DSis says I'm awful for not letting her give DD14 a smartphone and that my gift for her is ridiculous, outdated and cruel.

[LuckyJadeMember]

DD14 is not allowed to have a smartphone. She uses a flip phone and has a thinkpad as well and is perfectly fine with it. Her birthday is next Sunday.

She likes to listen to music and the radio, but her phone doesn't have a music player so I bought a fiio music player on amazon, this one. It's 50 quid, and a nice blue colour. I also got her a case and screen protector for it.

I know what bands she listens to, so I went and bought some MP3 albums off bandcamp and amazon music, and put them on the MP3 player, and gave her a £100 bandcamp gift card too so she can buy some more music.

I also got her a nice portable canon as the camera on her phone is a bit naff, this one.

My sister met with me today because she wanted to show me what she got for her. It was an iPhone, the latest model. I said that she's not meant to have one, and that she won't be getting it so it'd be best to return it. It ended up in an argument, and DSis left the house angry. She called me later to yell at me and tell me how cruel I am for not allowing her to have a smartphone, and called me 'awful' and insulted my gifts several times.

AIBU?

Indeed they can but today’s 14 year olds are far more advanced now and so long as she is sensible what is the issue? You don’t seem to have much faith in her if you are assuming she will spend all her time on TikTok - maybe you should learn how to use parental controls and trust her not to access such sites?

Then don’t let her download tik tok.

My DD never asks for anything. She internalises everything, doesn’t make a fuss. Is your DD like that?

My concern would be that she would be left out from all the social arrangements that happen via messaging apps on smartphones. If you are the only one out of your group of friends that doesn’t have, what is now considered a very standard piece of equipment, that it would be isolating.

I don’t think smart phones are all bad anyway. I don’t let her have any social media on her phone but it’s so handy for lots of essentials

I guess you can survive without a smartphone, but it's going to be inconvenient and time wasting. Better to get a smartphone now and you work on healthy boundaries together, than her going nuts when gets she finally gets the technology. They don't have to be expensive, you can get them second hand, but she is a child of this century, and smartphones are going to be her future.

It's bonkers to think of her carrying around an MP3 player with a limited play of music since you've had to purchase, and a damn phone, and a camera, when all that and more could be in one device.

Quite.

If I'm honest, my friendships with people that aren't on WhatsApp/messenger etc, have tended to wane over the years. Not because of anything personal, or because I have a problem with them having a dumb phone, but because I can't include them in any group messages, and I invariably forget to send a separate one. So they don't get invited and stuff. Or if they do, and there's a change of plan for example, I then have to remember to update the WhatsApp and the other person. It's much easier just to send one group message.

IfI as a middle-aged mother get fed up on making special contact arrangements for people that I can't include in group messages, that's going to be 10 times worse for teenagers.

She asks a lot for the things she really wants.

In her friend group of 9, there are 2 other girls without smartphones, one who is part of the 'anti smartphone movement' and another who got inspired by dd, so they all text, call and use a messaging program you can use on a pc/browser too to chat and schedule meet ups.

Im not saying you can't survive without a smart phone, it just makes life easier and especially for a teenager. My daughter uses hers to track the bus timetable, for music whilst on the bus, to screenshot her location to me, if I ask for it. Not sure where you fly but all my boarding passes over the past few years have all been online, short and long haul. I don't bother to print out, to save trees and paper.

It all boils down to how well you've educated her about apps, tiktok etc...

When shes 18 and can afford a smartphone, you may have done her a disservice because she might be like a child being let loose in a sweetshop and you won't be able to control it then as she will be an adult. But, as I said, your child, your choice.

You bought her lovely, thoughtful presents. If she's not bothered I wouldn't buy her a smartphone. My daughter is 23 and a few of get friends have gone back to flip phones. She dug out my old camera and her friends were all interested in it and like putting their phones away when they go out and they take photos with DD's camera. Your sister is over stepping the line and is in the wrong. I hope she had a lovely day and loves what you have bought her 🎂

Dumbphones are getting more popular with young people, 3 coworkers I know by name (all in their 20s) switched to one over the past year. It's a 'movement' of sorts.

Not to mention that we were carrying this all around as kids and fine with it and far happier. You could go outside for a walk or go out with friends and be free of the stress of social media and all that shite and still take amazing pictures (better than on smartphones!) and listen to music and call home in case something happens.

@AnSpideog Yes, the social side is a consideration as teenagers do make most of their arrangements via messaging apps

@LuckyJadeMember I see your point, but do check with your DD that she’s able to keep in touch with her friends. Friendships are so important at 15.

Thanks for the kind words! and yep I've noticed they're becoming rather popular with young people, I have 3 coworkers in their 20s who recently switched to them.

Out of 9 girls, 3 use dumb phones in the friend group and are all keeping in contact over text, calls and messaging platforms you can use on a pc

It's fantastic if she hasn't asked for one

All kids now days seem to have one ( I mean from about 8 years old ) and it's ridiculous. Completely agree they end up like zombies OBSESSED with it.

And you can't monitor everything. It's all Snapchat and tiktok etc

It's a tough one because when I was growing up you had access to the Internet with phones and laptops etc but everything just seems different now . So many more creeps around

If she was actively nagging you for the phone I think it would be a different story

I do agree with PP - Don't want her left out with friendship groups etc

@LuckyJadeMember I had no idea that 2000’s technology was making a comeback!

It's getting rather popular especially with young people. Have a few younger coworkers as I mentioned earlier on this thread that use 2000s tech and basic phones!

My mum was a teacher
She taught 6-yr-old little bitty kids.

I can remember surprising her once during class and Mum introducing me:
”This is MY baby. She doesn’t LOOK like a baby, does she? But she’s MY baby.”

I think was 25 or 26, by then. Maybe older.

hahaha

You can also download safety apps on a smartphone for when she is out and about should she ever need help, they are not all bad

The phone has a sos button that when pressed thrice texts me and my husband with a link to her location that I can put into the computer and see where she is which works perfect so far :)))

You say your DD hasn't even really asked for one, stand firm in regards to your sister.
No means no.
Your parenting decisions are absolutely eff all to do with her, don't let her undermine you.
Let her have a hissy fit, leave her to it.

OP I wouldn't trust the opinion of a load of people typing through their smart phones at 1am. If you want to find a pool of phone addicted people you've come to the right place.

Your pressies sound lovely and thoughtful. If she hasn't asked for one for her birthday I wouldn't stress.

I would give your sister some breathing space and wait for her to come to you.

I am not sure why you posted. You clearly don't think you are being unreasonable.

your presents fro your DD look fantastic!

she is a lucky girl.

myDH still doesnt have a smartphone

My MH seriously declined throng smartphone use, amongst other thigns

Do you carry around a brick, an mp3 player and a digital camera like it's 2004? If you do well fine. Did you post this from your PC in your livingroom connected to your phone line too? I understand trying to protect your child but acting like it's the year 2000 and saying no to having a smartphone until working age is quite mental. How do you envisage she will keep herself safe if she hasn't been gradually introduced to social media etc with strict parental controls in place? How does she find her way to new places, is she printing maps off like we used to do? I use my phone for everything, not just doom scrolling, everything is on an app. The high school my kids will be going to homework etc is on a app that children access themselves. She'll have her own bank account soon, how will she keep tabs on her account? If I lose my bank card I can freeze my card immediately through my app. Traveling by bus/train, you can check ahead when they are due to arrive and time your journey around that, your train is delayed you can look what the hold up is etc and plan around it. If I need a taxi, I book on an app, I know exactly when it will arrive and what the car is so I know I am getting into the right taxi and not a random car. There's so so many things you might need a smart phone for as you move towards adulthood other than social media. Everything is geared towards smartphones, tickets for a concert they are sent to your phone now, and you must open them in the app to get in, you can't even produce a screenshot now nevermind present a paper ticket.

When i was younger I just didn't ask for certain things because I knew the answer was no (money related) it didn't mean I didn't want those nice things, I very much did, I just accepted I wouldn't get one so never asked. I imagine this is why your daughter doesn't ask, she has accepted you won't budge.

Really surprised at some of the defeatist responses

Smartphones can be so harmful especially before brains are fully developed. Your daughter sounds lovely and well adjusted, and she’ll have learnt from you that she can make her own choices in life rather than unquestioningly following what ‘everyone else’ is doing

I think you’re an inspiration!!

If she hasn’t asked for one, I think you’re right not to give her one (as long as you’re sure she hasn’t dumped a tonne of grief about it onto her aunt that you don’t know about!).

That said, I’m not sure that saying no outright is a healthy response to educating a child about technology. And you MUST educate your child about something that will only grow in importance in her life (the rest of the world will see to that). It’s easier for you to stick your head in the sand and just say no, but that would be like saying no to dating, or drinking alcohol at the relevant age. There are no shortcuts. You have to go through the hard yards of teaching yourself and then teaching her how to handles these things properly because right now you’re both ignorant and ultimately she’s going to go into the world unprepared.

And it’s not that difficult, really, if you see the gadget as a tool, not the content. Our DD (unlike her brother 🙄) is totally unbothered by tech. She’s always been able to take it or leave it. Rules are: put away by 8pm every night, no social media ever (she has WhatsApp with overseas family and friend, iMessage for local friends), not allowed in her bedroom. We have never once had to pull her up on any of these things (I used to check up periodically but no longer bother). Her dad has to give permission from his phone for her to download anything. She’s asked for a couple of things, we said no, end of story.

Does she go on her friends’ TikTok and Instagram? Of course she does. Has she seen porn and stuff I couldn’t bear for her to see on her friends’ phones? Undoubtedly. But it’s limited in time and there’s no scrolling for her - there’s literally nothing to scroll through on her phone. She’s far happier out with her friends to the movies, getting bubble tea, going shopping, going to a show - whatever. She’s a well adjusted, happy, academic, sociable teenager with a great group of friends. Tech doesn’t feature in her life any more than pay phones and landlines used to feature in mine at her age EXCEPT that she’s utterly fascinated by AI and LLMs. I think lots of teens 15+ find it fascinating and exciting. For my DD it ties into her love for sci-fi books / movies, and for language. For some of her friends it’s about accessing new worlds and capabilities that an analog life keeps out of their reach. I wouldn’t want to take this away from my DD - it’s their future much more than it’s ours and it’s here to stay. I’d rather she be its master than the other way round.

Her brother is another matter entirely and we will have to draw up different rules for him.