

So on the one hand you acknowledge that he doesn’t contribute financially and that’s not going to change, that he doesn’t even have beds for his own kids, that he abandoned them for 3 years with no contact whatsoever, and on the other hand you say ‘he’s not a bad man’. I’d hate to think what would constitute a ‘bad man’ to you. Your bar is in the gutter.

What if the child decides they don't want a crap dad? My teenage niece has nothing to do with her dad (she's seen him twice since he and her mum separated). It's totally his fault because his son from a previous relationship doesn't speak to him either. So just look at the common factor.
Both children are happier without their shit father in their lives.

My kids are teens/preteens and want to see him, if they didn’t I’d respect that