AIBU to expect boys in ladies' changing rooms not to stare?

[MoreNewThings]

I’m prepared to be told I’m over-reacting, unreasonable, etc.

Should mothers who bring their sons into a female changing room teach their boys not to stare at the women in there?

Scenario is a small-ish sports centre. There’s one changing room per sex, for all sports except swimming. One mother is there every week with two boys, helping them get changed for their sport. The younger one looks about 7, so probably needs the help. The older boy is about 9 or 10, and doesn’t need help. I get why she brings him in to the ladies. But he stares at the two adult women who are usually getting changed at the same time. I find it disconcerting, even though he’s only a kid. There are often little girls there too after their class, but it’s just the adult women he seems to stare at.

Today it was just the older boy there, but she still brought him into the female room even though he didn’t need help. The other woman tried to go slightly round the corner, and he shifted around so he could still see her. Mother was on her phone and oblivious.

Then another boy about 8 came in, with mother and sisters. He just sat and stared at me the whole time. I was pissed off by this point and gave him my evil glare but he kept staring.

I’m not sure why it makes me uncomfortable as they are only kids, but they are male kids having a good ogle at the adult female form, and no-one seems to be explaining that staring is rude. Or that as males in a female space they should be as unobtrusive as possible.

So the AIBU is, should the mothers teach the boys not to ogle women? In addition, should I speak to the mothers? And what would I say?

YABU - get over yourself, they’re just kids.

YANBU - yes, the mothers should be teaching their sons to respect women’s boundaries.

By 10, they shouldn’t be anywhere near the women’s changing room. I’m a single mum to two boys. I managed it. They don’t belong in the women’s changing room.

It's not just a gender issue, I've had girls stare at me too and it's equally unpleasant. Having said that I think my gym is 8 and older too.

The people saying boys over 7 should not be in the female changing room. I would not send my 8 year old son into the male changing rooms on his own, it wouldn’t feel safe for me, for a young boy to be around a group of unknown males. He does know not to stare at people. Would you feel uncomfortable if it was a 8 year old girl?

Accurate name. Not sure why you're being snappy with me I didn't say ten year olds should be in the women's changing.

I'm now curious about the reactions to the use of the word 'ogling', which I retracted in my last post. Is it only ogling when that is the intention of the one staring? Or is it ogling if that's how the subject feels they're being observed?

For full disclosure, I'm in my 60s so they're not looking at a gorgeous young thing, but I have kept a reasonably nice figure. The other adult women who get stared are 20-30 with amazing figures. We're doing a sport that's generally considered masculine, so that may attract curiosity, but the curiosity only occurs when we're in our underwear. As soon as we've got our kit on, it evaporates.

The little girls in the changing room don't seen to attract their attention at all.

@MoreNewThings The younger one looks about 7, so probably needs the help.

A 7 year old doesn't need help changing.

The older boy is about 9 or 10, and doesn’t need help. I get why she brings him in to the ladies.

They're not brought into the women's changing rooms for help. It's for safety.

Unaccompanied boys being in the men's changing rooms where old perverted men walk around naked is an issue.

If you were at my gym with an 8 year old boy you'd be expected to use the family changing room if you wouldn't send him into the male changing room.

@MoreNewThings The other adult women who get stared are 20-30 with amazing figures. We're doing a sport that's generally considered masculine, so that may attract curiosity, but the curiosity only occurs when we're in our underwear. As soon as we've got our kit on, it evaporates.

Do you seriously not know why they are looking? The likelihood is that they are heterosexual, so they are staring at women they find attractive.

There should be family changing cubicles for times like this!!

He is male and perfectly capable of getting changed by himself and if there were any issues then he could come out the changing rooms and speak to you or another adult! Also do you think every male is a peadophile? Don’t be ridiculous! Your child and your ocd helicopter parenting don’t take priority over the safety and comfort of the women and girls in the women’s changing rooms! Do you think it’s appropriate for a 7 year old boy to be in changing rooms watching young girls possibly from his class at school and other women undress and shower??!! Take him into the family changing room with you if they have one and if not then send him into the men’s

Re. girls staring. That doesn't bother me at all. In this particular case, the girls in the changing room have been doing a typically feminine activity, whereas I do a sport traditionally viewed as masculine. I see them observe me, sometimes hear them ask their mothers about me, and happily explain my sport to them. It never make me uncomfortable in the way that a staring boy does.

I would just go over to the parent and explain that her son staring at you getting dressed was making you and others in fact, feel very uncomfortable and it seemed to be an ongoing issue. It's not an unreasonable comment.

Don’t be ridiculous!!! Old perverted men?! How many of them are you classing that as? All of them? Get a grip

I think I do, but some other posters seem not to! I'm addressing their questioning of my use of the word 'ogling'.

@Nearly50omg Don’t be ridiculous!!! Old perverted men?! How many of them are you classing that as? All of them? Get a grip

How on earth can a man walking around naked in a changing room, where children are present, not be considered a pervert? Men's changing rooms are full of perverts.

Then you chuck a dry robe or a onesie on him, & take him home to shower, if you aren’t comfortable with him using the facilities provided for men & boys.

I get it - my ds is dyspraxic & couldn’t be relied on to emerge fully dressed in a sensible time frame until…well, he can probably manage it now at 21, but I wouldn’t guarantee everything is on right way round. He’s also always been a big chap so was getting side eyed in the women’s changing from about 5.

But women & girls are entitled not to have older boys in their changing spaces. Our spaces aren’t the solution here.

Lots of people on this thread talking very authoritatively about the age at which children stop needing help getting dressed. My 3yo girl typically doesn't need help. My 6yo boy typically does. No SEN or neurodivergence, he's just really uncoordinated and ends up with both legs in one trouser hole etc. Also incredibly distractible so he'd never actually finish getting dressed without me there herding him along.
The other kids in his swimming class are a similar age to him and almost all the boys need help getting dried and changed. Many of the girls don't.
That said, both my children know not to stare at or comment on other people's bodies.

I have a 12 year old son who has Sen so he can’t be alone so i have to take him with me-BUT I will always try to use the disabled toilet when possible and my focus is 100% on him so so if stop any staring as women shouldn’t have to deal with that at all. I’d go find the mother and remind her to parent her child.

If your son still cannot dress himself at 8/9, then that’s your problem to solve. It is not for other women to have him in their space. It is woman’s changing room.

There’s no way I’m allowing my 9 year old son into the men’s changing room by himself. I don’t trust men. He comes in with me.

My DS started a karate class just before he was 5yo ( they had a separate changing area for this ) but when he was older about 6-7) , he'd go straight into the Male Changing Area , no way would he have used the womens

There was no door , there were two offset walls so inside was no visible to outside . He knew just to go in, change , come out.
He wasn't stripping off completely like he would for swimming .

There was an age limit for boys in the womens changing .

How do you know that men's changing rooms are full of perverts? In any case women and girls shouldn't have to indulge your concerns.

Not in my gym he doesn't, unless you take him to the family changing room.

They couldn't reach the lockers in our place, well not unless they were exceptionally tall. There are family changing facilities, with individual cubicles, so everyone has privacy-just having a men area and a woman area might have been ok back in the days when it was expected all families would have a mum and a dad taking them. 11 year old boys have been harassed and assaulted in the mens, plus many people have disabilities and need more help from their parents than might be expected.

Your first two sentences - absolutely fine if that’s how you feel. Your third - well, probably not, if wherever you’re going has the usual age 8 & up not allowed in opposite sex changing facilities policy.

There are work arounds: just get him a dry robe & take him home in his swimmers. Or take him to pools etc that have family changing.