To expect Sunday as the agreement -update

[TipJarTroubadours]

I'm not sure if anyone actually wants an update, but I was reading another thread where an update was promised and I was disappointed to find that there wasn't an update. Then I remembered I was just as bad. Although I did feel a bit bruised being compared to a rapist.

Link to original thread below but I've also copied the first post in the next reply as I hate clicking on links.

The. Question on the original was really

Am I being unreasonable to expect my nephew to do what he agreed to in return for accommodation?

Well we all met at my parents at Christmas, my mum who initially thought I was BU, didn't realise that he wasn't paying rent in return for attending Sunday Lunch and was then cross at me for giving things away for free.

My parents then offered to help pay towards accommodation with no strings, but said it would have to come out of his inheritance - my sister didn't want this so it was agreed he would attend after Christmas.

He attended for three weeks and then stopped. I told my sister but said he could live here rent free until the end of the first year but that he can not come back in September. I'm not sure she believes that we will follow through.

For the avoidance of doubt we are not religious, and I guess this is no longer really an AIBU, as I don't think we are.

I think it is a strange arrangement and I’m not sure I’d be willing to commit to every Sunday for lunch. However, feeling like this I wouldn’t sign up for it if I wasn’t happy. So many people on here don’t agree with the arrangement and that is fine, just don’t sign up for it.

The issue here is that the nephew and family knew what the arrangement was and signed up to save money and now don’t want to fulfil their side. You don’t sign a lease on a flat and then decide you don’t want to pay which is tantamount to what they are doing. I would say, the nephew either pays the full market rate or finds somewhere else to live, as he has made it quite clear that he will not be going to the regular Sunday lunch. I wouldn’t even consider a promise that he will as he has shown that he won’t even when tackled about it so has no regard whatsoever for the arrangement.

It’s a weird rule but he agreed and then didn’t keep up his end of the bargain.

Id of charged a low rent or had him working on the site for his board.

Because you are buying him.

It’s weird and controlling.

But he agreed to it, so he should stick to it.

Most posts seem to be a combination of this one so I will answer these, but in a different order

Do you have a partner? What’s in it for them?

Yes, husband. It is his family tradition, he believes that this is the right thing to do

how many people do you regularly host? Between 10-15 normally, depends on who is home. Sometimes more, rarely less.

What do you usually cook?

In the winter, roasts and pies etc, summer is BBQ, Mexican, Salads, this week is lamb tagine and flatbread, but there are always other options. Everything is on serving dishes so can have what you want.

How big is your table? Seats 12 but have other room where we can seat 36 in separate tables

Do you take a register every Sunday? No

is this static caravan park like a commune?

No, all self contained apart from one meal a week, and that's only for those staying rent free.

Is there a religious or Cult element to this?
No, don't believe in God.

Do you run an MLM company? Gosh no! This is almost as bad as being called a rapist!

How long do the dinners last? Depends on what people have on. Some might be here for an hour, others much longer

What if one of the students are on holiday or not feeling well? It has never been an issue before now, not well, have an exam, tickets to a big game/concert then don't attend. But overall it is a commitment to attend.

Do you serve alcohol at these events? Yes, people tend to bring what they are drinking but soft drinks/table wine are always provided.

are you a good cook? Yes

Do they all finish their meals? I don't check, and as above they serve themselves - we don't have much waste so I guess they do.

What do you gain for this on a personal level?
We enjoy it.

For those that have complied in the past are you still in contact with them? Yes, all of them. I see most of them several times a year for dinner here as well as at theirs only geography prevents those that I no longer see in person (Australia and China)

My main one is “Why?”

Why do you want him every Sunday for dinner?

Whats in this for you?

And, again… Why?

It's hard to explain, from the last thread I still agree with this

It is the posters that have spoken about intergenerational wealth and how unfair that it is, plus the vulnerability of being a tenant that have actually hardened my viewpoint.
As I have said we have tenants that really do deserve a break, but they have to pay rent (again because we are not a charity) nephew only had this chance by birth, if he isn't willing to be part of the family set up then he has to pay rent or move.

We both work and manage the site, and like all adults have to make choices. I was very clear with both my sister and nephew what the deal was, he can bring a friend if he wants, and as batshit as it seems to some, this is the rent for the caravan.

We offer the caravans because we can, but there has to be a divide between those that stay for free and those that are renting. I do believe in family and family connections. There have been some good replies about what it means to be family.

Sunday works for us, it is the evening not lunch.

To the person saying it is outrageous to charge for a caravan, I think you need to visit some to see what they are like now.

I'm also surprised at the people that are so keen for me to start charging people to stay rather than keep my rule. I have shared this with the others that are staying and my niece who plans to stay in September - they certainly don't think that his behaviour should mean I stop it and they are all very happy with the set up.

As for rent in exchange for work, I don't want to be micromanaging or nagging for work to be completed. If as keeps being suggested he should mow the grass in return for rent, what happens when he doesn't do it? It would take up much more time than a meal once a week (which he can't even do) and would affect everyone else if it wasn't done.

You say in your previous post 'we enjoy it'.

Clearly when your nephew attended, he did not enjoy it. He does not want to be there.

How do you manage to enjoy the presence of a guest who does not want to be there? I see you think he should attend and you feel it's a fair exchange. But what specifically could you enjoy from a guest who is there under sufferance?

That twists it. There are lots of things we all have to do that we don't enjoy, I don't get some weird pleasure from making him do something - but if the exchange was mowing the lawns (which he would enjoy even less) everyone would be ok with it.

It isn't twisting anything. It goes against all the principles and point of hosting to have a guest who doesn't want to come. I just don't know how you could sit through the meal with him there knowing he doesn't want to attend. The thought of it makes me so uncomfortable that as a hostess it would ruin the experience for me. I don't know how it wouldn't be ruined for you even if he did start attending?

As I said this is the first time we have had issues after having this agreement for 15 others.

There are enough of us that is doesn't feel awkward, and actually when he was here it was fine, he gets on well with my son. He isn't not attending because he is awkward, but because he has never had to do anything he doesn't want.

I just don't know how you could sit through the meal with him there knowing he doesn't want to attend.

I don’t know if lots of posters are misunderstanding this, but OP has clearly stated many times that he doesn’t have to attend. He can pay rent. He’s not doing that either. How tolerant would you all be if you had multiple flats to let in a student town and one of the students refused to pay rent? I don’t see any difference here. His ‘rent’ is either cash or the time it takes to eat a meal and be sociable.

The only thing I find surprising from the OP is that she didn’t ask him to leave earlier due to non payment of rent.

I’ve used a quote from you @PinkSkiesLemonade but this isn’t specifically aimed at you, it’s the same comment lots of people have said.

He does not have to attend the meal. He could hand over cash each week and spend the entire year dodging OP but he didn’t want to.

His grandparents offered to pay but he said no, because he wants his inheritance in full 😵‍💫.

Thanks for answering the questions

Ok, I will just never get it. For me, the idea of cooking and serving a meal for a guest who wants to be somewhere else makes me cringe myself inside out. If I'm hosting, I want to feel like everyone is happy to be there. I don't see why this kid should get a free caravan, I just cannot understand why attending a weekly meal he doesn't want to is the price. I don't see what anyone in that scenario gets from it. If he worked in exchange for board or paid rent then I wouldn't expect him to enjoy those things either but enjoyment isn't the point of providing a service or paying money - that would be a transactional arrangement. But sharing a meal together is something all parties should enjoy or else why are you doing it?

If you were hosting Christmas for a lot of people, and the cost of it was far too much for you alone, you might divvy out the food eg one brings a cake, one brings trifle, one brings alcohol (obviously they would hopefully be equal-ish cost). But one person is flying in from abroad on Christmas Eve and cannot bring foodstuffs through customs and due to flight times that person cannot go to the shops before they close. The host might say ‘hey never mind, it’ll be good to see you’.

The next year they have the same system and the next year too. Then someone says ‘how come Mary never contributes? So you say ‘actually, good point, the amount we spend per person is about £10 for the few days.’

And Mary says ‘yes that’s fine, I’ll bring £10’. But she thinks to herself ‘fuck that shit’.

Resentment builds. You are now hosting 20 people and everyone contributes. But not Mary. She brings no food and no money and just takes advantage of everyone. She doesn’t have to make a particular effort, she doesn’t have to queue up at the shops, she just has to stick to the agreement of £10.

Do you genuinely think that is okay? Leaving all the expense to you?

This nephew (I think) doesn’t have to eat the meal. I’m not sure which part of that is so difficult to understand.

I just cannot understand why attending a weekly meal he doesn't want to is the price.

It’s not. There are two price points to choose from. He chooses neither.

When is he moving out? Has he got somewhere lined up to move into?

Well now he does as he knew the deal
Or let him and his family go and pay for somewhere else.

At the end of the month to go home for the holidays. He hasn't got anything lined up yet.

I am not willing for this to continue, my other students that rent pay either when their loan comes through or monthly, I'm just not sure I am happy for him to do this as I now no longer believe he will pay. But doesn't stop me feeling bad that he is currently uni homeless.

Stop feeling sorry for him, he’s brought this on himself. If he behaves this entitled at work they won’t tolerate him for more than a month or two.

Stay strong 💪!

When do you advertise for another student for his caravan?

Honestly I wouldn’t give him the option of coming back at all. He will let you down and it will make things worse. Just make sure he knows you won’t be having him back but hope he enjoys his new home.

He is definitely a cheeky fucker but it’s still an incredibly bizarre requirement. Both things can be true.

Yeah I get that, and I think paying rent makes perfect sense and is a normal arrangement. Your Christmas analogy is only analogous if Mary doesn't want to come and I'm insisting she joins us. And giving her the option of paying NOT to attend - but saying if she comes, she doesn't have to pay. That's the part I can't get past - that the OP wants a person at her table who doesn't want to be there. I see nothing wrong with expecting him to pay rent! But asking him to come to dinner in lieu of rent - I just don't know how she could enjoy his presence knowing he doesn't want to eat with her and the rest of the family.

The OP is teaching him something about commitment, keeping promises, family responsibilities - things that his own parents have clearly neglected.

I really don't agree. I don't think there is a lesson here, except that some people attach very strange conditions to their generosity. I imagine that rather than any lessons about family arising from this, there will just be a painful rift between the OP and her sister.

That might be the end result but it's due to the nephew not honouring an agreement and OPs sister just allowing it.